Formula 1 Grand Prix of the United States... what a joke

[Fourth Horseman]

I know there's a few other F1 fans around here, so I wanted to see what you all thought about that fiasco at the US Grand Prix today. Myself? I'm about done with this sport. I've watched it consistantly since about '94 and every year it gets worse. It's too over-regulated by the FIA with rules that seem arbitrary and pointless. And now this? All the Michellin tired cars refuse to race? What about all those fans in the seats that paid to watch a race? I hope nobody shows up to this damned race next year.

:censor: Formula 1, man. What a joke. Time for me to go get into CHAMP car and IRL I guess. :shake: :down:

[TAF]

I always love how the F1 folks make fun of NASCAR going "around in circles"...

Well....I enjoyed the NASCAR race today MUCH more than the "time trials" I saw in Indy today :lol: :lol: :lol:

How 'bout them Roush Boys?:banana2: :banana2: :banana2:

[Redster]

Everyone but Ferrari agreed to allow the change from what I read on another site. No surprise to me. Not sure how that fits in with what the FIA said. If Ferrari had gone along, I wondered what would have happened. The fans got screwed but I don't blame the teams for not racing with unsafe tires. We need someone from the U.S. in F1 like Shelby who said "I'll have Ferrari's ass".

[Dr Caleb]

Everyone but Ferrari agreed to allow the change from what I read on another site.

I heard that too. I don't blame Michelin, they would have raced if it weren't for points (with the chicane). FIA didn't want to penalize Bridgestone for Michelin not bringing intermediate tires to the track. But it was the drivers who were in danger out on the track from flying water bottles and beer.

They should have run the race without the two Ferraris, instead of without 14 other cars. It's about the fans, not the team owners egos. I doubt next years race will be as successful.

Luckily there was a CART race on right after, and in 28 days, a CART race right here I can go see.

[MarauderMike]

In F1 it's all about egos. I'm also quite sure the driving talent selected is based on how much sponsorship cash they can bring with them to the seat.

[Bluerauder]

I know there's a few other F1 fans around here, so I wanted to see what you all thought about that fiasco at the US Grand Prix today.

This was a safety issue with the Michelin tires. Ralf was injured seriously last year. There were two wrecks due to tire failure during Friday's time trials. Hang the blame on this to the F1A who refused to adjust to a serious safety concern either by installing the chicane or allowing Michelin to bring in new rubber. Michelin tried to work within the association. But the F1A was inflexible. In this case, the rules should have allowed a change for safety sake. Unfortunately, the fans got screwed and the US race is seriously tainted. :o

With cars and with racing, there are some things that you don't skimp on -- one is brakes and the other is tires. :nono: I don't blame the drivers for pulling off after Michelin said their tires were not safe for the race.

Here's an extract from the story .....


"The event was in jeopardy from the start because Michelin advised the seven teams it supplies that its tires were not safe to race through the high banked final turn at Indy.

The world's largest tiremaker worked endlessly with the teams to try to persuade the FIA, the series governing body, to make allowances that would ensure the 14 drivers using Michelins would be safe. "

[Rob1559]

I enjoy F1 when I get to see it. It is auto racing at the highest level. After reading an article about the situation at Indy it is clear that FIA, read that as Bernie Ecclestone, has no concern for driver safety. Ecclestone is to racing as Don King is to boxing. He just cut his own throat with US racing fans today. The guy is a pompous blowhard only interested in his bank roll. In a way he is a lot like Tony George who ruined the Indy 500. Had this happened in Europe those fans would have torn the place down. Bernie got his money and left town.

[cyclone03]

Well I think today was the FIA at their highest penicle.
They stuck to the rules as writen.
It's not the FAI's fault Michelin didn't bring the proper tire to the race.
It's not up to the Bridgestone teams to allow a major rule change hours before the start of a race they where all prepared for.
Add a chicane?That would unfairly penelize the bridgestone runners.
Allow tire changes during the race? The rules are allready in place for that,and the Michelin guys could have done that but they didn't know how long the tires would last,5 laps at speed,15,20? Who knows.They never TESTED for that.
And thats my point.
TESTING!!!


Did Firestone/Bridgestone gain an advantage today from Indy 500 tire test?
I'm sure they did and good for them.
Do you think ANY team in F1 would give up a hard earned advantage to another team,would you exspect them too?

If the F1 circuit at Indy is that hard on tires,which it is, why do we not have an F1 tire test here?Too far to travel?Limited value? They say that is the only banked turn in F1,I don't think thats true.They say it's the fastest corner in F1,I think Hockinheim has faster turns.(as well as the new track in Melasia).

The bottom line is the 3 teams running Bridgestone tires today were ready for the start of the USGP at the scheduled time,on the APPROVED TRACK, the Michelin teams were not.
The choice to set out was theres.They tried to bully the FIA and lost.

The sad thing to me was OUR fans thoughing crap on the track.
Whats up with that?
The drivers on the track are doing what they came to do.
I also was unimpressed when the Holman Family did not present the trophies after the race.

F1 is not NASCAR,thank god,they ran todays race by the book.

I just hope the FIA doesn't turn around and try to blame the Indy track then refuse to come back.

[BK_GrandMarquis]

Well I think today was the FIA at their highest penicle.
They stuck to the rules as writen.
It's not the FAI's fault Michelin didn't bring the proper tire to the race.
It's not up to the Bridgestone teams to allow a major rule change hours before the start of a race they where all prepared for.
Add a chicane?That would unfairly penelize the bridgestone runners.
Allow tire changes during the race? The rules are allready in place for that,and the Michelin guys could have done that but they didn't know how long the tires would last,5 laps at speed,15,20? Who knows.They never TESTED for that.
And thats my point.
TESTING!!!


Did Firestone/Bridgestone gain an advantage today from Indy 500 tire test?
I'm sure they did and good for them.
Do you think ANY team in F1 would give up a hard earned advantage to another team,would you exspect them too?

If the F1 circuit at Indy is that hard on tires,which it is, why do we not have an F1 tire test here?Too far to travel?Limited value? They say that is the only banked turn in F1,I don't think thats true.They say it's the fastest corner in F1,I think Hockinheim has faster turns.(as well as the new track in Melasia).

The bottom line is the 3 teams running Bridgestone tires today were ready for the start of the USGP at the scheduled time,on the APPROVED TRACK, the Michelin teams were not.
The choice to set out was theres.They tried to bully the FIA and lost.

The sad thing to me was OUR fans thoughing crap on the track.
Whats up with that?
The drivers on the track are doing what they came to do.
I also was unimpressed when the Holman Family did not present the trophies after the race.

F1 is not NASCAR,thank god,they ran todays race by the book.

I just hope the FIA doesn't turn around and try to blame the Indy track then refuse to come back.

My thoughts exactly.

[Vortex]

I dont blame FIA, Ferrari, Bridgestone (or Jordan/Manardi either!) I think this goes right on Michelin for not doing their homework for this race. Track configuration has been the same for years so there is no excuse. I feel bad for the 6 guys running the race with the boos and beercans thrown at them, hell they were doing what they were supposed to do. I also think it was BS for Williams, BAR and the rest to pretend they were going to start then pull off. What a bunch of pu____ies. Id love to find fault with Tony George but hey, this makes Indy look bad and I feel sorry for him but most of all to the fans who paid their money to go to this. No wonder F1 has a hard time in the US.

[jdando]

Well I am not sure what to think.

The race seemed like some bad dream, it just was not right.

I do not know who is at fault, but I do know the Fans in the stands and the TV fans got ripped-off. I would be very upset if I payed $130 to see the Ferrari parade.

I think F1 has lost a large portion of it's US fan base.

jeremy disappointed in minnesota

[Dr Caleb]

... Bernie Ecclestone, has no concern for driver safety. Ecclestone is to racing as Don King is to boxing.

:up:

I heard a quote from this weekend from him. When asked what he thought of the IRL rookie, Danica Patrick (mmmmm), he said '...I don't think she would make it in F1 . .. I think she should be wearing white like the other kitchen appliances"
:eek:

Niiice!

[Redster]

For those that don't know, this isn't the first time that Ferrari has taken the opportunity to beat it's competitors off the track by using the FIA.

In 1964 Carroll Shelby's Cobras had a real shot at the FIA manufacturers GT championship. The last race of the year was at Monza, Italy. Enzo Ferrari arranged to have the race cancelled as the Cobras had the opportunity to gather enough points for the championship. This was an FIA sanctioned event and their complicity was necessary.
In 1965, Shelby won the championship hands down. He has revealed in interviews that Ferrari ran their cars with illegal engines (oversized) in 1965 and still lost. The engines where ignored by FIA inspectors throughout the series. Shelby knew they had the illegal engines but did nothing.
In 1966 and 1967 Ford GT teams led by Shelby (there were other teams as well, but Shelby's team won) won the LeMans 24 hour race 2 years in a row. They were powered by the 427 (7 litre) Ford engine.
Someone (Ferrari) influenced the FIA to ban engines larger that 5 litres after 1967 making the 427 Ford GT illegal. Actually, Ford might have been ready to quit anyway. But their car was now illegal.
1968 - Guess what? In 1968 a 5 litre Ford GT won the race.
1969 - What next? Impossibly against the odds, THE SAME Ford GT that won in 1968 won the race in 1969.

[cyclone03]

For those that don't know, this isn't the first time that Ferrari has taken the opportunity to beat it's competitors off the track by using the FIA.

In 1964 Carroll Shelby's Cobras had a real shot at the FIA manufacturers GT championship. The last race of the year was at Monza, Italy. Enzo Ferrari arranged to have the race cancelled as the Cobras had the opportunity to gather enough points for the championship. This was an FIA sanctioned event and their complicity was necessary.
In 1965, Shelby won the championship hands down. He has revealed in interviews that Ferrari ran their cars with illegal engines (oversized) in 1965 and still lost. The engines where ignored by FIA inspectors throughout the series. Shelby knew they had the illegal engines but did nothing.
In 1966 and 1967 Ford GT teams led by Shelby (there were other teams as well, but Shelby's team won) won the LeMans 24 hour race 2 years in a row. They were powered by the 427 (7 litre) Ford engine.
Someone (Ferrari) influenced the FIA to ban engines larger that 5 litres after 1967 making the 427 Ford GT illegal. Actually, Ford might have been ready to quit anyway. But their car was now illegal.
1968 - Guess what? In 1968 a 5 litre Ford GT won the race.
1969 - What next? Impossibly against the odds, THE SAME Ford GT that won in 1968 won the race in 1969.

Great story Redster,and all true but,
Ferrari had nothing to do with Michelin not providing their contracted teams good safe tires for the 2005 USGP.

[Rob1559]

I believe that The FIA is wrong. When Michelin discovered a problem they asked for a solution and that was denied. I really do not believe that the FIA/Ecclestone care if F1 is even again in the US.
Remember that it seems that the FIA has an attitude about the US and US drivers. Think back to when Michael Andretti went to F1. He was the teammate of Ayrton Senna on the best team in F1. Andretti was really driving well and was deemed a threat in Europe. What did the FIA do? They severely curtailed practice laps during preseason and the week of the race. Andretti had to basically learn the courses during the races. He did not stand a chance.

[Joe Walsh]

For those that don't know, this isn't the first time that Ferrari has taken the opportunity to beat it's competitors off the track by using the FIA.

In 1964 Carroll Shelby's Cobras had a real shot at the FIA manufacturers GT championship. The last race of the year was at Monza, Italy. Enzo Ferrari arranged to have the race cancelled as the Cobras had the opportunity to gather enough points for the championship. This was an FIA sanctioned event and their complicity was necessary.
In 1965, Shelby won the championship hands down. He has revealed in interviews that Ferrari ran their cars with illegal engines (oversized) in 1965 and still lost. The engines where ignored by FIA inspectors throughout the series. Shelby knew they had the illegal engines but did nothing.
In 1966 and 1967 Ford GT teams led by Shelby (there were other teams as well, but Shelby's team won) won the LeMans 24 hour race 2 years in a row. They were powered by the 427 (7 litre) Ford engine.
Someone (Ferrari) influenced the FIA to ban engines larger that 5 litres after 1967 making the 427 Ford GT illegal. Actually, Ford might have been ready to quit anyway. But their car was now illegal.
1968 - Guess what? In 1968 a 5 litre Ford GT won the race.
1969 - What next? Impossibly against the odds, THE SAME Ford GT that won in 1968 won the race in 1969.


Great information!!!
This is why, whenever I'm driving the 427 Cobra and I see a Ferrari, I purposedly kick in the clutch and rev the 427 FE Big Block
just to have the side pipes ROAR in the ears of the Ferrari driver.

They all know the history of the Shelby Cobras, Daytona Coupes, and GT40s!! :D :D :D ;)

[jfclancy]

Well I think today was the FIA at their highest penicle.
They stuck to the rules as writen.
It's not the FAI's fault Michelin didn't bring the proper tire to the race.
It's not up to the Bridgestone teams to allow a major rule change hours before the start of a race they where all prepared for.
Add a chicane?That would unfairly penelize the bridgestone runners.
Allow tire changes during the race? The rules are allready in place for that,and the Michelin guys could have done that but they didn't know how long the tires would last,5 laps at speed,15,20? Who knows.They never TESTED for that.
And thats my point.
TESTING!!!


Did Firestone/Bridgestone gain an advantage today from Indy 500 tire test?
I'm sure they did and good for them.
Do you think ANY team in F1 would give up a hard earned advantage to another team,would you exspect them too?

If the F1 circuit at Indy is that hard on tires,which it is, why do we not have an F1 tire test here?Too far to travel?Limited value? They say that is the only banked turn in F1,I don't think thats true.They say it's the fastest corner in F1,I think Hockinheim has faster turns.(as well as the new track in Melasia).

The bottom line is the 3 teams running Bridgestone tires today were ready for the start of the USGP at the scheduled time,on the APPROVED TRACK, the Michelin teams were not.
The choice to set out was theres.They tried to bully the FIA and lost.

The sad thing to me was OUR fans thoughing crap on the track.
Whats up with that?
The drivers on the track are doing what they came to do.
I also was unimpressed when the Holman Family did not present the trophies after the race.

F1 is not NASCAR,thank god,they ran todays race by the book.

I just hope the FIA doesn't turn around and try to blame the Indy track then refuse to come back.
The teams are permitted to bring two types of tires all the "m" lads chose not to. This was a disgrace, they did not follow the rules then they cried about it, to make it appear it was anybody else's fault.
been watching f-1 since 1967 NEVER again

Joe Clancy :down:

[cyclone03]

Mat Oxley,Director of Motorsports or something like that of the F1 World championship made a comment that Tony George should give all ticket holders free tickets next year.

Being Tony did nothing wrong I think Michelin should buy EVERY AVAILABLE TICKET for next years GP and just leave the gates open!
They screwed the pouch on this one and they owe every F1 fan in the US!