#93 makes Four Hundie @ DynoPros!

[Bradley G]

What to start with?
I thought I would be going to lunch in my Trilogized Marauder today.
Sometime things don't go, as exactly as planned.
I had a couple minor setbacks, that kept me from that goal.
Nothing a couple trips back to the store did not solve.
Great friends came through once again!
Kris and Jason came by for another round.
Although, Kris finally, had to give in to his better half, right before startup.
The Brotherhood shined through once again,with long distance phone calls(Tallboy)& (Jerry Barnes):beer:
The startup went like a well dresed rehersal!
Thanks to my partner, CJ, who tolerated my obsessiveness! & shared , if not eclipsed my excietment.
After a tame victory lap , to get the video charger, we changed her over to synthetic oil and upgraded the overdue fuel filter.
Thats where the big fun started.
We st***** her down to the dyno, and rolled off three consecutive four hundred horsepower pulls.
My pal Jason, video taped the action, and continued shooting, during the "take turns"
Virgin flogging!:burnout:
We found our selves giggleing like scoolgirls every few moments.
I pulled into a secluded parking lot, and put on a smoke show for CJ and Jason while Mechie(mechanic) shot some vids.
It hardly has even sunk in, I am overwhelmed with all that this car has brought me!
My back is Killing me, My meathooks are cut and swollen.
I am exhaused to the point of a coma, and I wouldn't trade it for anything! :baaa:
Now I better get some sleep, so I can get to Joliet for the NMRA .
thanks for listening :D

[wsmylie]

Congratulations Bradley, enjoy it buddy.

[STLR FN]

Bradley can I drive???? :D

[Rider90]

What a night.

http://midwestpanthers.net/dynorunsmall.jpg
Large Version (http://midwestpanthers.net/dynorunlarge.jpg)

Congrats Brad :beer:

[Donna]

We st***** her down to the dyno, and rolled off three consecutive four hundred horsepower pulls.
My pal Jason, video taped the action, and continued shooting, during the "take turns"
Virgin flogging!:burnout:
We found our selves giggleing like scoolgirls every few moments.
I pulled into a secluded parking lot, and put on a smoke show for CJ and Jason while Mechie(mechanic) shot some vids.
It hardly has even sunk in, I am overwhelmed with all that this car has brought me!
My back is Killing me, My meathooks are cut and swollen.
I am exhaused to the point of a coma, and I wouldn't trade it for anything! :baaa:
Now I better get some sleep, so I can get to Joliet for the NMRA .
thanks for listening :D
Big Congrats Bradley on getting your kit on. Now....go have fun this weekend in Joilet and be careful with that new power :D :burnout:

Donna

[Bradley G]

Now, to go clean up the mess!

Sure, Stlr fan, you can drive, (at the track!):D

[Bradley G]

You got it!

Thanks "D" :P Off to the races!


Big Congrats Bradley on getting your kit on. Now....go have fun this weekend in Joilet and be careful with that new power :D :burnout:

Donna

[03marauder]

Very nice results Brad. Sorry I couldn't be there, now I wish I would have been. Is anyone going to post the videos of the runs or burnouts. It would be nice to see.

[Eric91Z]

What a night.

http://midwestpanthers.net/dynorunsmall.jpg
Large Version (http://midwestpanthers.net/dynorunlarge.jpg)

Congrats Brad :beer:


400? I only see 399 on there... ;)

Congrats, by the way, and have fun!!! :banana:

[MarauderMark]

Congrats on your #93 buddy..now go find yourself a 300C or Charger or Vette:burn: and show them the new big boy on the block .I think this will help it to sink in:D
Good numbers as well too :up:
Please post dem videos . Inquiring eyes wanna see...

[maraudernkc]

Another supercharged Marauder :banana:


Enjoy!

[MARAUDERCHICK]

Sure, Stlr fan, you can drive, (at the track!):D
Me too! Me too!! You promised! Remember???? :D :P

[Tallboy]

Congratulations, my friend! I will see you in a couple weeks!!!:beer:

[Smokie]

The Brotherhood shined through once again,with long distance phone calls(Tallboy)& (Jerry Barnes):beer: ...Now I better get some sleep, so I can get to Joliet for the NMRA .thanks for listening :DCongratulations Brad, life is going to be a little bit more fun from now on...:beer:

[the_pack_rat]

Sounds like your ready for a re-match against that Noventuraomegapollo.

:D

[Zack]

Brad, go have that thing tuned, will ya? Your A/F is ugly.
Sutton HP's # is 708-720-8500
Good luck and congrats.

[SergntMac]

Sounds like your ready for a re-match against that Noventuraomegapollo.Noventurao megapollo...Can you use this in a sentence?

Nevermind...I think you just did.

What a night...

http://midwestpanthers.net/dynorunlarge.jpg OMG!

Brad! Don't hit it too hard, dude, your AFR isn't right. That AFR line is supposed to be as flat as the borders around it, and at 11.0! No kidding, Bro!

Get as many dyno reports as you can gather together, including row/column printouts, and stick them in your glove box. I will do the same, and when we next get together, you'll see what a good tune looks like on paper, in graphhic charts and in a row/column reports, K?

Zack and I will be at US. 66 (Joliet) on Sunday. Zack will be there at the opening gate, I have to work until 2 PM. But, either way, let's get together and look at some dyno paper?

I will bring every dyno report I have since I bought this #1x car. Until then, don't push your MM too hard, it could be tuned better.

Y'all...I am not looking to start anything here, but I have to be honest about this, on behalf of my fellow MM owners at large. If this dyno graph we see here represents what tune buyers get out of the Trilogy box when buying a Trilogy kit, this tune can be better. However, there may be some things peculiar to Bradley's MM that need some adjustment too, that have nothing to do with the base Trilogy tune. I will look into that. This install is the first ChicagoLand based Trilogy self-install, and hopefully not the last, so, some disagreement on the effects of the base tune should be expected. I am sure we can correct any problems.

Brad...Call me at 312.401.1396 if you have any questions, K?

[Tallboy]

Noventuraomegapollo...Can you use this in a sentence?

Nevermind...I think you just did.
OMG!

Brad! Don't hit it too hard, dude, your AFR isn't right. That AFR line is supposed to be as flat as the borders around it, and at 11.0! No kidding, Bro!

Get as many dyno reports as you can gather together, including row/column printouts, and stick them in your glove box. I will do the same, and when we next get together, you'll see what a good tune looks like on paper, in graphhic charts and in a row/column reports, K?

Zack and I will be at US. 66 (Joliet) on Sunday. Zack will be there at the opening gate, I have to work until 2 PM. But, either way, let's get together and look at some dyno paper?

I will bring every dyno report I have since I bought this #1x car. Until then, don't push your MM too hard, it could be tuned better.

Y'all...I am not looking to start anything here, but I have to be honest about this, on behalf of my fellow MM owners at large. If this dyno graph we see here represents what tune buyers get out of the Trilogy box when buying a Trilogy kit, this tune can be better. However, there may be some things peculiar to Bradley's MM that need some adjustment too, that have nothing to do with the base Trilogy tune. I will look into that. This install is the first ChicagoLand based Trilogy self-install, and hopefully not the last, so, some disagreement on the effects of the base tune should be expected. I am sure we can correct any problems.

Brad...Call me at 312.401.1396 if you have any questions, K?Mac, I can see your intentions are nothing but honorable. My guess is there's just a little quirk here that's affecting the A/F ratio. I have talked with Brad and am aware of what is going on. I have had a Trilogy car exhibit these exact same symptoms, and the culprit turned out to be nothing more than a poor chip/pcm connection. I'm sure Bradley will enlighten us as to the cause of this particular A/F ratio chart.

As far as the stock Trilogy tune is concerned, my expiriences with it have been nothing but positive. Of the 10 Trilogy cars here in Florida, I know of only two that have had custom dyno tunes. I've helped Carfixer with quite a few installs, and customers seem to be quite happy with it. I had one of the top tuners in the country grab his laptop and drive my car. I wanted a custom tune and told him so. His response? This car is perfect. It's doing everything it should, and there's no need for you to spend the money for a custom tune. Imagine that! That should tell you all you need to know about the "stock" Trilogy tune.:D

[Smokie]

What to start with?
I thought I would be going to lunch in my Trilogized Marauder today.
Sometime things don't go, as exactly as planned.
I had a couple minor setbacks, that kept me from that goal.
Nothing a couple trips back to the store did not solve.
Great friends came through once again!
Kris and Jason came by for another round.
Although, Kris finally, had to give in to his better half, right before startup.
The Brotherhood shined through once again,with long distance phone calls(Tallboy)& (Jerry Barnes):beer:
The startup went like a well dresed rehersal!
Thanks to my partner, CJ, who tolerated my obsessiveness! & shared , if not eclipsed my excietment.
After a tame victory lap , to get the video charger, we changed her over to synthetic oil and upgraded the overdue fuel filter.
Thats where the big fun started.
We st***** her down to the dyno, and rolled off three consecutive four hundred horsepower pulls.
My pal Jason, video taped the action, and continued shooting, during the "take turns"
Virgin flogging!:burnout:
We found our selves giggleing like scoolgirls every few moments.
I pulled into a secluded parking lot, and put on a smoke show for CJ and Jason while Mechie(mechanic) shot some vids.
It hardly has even sunk in, I am overwhelmed with all that this car has brought me!
My back is Killing me, My meathooks are cut and swollen.
I am exhaused to the point of a coma, and I wouldn't trade it for anything! :baaa:
Now I better get some sleep, so I can get to Joliet for the NMRA .
thanks for listening :D

Brad, I was not going to say anything, but Zack and Sarge are correct, the A/F does not look right and neither does the power curve. Hp and Tq are supposed to meet at a little past 5200 rpm's.

I suspect that maybe the dyno was not set-up right. Congratulations and remember if your tail pipes and gas mileage are ok....the dyno was wrong...:D

[Rider90]

Brad, I was not going to say anything, but Zack and Sarge are correct, the A/F does not look right and neither does the power curve. Hp and Tq are supposed to meet at a little past 5200 rpm's.

I suspect that maybe the dyno was not set-up right. Congratulations and remember if your tail pipes and gas mileage are ok....the dyno was wrong...:D

Brad knows. Those were the first things out of CJ's mouth, "It's running pig rich" as he tuned down the boost-a-pump and mentioned it needs a tune right away.

[MarauderMark]

What a great bunch here :up: Wtg my brethern makes me proud to be on here.. :D :D Me-oggie smile

[SergntMac]

Mac, I can see your intentions are nothing but honorable. My guess is there's just a little quirk here that's affecting the A/F ratio. I have talked with Brad and am aware of what is going on. I have had a Trilogy car exhibit these exact same symptoms, and the culprit turned out to be nothing more than a poor chip/pcm connection. I'm sure Bradley will enlighten us as to the cause of this particular A/F ratio chart.
Thanks, Chuck. I'm only reacting to what I see in the provided dyno charts, and I mean no harm otherwise.

As far as the stock Trilogy tune is concerned, my expiriences with it have been nothing but positive. Of the 10 Trilogy cars here in Florida, I know of only two that have had custom dyno tunes. I've helped Carfixer with quite a few installs, and customers seem to be quite happy with it. I had one of the top tuners in the country grab his laptop and drive my car. I wanted a custom tune and told him so. His response? This car is perfect. It's doing everything it should, and there's no need for you to spend the money for a custom tune. Imagine that! That should tell you all you need to know about the "stock" Trilogy tune. Thanks again, Chuck. It could be the "perfect" tune, I won't disagree. But, it doesn't appear "perfect" here and I am just trying to give Brad a heads up on that. The problem could be the install, the dyno, the tune, Brad's car, even the image we see here.

I just want to let Bradley know that is doesn't look as good as he may believe, which can get expensive, yes?

[MM03MOK]

Brad, I was not going to say anything, but Zack and Sarge are correct, the A/F does not look right and neither does the power curve. Hp and Tq are supposed to meet at a little past 5200 rpm's.Welcome to power unleased, Brad-Lee Gee!!! Congrats!!

Our dyno proved that Lidio's tune was right on except for a small variation in the A/F, running lean only for a small portion of the curve. We drove to Michigan just to be sure.

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/gallery/data/500/Blackbird_Dyno_Med.jpg

I am curious why the peak HP and TQ numbers differ inversely compared to mine. Remember, I'm just a girl. ;)

[TooManyFords]

Correct me if I'm wrong Mary, but your dyno graph looks like it runs lean most of the time! It needs to stay right at 11.0-11.5 for the entire run, not at just the top end. I'd get yours re-tuned too.

John

[RF Overlord]

I'd get yours re-tuned too.Lidio didn't seem to have any issues with it, and since he knows more about tuning a Trilogy car than anyone on the planet, I have to believe it's OK...maybe he printed out the first pull instead of the last...I'll ask him to check into it.

[DEFYANT]

Yo Brad! Congrats man!! Enjoy T-93 (<- has a nice ring to it)! Will you be going to MVIII?

I have not had my car dyno tuned yet. I have Lidios "stock" tune. I will be at his place during MVIII dyno day on 8/17 @ 8am to have him dyno tune the car.

Take it easy bud!

[HwyCruiser]

Congrats on the install Bradley. Just don't beat on her too hard until you get you open loop squared away. Good thing you got her on a dyno first thing!

[Zack]

As far as the stock Trilogy tune is concerned, my expiriences with it have been nothing but positive. Of the 10 Trilogy cars here in Florida, I know of only two that have had custom dyno tunes. I've helped Carfixer with quite a few installs, and customers seem to be quite happy with it. I had one of the top tuners in the country grab his laptop and drive my car. I wanted a custom tune and told him so. His response? This car is perfect. It's doing everything it should, and there's no need for you to spend the money for a custom tune. Imagine that! That should tell you all you need to know about the "stock" Trilogy tune.:D

Dude, I dont know you and I dont want to piss you off.

To say that a tuner can took your car for a ride and said its perfect is stupid.
If your car will start to ping at 13.0 A/F and your 'perfect' tune is at 12.9, is that perfect?
If you can squeeze 2 more degrees of timing at multiple rpm points in the curve, is it perfect?
Nothing is perfect, nor should be classified as perfect until it is on a dyno.
And nothing against Trilogy owners, but a good percentage of them buy this kit because they want to let Jiffy Lube open their hood every 3000 miles.
Im 'in tune' with my car, always have been. And that is why it is one of the fastest cars around.

[DEFYANT]

And nothing against Trilogy owners, but a good percentage of them buy this kit because they want to let Jiffy Lube open their hood every 3000 miles.
Huh?

:confused:

What are you talkin about?

[Tallboy]

Dude, I dont know you and I dont want to piss you off.

To say that a tuner can took your car for a ride and said its perfect is stupid.
If your car will start to ping at 13.0 A/F and your 'perfect' tune is at 12.9, is that perfect?
If you can squeeze 2 more degrees of timing at multiple rpm points in the curve, is it perfect?
Nothing is perfect, nor should be classified as perfect until it is on a dyno.
And nothing against Trilogy owners, but a good percentage of them buy this kit because they want to let Jiffy Lube open their hood every 3000 miles.
Im 'in tune' with my car, always have been. And that is why it is one of the fastest cars around.No offense taken, Zack. I'm a pretty thick-skinned guy, and welcome opposing viewpoints. I hope one day we can correct this "not knowing each other thing". I'm in Chicago a couple times a year. I try not to make a habit of calling people "stupid", though. Even when they are.

I guess it was a poor choice of words on my part. The word "perfect" was my own interpretation of what he told me. If memory serves correctly, it was something like "Sure, you could spend the money for a tune, but there is no life-changing horsepower to be found in this car. Sure we could tweak it a bit, but I'd leave it alone if I were you." I apologize for the poor/inaccurate wording on my part. My main concern is longevity. I want my car to run this way for as long as possible. Could a good tuner get more timing/horsepower out of it? I'm sure he could. But I'm not there right now. Maybe someday I'll look for more power, but for right now, my car is fine. For me.

I don't know much about tuning. Yet. I'm trying to learn as much as I can. I'm enjoying all the expirience I'm gaining helping Carfixer install superchargers. Maybe the next time I'm in Chicago we can get together, and you could teach me a thing or two? [Totally serious comment here.]

[Tallboy]

Thanks, Chuck. I'm only reacting to what I see in the provided dyno charts, and I mean no harm otherwise.
Thanks again, Chuck. It could be the "perfect" tune, I won't disagree. But, it doesn't appear "perfect" here and I am just trying to give Brad a heads up on that. The problem could be the install, the dyno, the tune, Brad's car, even the image we see here.

I just want to let Bradley know that is doesn't look as good as he may believe, which can get expensive, yes?Yes, it can get very expensive very quickly. Again, I took your post as genuine concern for a fellow Marauder owner-nothing less, and on that I commend you.

Again, my apologies for the poor choice of words on my part. I guess I understand about every third word that comes out of a tuner's mouth, know what I mean? I, in no way, meant to imply my car is perfectly tuned. It is, however, perfectly suited to my taste. How's that?:)

[BillyGman]

I don't know much about tuning. Yet. I'm trying to learn as much as I can. ]Nor do most people on this board know a lot about it including myself. But atleast you have the wisdom and the maturity to admit it Chuck.

None of us know as much about tuning as a good engine tuner knows. Lidio is one of those who's fantastic, and while I agree with MAC that Brad's A/F ratio is all over the polace, I do NOT agree with some other comments on here (such as the A/F ratio having to be between 11.0 and 11.5) because that just isn't true according to Lidio.

My AFR varies from 11.8 to 13.1 and it's been run real hard that way for 20,000 miles all on pump gas even at the track(93 octane). Lidio told me that the AFR would have to be at 11.0- 11.5 with a supercharged engine that wasn't intercooled, but not with one that is.

However there are two things that are being overlooked here.....

#1. did this place that Brad took his car to be Dynoed at, use a cheesy tailpipe sensor to measure the AFR? Or did they bore a hole and install a bung for the sensor somewhere BEFORE the cats like it's supposed to be done? If that AFR reading was taken with a tailpipe sensor then those readings are worthless and are likely very inaccurate (which is exactly what Lidio told me).

#2. Nobody can say what the AFR should be on any engine without knowing what the ignition timing advance is, because the ignition timing curve is more important than the AFR is on supercharged engines.

[FiveO]

Congrats Brad!

Welcome to the one and only! :D

I'd agree too that the dyno sheet does not look correct. Something is a bit a miss. Hopefully its just the dyno!

[jstevens]

[And nothing against Trilogy owners, but a good percentage of them buy this kit because they want to let Jiffy Lube open their hood every 3000 miles.
Im 'in tune' with my car, always have been. And that is why it is one of the fastest cars around.[/QUOTE]

I prefer Uncle Ed's myself :lol:

[Bradley G]

Thank You for all your well wishes and comments!

I have had an incredible time with all this car has brought me.
I have a slight issue with rich codes, which I am working on now.
Seems Chuck (Tallboy) and Carfixer (Claude) were right on the money again.
The connection between the chip and PCM was causing a rich condition.
These guys are sharing nearly ten installs worth of experience with me.
I have been busy preparing and holding a DynoDay for a nice group of Pontiac entheusiasts.
Funny, everyone who came to the GTP Event today, wandered over to my car sitting inside with the hood open, and had some kinds words to say about it!

[BillyGman]

Thank You for all your well wishes and comments!

I have had an incredible time with all this car has brought me.
I have a slight issue with rich codes, which I am working on now.
Seems Chuck (Tallboy) and Carfixer (Claude) were right on the money again.
The connection between the chip and PCM was causing a rich condition.
These guys are sharing nearly ten installs worth of experience with me.
I have been busy preparing and holding a DynoDay for a nice group of Pontiac entheusiasts.
Funny, everyone who came to the GTP Event today, wandered over to my car sitting inside with the hood open, and had some kinds words to say about it!Brad, you never answered my question.....

Did you have those AFR numbers measured with a tailpipe sensor, or did the guy bore a hole in your exhaust to weld a threaded bung in it BEFORE one of the cats???? If you read my previous post you'll understand the reason why the answer to that question is important for you.

[Lidio]

Guys I’m in Joliet this weekend and had a little time with the internet in my hotel room Saturday night here. This discussion about tuning and the different opinings of how it should be done can go on forever with me of course trying to say that the way I do it is one of the best way compared to every one else’s way….. Obvious difference in opinings and philosophies. The tune that comes with Trilogys is no doubt for the most part conservative. We tried to make it work with a minimum of 92-93 Octane. We’ve found that certain parts of the country had poorer grades of premium so this is why the Trilogy supplied tune has some room to be more aggressive if you want to, and trust your local premium fuels.

The reason I run the Trilogy tunes at around 12.8-13.00 A/F at WOT till about 3500 to 4000 is because my tunes have a lot more thought into them then some of the more aggressive backyard tuning attitude some might have.

And also to say that a dyno, especially a DynoJet is the final say in tuning a MM is the best way… your dead wrong. To prove it simply put a MM on a DynoJet, and go WOT from a low role in 1st gear and watch where it shifts at WOT. It wont, it will bang of the limiter for a second or two and then finally upshift, especially the blower ones. The reason for this is because a typical DynoJet’s rollers aren’t heavy enough to make the MM feel like it fighting real world weight and wind resistance. So to say that the chassis dyno is the final say is very wrong and competent tuners know this and/or will try to factor this into a final tune. I’m sure there are several guys that have found more power then the supplied tune found in the Trilogy box. Like I’ve said before any one can lean them out and put more spark in it. Its making them live that’s important. This is some thing that takes years and lot of miles and actual abuse to prove out on a given car and combo.

An A/F ratio of 13 to 1 at WOT for the first few seconds before 3500-4000rpm with the boost and intercooling that is supplied with a Trilogy is not a problem and will not detonate if the spark is treated correctly. Some of you know it all tuner would know this if you watched how Ford tuned the ’03-’04 Cobra. I’m not afraid to admit that I do learn by watching what big companies have spent millions on. Making a Trilogy MM go open loop to early and go lower then an A/F ratio of about 12.50 is sloppy and unrefined tuning, period. The only thing that comes from a much fatter A/F that low is maybe a little more low end TQ… and only a little at that. Its nothing more then waist full to go overly rich at WOT below 4K on most blower cars even roots equipped motors.

You centrifugal guys of all should know this. Those blower are so boostless, and torqueless below 3500 when only making around 9-10psi total, that I treat them like an N/A tune below 4000rpm, lots of spark and A/F ratios in the 13.25 until the power FINNALLY comes on. Trust me I know this, my 05 GT has a Vortech, I run more then the factory spark until about 4K rpm and then ramp it down as the revs come up. Same with the A/F.

Besides, how stubborn and narrow minded are you when Trilogy has countless MM’s with the supplied boost and tunes running around for going on two years now with no trouble at all for thousands of miles.


Oh and Zach, Its cool and all that you wrench on your own car and your better then the guys that pay other to do that sort of thing, but do you limit your self skills to auto work only. Does that mean that if I pay a dentist for dental work or a TV repair man to do their thing that we’re just not worthy of any thing. What kind of a cheap insult is that Jiffy lube thing supposed to be about Trilogy guys?? Childish man.

I guess the fact that the Roots equipped MM’s heavily out weights the other type of blowers has really started to kick in and bother certain folks.

[BillyGman]

Thanks very much for your input Lidio, and I for one really appreciate that. It's really nice when vendors are willing to answer peoples' questions, because that isn't always the case with some.

[MI2QWK4U]

Good post Lidio, again your experience and knowledge shine through.

[gpfarrell]

The more I read... especially "stupid" remarks... the more I appreciate those that softly ask sincere questions, quietly offer gentle suggestions, and graciously accept ideas... allowing that they don't already know everything.

And the more I want a Trilogy!

[bigslim]

Brad, go have that thing tuned, will ya? Your A/F is ugly.
Sutton HP's # is 708-720-8500
Good luck and congrats.
Zack, I have a couple of things to say.

1. If you want to share the number of a "NON-VENDOR" with a member do it in a PM. That violates the rules. I guess some folks can do things and get away with it like attack a vendor.

2. What is with the "Juffy Lube" comment? So what if some let others work on there car. Does it make them less of an authority? People chose to have their work done by people that know the business. "SO WHAT IF YOU WORK ON YOUR CAR!" Maybe that is why you always have to work on it. Lidio tuned my car and it has been right since.

3. My install was a self install. I took it out to Lidio to get the K&N put on and we did a before and after dyno. The tune that came with my kit out of the box was perfect. It did not need to be touched. Only when the K&N went on did it get custom tuned.

4. What is this "one of the fastest cars" line? Does mean every car or just MM's? If it is so fast where are you? We have been in your backyard all weekend. Where are you?

5. I know you made statement a while back about if someone would give you a NOS kit you would go after the number 1 time. I know for a fact that someone did offer you a kit. Where is that number? We are waiting.

I am "SO TIRED" of all of this stuff. I am so glad that most of the people here are cool. I am also glad that most "DO NOT" listen to a few individuals to sway them into otherwise wrong decisions. I am also glad to see so many people come to MVIII. At least they will see how the Detroit Crew puts on a party and have fun. As most know I have been very quite whenever there a war going on here. But I have enough of the BS. Most can look at where all this starts and it is usually started with wrong information. Zack, you and your friend please stop attacking us with Trilogys. You made your decision on what kit you wanted and so did we. "GET OVER IT." If you think yours is so much better than so be it. I know one thing, numbers speck for themselves and that why Trilogy just celebrated selling kit 100. Eat that along with having the fastest time. BTW Mac, don't e-mail. I don't want to hear it.There I guess I am done. Now back to regular programing.

[Bradley G]

Thanks for your comments Billy.

I agree that the most accurate measurement sampleing A/F is how you describe, makes perfect sense to me.
I talked with Lidio about this a while back when my N/A Marauder was reading a bit lean.
He said , the reading would be leaner after the cats, to a point.He does not belive in tuning exclusively off the Dyno results either.
I don't recall him saying, the tailpipe method was/is completly worthless.
Since the Trilogy install, I had one small connection issue with Chip to PCM which seems to be resolved.The car started up fine after the install, We all took turns flogging the snots out of it.
I am totally estatic with my decision to install this product.
Lidio offered to check it out for me in the morning, at Rt. 66 in Joliet.
You won't find anyone more capable and honorable to help you mod your car.



QUOTE=BillyGman]Nor do most people on this board know a lot about it including myself. But atleast you have the wisdom and the maturity to admit it Chuck.

None of us know as much about tuning as a good engine tuner knows. Lidio is one of those who's fantastic, and while I agree with MAC that Brad's A/F ratio is all over the polace, I do NOT agree with some other comments on here (such as the A/F ratio having to be between 11.0 and 11.5) because that just isn't true according to Lidio.

My AFR varies from 11.8 to 13.1 and it's been run real hard that way for 20,000 miles all on pump gas even at the track(93 octane). Lidio told me that the AFR would have to be at 11.0- 11.5 with a supercharged engine that wasn't intercooled, but not with one that is.

However there are two things that are being overlooked here.....

#1. did this place that Brad took his car to be Dynoed at, use a cheesy tailpipe sensor to measure the AFR? Or did they bore a hole and install a bung for the sensor somewhere BEFORE the cats like it's supposed to be done? If that AFR reading was taken with a tailpipe sensor then those readings are worthless and are likely very inaccurate (which is exactly what Lidio told me).

#2. Nobody can say what the AFR should be on any engine without knowing what the ignition timing advance is, because the ignition timing curve is more important than the AFR is on supercharged engines.[/QUOTE]

[Bradley G]

Thanks Mark!

I appreciate your efforts!


Congrats Brad!

Welcome to the one and only! :D

I'd agree too that the dyno sheet does not look correct. Something is a bit a miss. Hopefully its just the dyno!

[Bradley G]

Thanks Mac,

I will call you tomorrow


Noventuraomegapollo...Can you use this in a sentence?

Nevermind...I think you just did.
OMG!

Brad! Don't hit it too hard, dude, your AFR isn't right. That AFR line is supposed to be as flat as the borders around it, and at 11.0! No kidding, Bro!

Get as many dyno reports as you can gather together, including row/column printouts, and stick them in your glove box. I will do the same, and when we next get together, you'll see what a good tune looks like on paper, in graphhic charts and in a row/column reports, K?

Zack and I will be at US. 66 (Joliet) on Sunday. Zack will be there at the opening gate, I have to work until 2 PM. But, either way, let's get together and look at some dyno paper?

I will bring every dyno report I have since I bought this #1x car. Until then, don't push your MM too hard, it could be tuned better.

Y'all...I am not looking to start anything here, but I have to be honest about this, on behalf of my fellow MM owners at large. If this dyno graph we see here represents what tune buyers get out of the Trilogy box when buying a Trilogy kit, this tune can be better. However, there may be some things peculiar to Bradley's MM that need some adjustment too, that have nothing to do with the base Trilogy tune. I will look into that. This install is the first ChicagoLand based Trilogy self-install, and hopefully not the last, so, some disagreement on the effects of the base tune should be expected. I am sure we can correct any problems.

Brad...Call me at 312.401.1396 if you have any questions, K?

[Bradley G]

Thanks Zack,

see you tomorrow


Brad, go have that thing tuned, will ya? Your A/F is ugly.
Sutton HP's # is 708-720-8500
Good luck and congrats.

[Bradley G]

You got it Kris!

Thanks for the help!


Very nice results Brad. Sorry I couldn't be there, now I wish I would have been. Is anyone going to post the videos of the runs or burnouts. It would be nice to see.

[Bradley G]

Thanks Pal!
Congratulations Bradley, enjoy it buddy.

[Bradley G]

SAE corrected my friend! I rounded up!
400? I only see 399 on there... ;)

Congrats, by the way, and have fun!!! :banana:

[Bradley G]

Funny you mention that Mark!

On the way to Joliet Yesterday two fellows, in a Vette convt. were ogleing my car cruising down the tollway.
I had to give em a sample of the sweet sound this happy machine makes.
I belive this to be true, cause when I glanced back over at them, they were both smiling too!:up:
I'm working on the Vids, (Blackfork)Jourdan#84, can attest it may take me a while,

Congrats on your #93 buddy..now go find yourself a 300C or Charger or Vette:burn: and show them the new big boy on the block .I think this will help it to sink in:D
Good numbers as well too :up:
Please post dem videos . Inquiring eyes wanna see...

[Bradley G]

Thanks Xavier!
Brad, I was not going to say anything, but Zack and Sarge are correct, the A/F does not look right and neither does the power curve. Hp and Tq are supposed to meet at a little past 5200 rpm's.

I suspect that maybe the dyno was not set-up right. Congratulations and remember if your tail pipes and gas mileage are ok....the dyno was wrong...:D

[Bradley G]

Thanks Greg!
Another supercharged Marauder :banana:


Enjoy!

[Bradley G]

Are you serious?

You are first! :P


Me too! Me too!! You promised! Remember???? :D :P

[Bradley G]

I'd say "You have no idea" But I know better:beer:
Congratulations Brad, life is going to be a little bit more fun from now on...:beer:

[Bradley G]

Yeah Rat!

And we ain't telling him!


Sounds like your ready for a re-match against that Noventuraomegapollo.

:D

[Bradley G]

That's true Jason !

But remember every tuner has his/her own way of doing things.


Brad knows. Those were the first things out of CJ's mouth, "It's running pig rich" as he tuned down the boost-a-pump and mentioned it needs a tune right away.

[Bradley G]

I'm proud to call you my Brother Mark! Thanks for your Kindness!
What a great bunch here :up: Wtg my brethern makes me proud to be on here.. :D :D Me-oggie smile

[Bradley G]

Never say "Just", You are "The Bunny Lady" :bows:

Thanks for all you do!


Welcome to power unleased, Brad-Lee Gee!!! Congrats!!

Our dyno proved that Lidio's tune was right on except for a small variation in the A/F, running lean only for a small portion of the curve. We drove to Michigan just to be sure.

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/gallery/data/500/Blackbird_Dyno_Med.jpg

I am curious why the peak HP and TQ numbers differ inversely compared to mine. Remember, I'm just a girl. ;)

[Bradley G]

Thanks Defyant!

I'll see ya There!
Good luck on the tune! :beer:

Yo Brad! Congrats man!! Enjoy T-93 (<- has a nice ring to it)! Will you be going to MVIII?

I have not had my car dyno tuned yet. I have Lidios "stock" tune. I will be at his place during MVIII dyno day on 8/17 @ 8am to have him dyno tune the car.

Take it easy bud!

[Bradley G]

Thanks Pal!
Congrats on the install Bradley. Just don't beat on her too hard until you get you open loop squared away. Good thing you got her on a dyno first thing!

[Bradley G]

Sometimes it is hard to take our own advice!

Good luck on your want


The more I read... especially "stupid" remarks... the more I appreciate those that softly ask sincere questions, quietly offer gentle suggestions, and graciously accept ideas... allowing that they don't already know everything.

And the more I want a Trilogy!

[Bradley G]

Hope I get up early enough to see you and Z, if not thanks for the great time this weekend.

Driving your car Darrel, was what sinched the deal!
Congrats on the new record run in Trilogy #3.
Who has to :D tow #1 home?

Zack, I have a couple of things to say.

1. If you want to share the number of a "NON-VENDOR" with a member do it in a PM. That violates the rules. I guess some folks can do things and get away with it like attack a vendor.

2. What is with the "Juffy Lube" comment? So what if some let others work on there car. Does it make them less of an authority? People chose to have their work done by people that know the business. "SO WHAT IF YOU WORK ON YOUR CAR!" Maybe that is why you always have to work on it. Lidio tuned my car and it has been right since.

3. My install was a self install. I took it out to Lidio to get the K&N put on and we did a before and after dyno. The tune that came with my kit out of the box was perfect. It did not need to be touched. Only when the K&N went on did it get custom tuned.

4. What is this "one of the fastest cars" line? Does mean every car or just MM's? If it is so fast where are you? We have been in your backyard all weekend. Where are you?

5. I know you made statement a while back about if someone would give you a NOS kit you would go after the number 1 time. I know for a fact that someone did offer you a kit. Where is that number? We are waiting.

I am "SO TIRED" of all of this stuff. I am so glad that most of the people here are cool. I am also glad that most "DO NOT" listen to a few individuals to sway them into otherwise wrong decisions. I am also glad to see so many people come to MVIII. At least they will see how the Detroit Crew puts on a party and have fun. As most know I have been very quite whenever there a war going on here. But I have enough of the BS. Most can look at where all this starts and it is usually started with wrong information. Zack, you and your friend please stop attacking us with Trilogys. You made your decision on what kit you wanted and so did we. "GET OVER IT." If you think yours is so much better than so be it. I know one thing, numbers speck for themselves and that why Trilogy just celebrated selling kit 100. Eat that along with having the fastest time. BTW Mac, don't e-mail. I don't want to hear it.There I guess I am done. Now back to regular programing.

[Bradley G]

Sorry I don't know how to respond to everyones comments in one post!

I'm padding my stats!:D
Here's to seeing you all soon! :beer:

[BillyGman]

Thanks for your comments Billy.

I agree that the most accurate measurement sampleing A/F is how you describe, makes perfect sense to me.
I talked with Lidio about this a while back when my N/A Marauder was reading a bit lean.
He said , the reading would be leaner after the cats, to a point.He does not belive in tuning exclusively off the Dyno results either.
I don't recall him saying, the tailpipe method was/is completly worthless.
]Brad, the reason I was sharing that with you, and asking you that, is simply because Lidio and I spoke over the phone about it one day, and he told me that he would never let anyone tune his car who was using a tailpipe sensor to measure the AFR since that just isn't an accurate way to do that. I know that you didn't have your engine tuned by that place, and that it was just a dyno TEST that you had done, but in light of what Lidio told me, I just don't think that you nor any of us should be drawing conclusions about your car based on AFR readings that were taken from a tailpipe sensor. And after reading your response above, I take it that the place that did that AFR test for you DID use a tailpipe sensor.

Maybe there is something going on with your tune since it's reading so rich, I don't know, but either way, I think it would be best to have an AFR test performed by someone who doesn't use a tailpipe sensor for that. I wish you the best, and please keep us updated.;)

[Tallboy]

3. My install was a self install. I took it out to Lidio to get the K&N put on and we did a before and after dyno. The tune that came with my kit out of the box was perfect. Careful, Slim. Zack might call you "stupid", too.:rolleyes:

The one thing I like to "hang my hat on", is my friend runs consistent low 12s, if not 12.0X, with a "stock" Trilogy tune.:burnout:

[Bradley G]

After closer examination of the vitals.

And over 300 miles on the Install, it appears any tuning issues shown on the Dynograph in this thread were due to a faulty chip to PCM connection.This was due to contacts not being cleaned well enough.
Lidio, Myself and 03 Marauder, took a lenghty ride in My car , while Lidio was, checking all tune parameters.
He reburned several tweaks to enhance my tune .
The car is performing very well indeed!
A huge thanks to Lidio, for his time and explanation(s):beer:

[bigslim]

After closer examination of the vitals.

And over 300 miles on the Install, it appears any tuning issues shown on the Dynograph in this thread were due to a faulty chip to PCM connection.This was due to contacts not being cleaned well enough.
Lidio, Myself and 03 Marauder, took a lenghty ride in My car , while Lidio was, checking all tune parameters.
He reburned several tweaks to enhance my tune .
The car is performing very well indeed!
A huge thanks to Lidio, for his time and explanation(s):beer:
So glad that is was something so simple. I am also glad to see that everyone can see that the tune that comes with the kit is a safe tune. Glad that Lidio got you all set. He is a class act. Good to see you again Brad. See you on Woodward. This time no ticket for me. ;)

[BillyGman]

Thanks for that update Brad, and I'm glad that you have everything in order. Now go out and hammer that car a little bit, and have some fun with it, uh?