End of Panther platform?

[RCSignals]

From Autoweek (http://www.autoweek.com/cat_content.mv?port_code=autow eek&cat_code=carnews&loc_code=index&content_code=02589957)


Ford to reduce number of North American vehicle platforms; cost-cutting, market speed efforts cited

Ford Motor Co. plans to trim the number of North American vehicle platforms from 16 to 12 in the next seven years. The reduction is part of sweeping changes to the automaker's product development organization that aim to cut costs and speed products to market.

The company also plans to cut powertrain combinations by an undetermined amount and shrink product development times about 25 percent, says Phil Martens, Ford vice president of vehicle product development and engineering. He has a new title under the Ford reorganization.

New vehicles take 18 months to 27 months from design freeze to introduction, Martens says. "We have to get down to the neighborhood of 14 to 22 months."

Product plans are fairly set into 2006, so vehicles developed under those faster times should start to appear in mid-2006 or later, he says.

Martens, 42, joined Ford more than 15 years ago as an engineer and rose steadily through the ranks of product development and engineering in the United States and Europe. He joined Ford's Japanese affiliate, Mazda Motor Corp., in 1999 and led its product planning efforts before returning to Ford in North America in 2002.

Fewer platforms cut costs because the company achieves greater economies of scale on high-volume platforms. But it also means Ford must develop so-called flexible platforms that can carry various models, such as sedans, coupes, wagons and others.

With that flexibility and by working with suppliers to share more components, Ford can reduce North American product development costs 10 percent annually, Martens thinks. He didn't provide figures for current spending and expected savings, but he did say that Mazda reached annual cost reductions of more than 20 percent through similar means.

The new approach in North America in part is modeled after Mazda's efforts. Ford North America is behind both Mazda and Ford of Europe in product development speed and use of more flexible platforms with common components, Martens says.

Ford will move to four platform groups to develop sets of similar vehicles, rather than the five brand-oriented groups used previously. The previous group themes were Tough Trucks; Outfitters; Family; Lifestyle and Youth; and Lincoln Mercury.

The changes, made Wednesday, Feb. 19, cap a year of adjustments to Ford's North American product development organization. No job cuts are planned, though the changes do mean new positions for some of Ford's 14,000 North American product development employees.

Says Martens: "The aim here is quite simple: it's to increase our productivity, and the goal is to get products sooner."

[prchrman]

Could be the end with mazda (oh yuck) training back ground the new guy has had...maybe they can bring on Meo or maybe Maturn or some other am-jap cross...like GM

[MAD-3R]

Some of the "Platforms" to go are the current Mustang, and the Taurus/Sable. Both are going to the DEW platform used by Mazda 6 and T-Bird. I think it will also be used in the new MiniVan, and possable the escape.

[prchrman]

Mazda 6, rented one...would have rather have rode a fast wheelbarrow... uncomfortable is a understatement...we be a dieing breed...

[derek77]

So, this sound like a good chance the Ford Fairlane/LTD will come over from the big pond. Makes since to me. It's all about the bottom dollar. And those car could bring in some money for Ford.

Before I keep going on and on, is the Australian Fairlane/LTD on the panther platform? I couldn't find out anywhere.

[Macon Marauder]

Originally posted by derek77
So, this sound like a good chance the Ford Fairlane/LTD will come over from the big pond. Makes since to me. It's all about the bottom dollar. And those car could bring in some money for Ford.

Before I keep going on and on, is the Australian Fairlane/LTD on the panther platform? I couldn't find out anywhere.

I'd love to see some Fords from down under show up on our shores. I think I remember reading somewhere that Aussie Fords are unique and share little with their North American cousins. In other words, No.

[derek77]

Well in that case, I see a shared global platform with Australia, the Mid-East, and Europe. Damn, I hope I'm right.

[mtnh]

Only good things will happen if the panther lineup starts building on the DEW platform. You get to keep rear wheel drive while gaining independent rear suspension, passive 4-wheel steering, a superb handling package with the focus on a close to 50/50 weight distribution front/rear. All good stuff! If you've driven a Lincoln LS, you've experienced the DEW98 platform.

Mike
2003 MM
2000 LS6M

[LincMercLover]

My sister has a 2001 LS, and it is smooth on the highway, and pretty damn quick. But I can't see a body like my MM's fitting on this frame, much less doing WELL on this frame...

The LS is nice, but still too small for my tastes. I can frequently feel my hair brush the headliner... :shake:

[beemer]

Originally posted by mtnh
Only good things will happen if the panther lineup starts building on the DEW platform. You get to keep rear wheel drive while gaining independent rear suspension, passive 4-wheel steering, a superb handling package with the focus on a close to 50/50 weight distribution front/rear. All good stuff! If you've driven a Lincoln LS, you've experienced the DEW98 platform.

Mike
2003 MM
2000 LS6M

Hi Mike:

In all fairness I have a friend with an Lincoln LS and IMHO opinion a great car for those under 6 ft. LOL I fit but found it hard to get comfortable. I have found my Marauder to be a great fit, in fact the seats are far superior to the '01 CV LX Sport that the Marauder replaced. I attempted to find a comfort level in a new T-bird at the dealer and that wasn't happening either. What will tall/big people like myself do once they downsize all the sedans? Step "up" to a large SUV? I think not!

Best,

Paul:D

[RCSignals]

Originally posted by mtnh
Only good things will happen if the panther lineup starts building on the DEW platform. You get to keep rear wheel drive while gaining independent rear suspension, passive 4-wheel steering, a superb handling package with the focus on a close to 50/50 weight distribution front/rear. All good stuff! If you've driven a Lincoln LS, you've experienced the DEW98 platform.

Mike
2003 MM
2000 LS6M

I have driven the Lincoln LS V8 with sport handling, and quite frankly, the 2003 Panther handles just as well, if not better, and is far more comfortable.

The weight ratio of the Panthers is already close to 50/50. It may even be closer than the Lincoln LS is

[RCSignals]

It may be nice if Ford brings the Australian Falcon here. They are however not a good replacement for the Panther.
Hopefully Ford will keep the Panther and keep refining the Platform. Probably the biggest mistake they made for 2003 after all the suspension changes was not giving the body a few more distinctive changes.
Ford is just too concentrated on their Truck line

[CRUZTAKER]

Originally posted by RCSignals
I have driven the Lincoln LS V8 with sport handling, and quite frankly, the 2003 Panther handles just as well, if not better


UHHHH..................., NO!


Keyword: "HANDLES"

[mtnh]

Points well taken. However, I wasn't saying that the LS car body was going to replace the panther bodies, just that with multiple uses for a similar platform, the underlying platform is going to bring these cars up in terms of modernization. The 2004 Mustang is going to a DEW platform, no? Heck, look at the original minivans, they shared the same platform as a K-Car, yet the people tube was as different as could be. I don't see a problem with being able to make a town car or a vic out of a new platform, preserving all of the creature comforts for our 5-XL -sized crowd that really needs the space. :^) And you're right, the handle on the MM is close to the LS. Somehow, however, the LS feels alot more predictable in a 4-wheel drift. Plus, the seats of an LS hold you in place alot more firmly than the MM, and if you have room between your hips and the door and console, it's hard not to have a little bit of your own drifting going on in the seats. (of the MM) Again, the MM seems designed for a more "robust" clientele. Getting back on track here, I am positive that the interior space of a panther car could be had on a DEW platform.

Mike

[WolfeBros]

I drove the Lincoln LS V8 for three years before I bought the Marauder.
It is a nice car but boring. It sits lower, has almost perfect 50/50 weight distribution and handles good. The Marauder for its size handles extremely well and still gives a civilized ride. They are too far apart to compare.......apples & oranges, but if you insist. Bang for the buck, power, room, handling, trunk space, interior room, interior storage and muscle car feel. You can't beat the MM. At least today anyway. The Marauder feels alive when you drive it. It gets plenty of looks and stares and is pretty well mannered considering its weight. The Marauder is definitely not boring to drive. I felt that the LS while a good car was still boring. IMHO

[CRUZTAKER]

Wolfe:

Agreed....the LS is mommies, she loves it. Personally, I never fell IN LOVE with it, but had some fun. It WILL do nearly 140, but yes, too small. Very nimble though. I have a surprise for the wife, one of Dennis' associated is gonna flash the eec for me. I am not gonna tell her. Just see if she notices. :)

[RCSignals]

Originally posted by CRUZTAKER
UHHHH..................., NO!


Keyword: "HANDLES"

Sorry but I have to stand by that, in my experience with it.
It only applies to the 2003 suspension changes to the Panther though and the car must be a MM, PI, or CV/GM equipped with HPP.

[Beadhead]

Article in latest Car and Driver implies that the new Mustang will NOT be based on the DEW platform, per interview with FMC staff. Seems the DEW platform is (a) too heavy and (b) too expensive for Mustang duty. Personally, I can't see the Panther platform going away for a few years, since FMC still has to recoup its investment in the 03 mechanical updates from future production. Don't expect to see a MM on a "refreshed" or reskinned Panther platform, though.

[RCSignals]

Don't expect to see a MM on a "refreshed" or reskinned Panther platform, though.

Yes, the declared "until" date for the MM pretty much coincides with the supposed "body redo" date for the CV/GM line, so you are most likely correct

[mdmarauder]

I had a 2001 LS V8 Sport two cars before my MM. I have to say it was the best handling car I've ever owned. The Negatives? Small interior, no low end torque, sits too low (I'm 5'8), boring looking exterior. I have to say I love my MM and it handles great but not better than my old LS. I think the MM is a great deal for the money, nothing else like it. Sorry, but I had to say my part.

[Bigdogjim]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by RCSignals
[BFord is just too concentrated on their Truck line [/B][/QUOTE

Looks that way but, Chevy canceled the SS in '96 to build trucks. Ford has enough factory space to build trucks. For 26 years the F-series has been #1 in sales. Put yourself on the hot seat and think what you would spend on to keep the truck leader fresh, and selling well? I personal do not see the currant panther going away soon. (IMHO)
Big Dog

[RCSignals]

Originally posted by mdmarauder
Sorry, but I had to say my part.

Don't be sorry. We are all here to say our part. :)

[vaderv]

From what I've read, pursuant to another post here and in some magazines frames are making a comeback, especially in europe. The claim is that they can bake the cars cheaper because multiple car lines can be built on the same chassis. So I guess we'll see.