The Mopar controversy

[duhtroll]

I've spent some time over on the 300/Magnum site debunking some myths (NOT trolling) about our cars ever since we had some trolling over here.

I have heard everything over there about us or the MM -

"Just a CV" or "GM with exhaust"
The "rags" are apparently the bible for performance cars
The 300/Magnum have more room in them/ride better/handle better
Accord/Maxima/CAMRY can beat a MM
Even S/C a MM can only do 14.2 in the 1/4
MM not a muscle car
300/Magnum ARE muscle cars
MM just trying to copy Imp SS
MMs didn't sell because they are slow, ancient - and they were well-advertised
the MM is not a better value because of MSRP

http://www.dodgemagnum.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=1367

I am posting this to thank everyone who has helped me learn all of the stuff I've learned in the past year+ on this board. I THINK I have made us out to be decent, or at least stop most of the MM bashing going on.

We have had some misconceptions about their cars as well, as I have learned from reading over there. It should make for a fun meet if we ever get together. I have opened two invitations for some of them to show at our meets (but this is Iowa so who knows).

I did NOT post this for people to go over and troll, so please don't. I think I have calmed things down (except for one person over there, but he never will have a clue it seems). I joined to read about what they are doing to their cars and how they fare at the track, any problems they are having with their cars - first model year and all that, etc.. I just saw this thread over there and had to try to be reasonable. After all, it started because someone posted a thread from our site, so I wanted to be clear about things.

This is all just FYI for you guys who probably haven't read their site - you should read up on the competition.

Thanks,
-A

PS Edit - I reread that and it kinda sounds like I think you're all a bunch of hotheads. I don't. It's just sometimes tough to read some of this stuff and stay "calm" as it were. That's all. I think our board is very mature and reasonable by comparison to almost all others I have seen.

[Dr Caleb]

Thanks for walking the walk :)

Everyone gets passionate about their cars. I get defensive when people start trolling us, so I'm not going to troll them. I'll only care about those mopars if I think about buying one.

[FiveO]

Nice work... :up:

To each their own. I only get upset if people are being vindictive and or flat out lying.

Debunking myths is the best way to go.

[rayjay]

I really laughed at the one guy who begrudingly added the Mustang as a muscle car. Uhm, didn't the Mustang start the whole pony car craze back in "65" ?:lol:

[Bluerauder]

Maybe you should add "Peacemaker" to your many talents. I see that you try to be fair and balance in dealing with folks as well as in your "Test Drive" reviews. Great job!!!

[marauder307]

Blah.

I linked over and "stealth"-looked at it. It strikes me that no one here posts such uninformed and juvenile opinions about other marques---so what gives them the right?

So they got a station wagon with a truck engine in it. Still waiting to be impressed here...and from at least one other cross-linked thread I've seen on this board, the truck engine's got its own problems. The things that motivated me to the MM are its (mostly) proven design (I think only the Tokico components hadn't actually been used somewhere else), and the time-honored sturdiness of the sum of the products.

And I used to be a Mopar guy! Was madly in love (still am!) with the late 60's/early 70's A, B, and E bodies; if I could get my hands on one, I'd never let it go. But Chrysler hasn't really produced anything exciting since the last Barracuda/Challenger combos rolled out in 1973-74. I'll make a notable exception for the L'il Red Trucks and the '79 Hurst 300s--but even those were nothing more than Cordoba knockoffs. The Viper and Prowler showed some promise; but the Prowler's gone and the Viper's out of reach for common folks like me. I had hope a few years back, when the prototype new Charger was revealed---but then it vanished and hasn't been seen since (woulda bought one, but you can't get something that isn't physically there). When my '85 Dodge Charger (think K-car with a hatchback body) went dead on me at a bad moment back in '93, it was a Mustang LX 5.0 that saved the day. I went to Ford, never looked back, and haven't been unhappy since.

So they got a station wagon with a truck engine in it. Guess the soccer moms are happy now...and the henpecked husbands who get to share the driving duties. Whoop-de-doo. :shake:

[THE_INTERCEPTOR]

It's amazing how many of those guys think that the Marauder is just a CV with exhaust...LOL!

Not trying to argue with anybody, but those guys might wanna get their facts straight. There is a BIG difference in power between the 4.6 SOHC Crown Vic engine, and the 4.6 DOHC Marauder engine...

So to call a Marauder a "badged up" Marquis is a :nono:

[THE_INTERCEPTOR]

Duhtroll, I have to give you some credit man. You took a pretty good lashing from some of the guys over, but you never let up. Good man.

Also, it seems like there are a lot of good guys over on that board. Not all of them are bashing the MM.

I for one don't mind the 300C, but I like the Magnum better. Either way, you've gotta respect what they're runnin' under the hood :up:

[TripleTransAm]

Well done, dude.
There are quite a few open-minded folks on that board with attitudes I like... and I hope that we can band together to increase the focus on large-sized RWD performance sedans pushing the technological and performance envelopes. Who knows, maybe one day Ford will wake up and see a market in the large RWD performance segment and re-enter the battle... what is proclaimed today can easily be overturned tomorrow.

[Slowpoke]

I took a quick look and also was quite surprised about much of the mis-information that was over there.

Seems like the MM crowd seems to be a bit more interested in facts than hype.

oh well.....

[TooManyFords]

Andrew, you forgot to tell them -where- we are racing on the 7th!

Yes, you did make me read the whole thread so maybe I missed it.

Cheers!

john

[duhtroll]

It's been taken care of :D

[Tallboy]

nice job. proper attitude. a nice mix of facts and personal preferences. let's see how many show up at the track.:burnout:

[CRUZTAKER]

I'm not even gonna go over there....cause I would wind up mouthing off.:P

What I do know however, is unless those folks ALL bought hemis (which few of them have), and even then...I would make every attempt to CRUSH them all with my N/A Marauder.:cool:

[bigslim]

And you can Barry.

[Petrograde]

I actually registered over there, since I'm thinking about getting a V6 Magnum for my wife. So far,... most of 'em have been cool. They've answered my newbie questions without grieve.

[RCSignals]

It's amazing how many of those guys think that the Marauder is just a CV with exhaust...LOL!

Not trying to argue with anybody, but those guys might wanna get their facts straight. There is a BIG difference in power between the 4.6 SOHC Crown Vic engine, and the 4.6 DOHC Marauder engine...

So to call a Marauder a "badged up" Marquis is a :nono:

If they actually got their facts straight, they'd probably be here saying they just bought a Marauder.

[RCSignals]

Thanks for your work there Andrew.

If you remember way back, the same happened with many of the Impala guys who came here, and on their own boards.

Some of them will never get it right.

Many of those posting there likely just dream of being able to own a "Hemi" powered 300 or Magnum anyway.

[Joe Walsh]

I just read the MM thread on the 300/Magnum website...I don't know how you kept your cool, but good work in trying to DISCUSS things with them. Personally I LIKE the fact that almost everyone thinks that the MM is SLOW (CAR & LIAR). I had a friend who saw my car and said "Nice looking car, but a Honda Accord can beat you". These false perceptions have lots of knuckleheads and the omnipresent RICERS lining up to race me in my MM. :D :D :D They all go home and :bigcry: :bigcry: :bigcry: !!

[BillyGman]

What made me laugh is how one of them made a comment about some ricer car (Might have been a Maxima, I dunno, they're all the same to me) must be quicker in the 1/4 mile since the magazines claim that it has a faster trap speed.:baaa: That guy obviously knows very little about drag racing, and understands next to nothing about how different cars accelerate. Certain cars will have better ET's in the quarter even though their trap speeds are slower simply because they accelerate better in the first 1/8 mile.

My 73 Vette for instance ran a 13.48 ET with a 110MPH trap speed, while my Marauder ran two consequtive 12.2 ET's, and both of them with a 107 MPH trap speed. my Marauder simply runs better in the initial 1/8th mile, and has better 60' times and 330' times than my Vette did. So just because a ricer car has a better trap speed (that is IF you want to rely on the magazines) doesn't neccessarily mean that it's faster than a Marauder in the quarter. it all has to do w/where in the RPM band each engine is making most of it's power increases, and how the transmission and final drives are geared.

[duhtroll]

Well, Billy, you're in luck. This guy is on our board as well. Maybe you will get to "discuss" this (read: school) him on this subject. He seemed to know an awful lot about Marauders from those magazines and commercials he saw, which is all he was using to deride our cars. If you read the thread you know who I'm referring to.

Next time he shows up you can have some fun. :D

-A

PS Edit - this is the same guy who also said the Camry is in the same class performance-wise, among other things.

[duhtroll]

You know, I never thought about it this way but I like that as well. Kinda. I don't "race on private tracks" a lot, but I've had several moments. The hard part is dealing with people who talk with no walk.

You know what else I like? Most of them Hemis aren't doing better than 14.2-14.4 in the 1/4. I can do that (and for less $). What a shame it would be if one of them were to lose to a MM! According to the hype we have nothing to lose in that race. I love being the underdog.

-A


I just read the MM thread on the 300/Magnum website...I don't know how you kept your cool, but good work in trying to DISCUSS things with them. Personally I LIKE the fact that almost everyone thinks that the MM is SLOW (CAR & LIAR). I had a friend who saw my car and said "Nice looking car, but a Honda Accord can beat you". These false perceptions have lots of knuckleheads and the omnipresent RICERS lining up to race me in my MM. :D :D :D They all go home and :bigcry: :bigcry: :bigcry: !!

[BillyGman]

Well, Billy, you're in luck. This guy is on our board as well. Maybe you will get to "discuss" this (read: school) him on this subject. He seemed to know an awful lot about Marauders from those magazines and commercials he saw, which is all he was using to deride our cars. If you read the thread you know who I'm referring to.

Next time he shows up you can have some fun. :D


Hey, bring em on!!!!

[TripleTransAm]

As with the Impala-Marauder debates, the best (and in my opinion only) way to settle the performance debate is to line 'em up, side-by-side, at the track and see which one trips the win light. Pure and simple. The numbers won't lie, and you won't have debates over racing conditions, ambient temps, track grip, tailwinds, downhill tracks, etc. Sure, we should keep it honorable and compare cars on equal footing (ie. stock vs. stock, mods vs. mods, etc.)...

Until that happens, we can argue until we're blue in the face / fingers...

Recall the little teenagers who visited our board a few months ago and went as far as claiming my car didn't exist when I claimed my 14.56 was off a bone-stock 2003 Marauder...

[BlackHole]

As with the Impala-Marauder debates,

Recall the little teenagers who visited our board a few months ago and went as far as claiming my car didn't exist when I claimed my 14.56 was off a bone-stock 2003 Marauder...



And all 5/6 Impy SS around my area wanted a piece of me until they seen my 14.97 stock timeslip. Now they'er all gone. :shake: :shake: Except for a friends 96 DCR but he even said no Stock SS seen that kind of time AND HES A BOWTIE through and through kind of man. Now most of his other cars can beat me up pretty well but thats what the Lightnings for.