Traction Control ... Learn to drive, eh?

[SergntMac]

Woke up to 11 inches of good packing Midwest snow this morning.

Good.

Finally, I get to try out my winter tire setup, and figure out what this Traction Control is all about.

I'll spare the details, but IMHO, Traction Control is for those who don't know how to drive, and don't want to bother to learn. In a way, it's the same as ABS, which I had difficulty with early on.

Rather than teach student drivers how to control an automobile in extreme conditions, just filp a switch, eh?

How do I cut this crap off permanently?

[03MERCMARAUDER]

The traction control in the marauder is useless, got around better in the snow when I had my Lightning compared to the merc. I am sure someone will chime in on how to disable it completely

Joe

[RR|Suki]

agreed, I hear all this crying about how bad the MM is in snow blah blah blah, short of a sheet of ice I really don't see a problem with the car, I've driven through atleast 3 snow storms this year and an ice storm last night on KDWS and with my power, so really give the car some credit, control your gas and it's fine

[O's Fan Rich]

My MM is traction control deleted!!!!
The 99 CV I had previously was equipped with that debocle (sp?) and I always shut it off when I drove in the snow. The car did great that way. TC just caused issues. I liked it in the wet, as it helped to correct my back end when I hit a corner hard.

[Mad4Macs]

Agreed. Mine was a daily driver for 3 years in Michigan, including 3 winters. With the stock tires.
Learn to drive.

[Vortech347]

Marauder doughnuts are fun. Thats all I gota say. :)

[SID210SA]

Isn't doing doughnuts bad for the rear diff.?

[RR|Suki]

Isn't doing doughnuts bad for the rear diff.?

in alota snow prob not too bad I would imagine, seein as there isn't much resistance

[SergntMac]

Yep, so it sitting still and rusting to death.

[RF Overlord]

Yep, so it sitting still and rusting to death."It's better to burn out...rust never sleeps. Hey Hey My My"

[merc6]

Isn't doing doughnuts bad for the rear diff.? As I remeber that time your back end went around that night, you had tc on right? I remember hitting that puddle and doing the light burn out to dry the tires before taking off.

[rayjay]

I've learned how to use it. You have to either be very light on the go pedal with it on, or start out with it off and then activate it once you're moving. I don't use it to attack steep hills from slow starts. However, it saved my butt earlier this winter when I ran into black ice under fresh lake effect snow, allowed me to get the car back under control from what should have been a impossible angle. The key to that was staying off the brakes and steer out of it. I thought the TC had not activated, but the wife said the light was flashing the whole time.

[SID210SA]

As I remeber that time your back end went around that night, you had tc on right? I remember hitting that puddle and doing the light burn out to dry the tires before taking off.

yeah it activated on me, I should have had it off, would have been an awsome controled slide.:coolman:

[BruteForce]

...controled slide.:coolman:

On black ice there is no such thing. Best you can hope for is a well-aimed slide. :D

[jdando]

Traction Control...I like it. It has saved me a few times. Yes it does get in the way of playing around, but a quick push of the button and giant smoky burn-outs, graceful slides or donuts are all available.

I was amazed how the car rotated around the front wheels:eek: when I needed to spin the car around on purpose.

jeremy

[Donny Carlson]

What is this "snow" you speak of?

[Agent M79]

Well for me there is driving and then there is driving. When I am driving, the TC is on and has helped in 2 situations I can recall where I would have reacted slower that it.

When I am driving, the TC as well as the overdrive is off.

[Vortech347]

Isn't doing doughnuts bad for the rear diff.?

Not really, There's next to no friction involved so it dosn't mess with the track-lok plates much.

The ways to kill a dif are 6500rpm launches with 600ft-lbs of TQ and putting a tire on thats different in size to the other on each sides of the axle, this will spin the clutch packs and burn them up. Thats another reason why you should only run a spare long enough to get to a tire shop.

[RCSignals]

My 2003 CVPI has limited slip, but no traction control. I'm glad I didn't order it.

[Zack]

I can find a way to turn it off. Why didnt you ask me?

[Marauderjack]

Hey Zack....

DiaboSport tuners have a setting to turn off the Traction Control.....Any experience with them??

I think it will work with Mustangs but not with our cars.....Does anyone know??

I may just try it and see??

Marauderjack

[Zack]

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/showcase/files/4/0/4/TCoff.bmp

As simple as changing the 55 to a 0.
Gotta love SCT

Another value in this screen is the revs per mile.
This is critical when running a larger or smaller tire at the track.
If this number is not adjusted for the different tire size, your transmission will shift too high or too low.
With my drag radials, I had to change the number to 795

[MM03MOK]

As simple as changing the 55 to a 0.
Gotta love SCTVery cool, Zack. Easily restorable if needed too.

[SergntMac]

I can find a way to turn it off. Why didnt you ask me? 'Cause I haven't see you since it snowed, and I found out what I wanted to know about the Traction Control...Sux.

[RCSignals]

I suppose you can always hit the switch....if you remember before it's too late.

I notice in my '03 CVPI that the wiring is in place at the dash, but somehow I think it would take more than just a switch, and eec adjustment to activate TC.

[Marauderjack]

I turned mine off with the Diablo tuner and it was not purdy!!!:argue:

The TC light stayed on as well as the ABS and Check Engine lights....I didn't even drive it for fear it would booger something up!!!:shake:

Back to "Normal" now!!:beer:

Zack....How do you manipulate the parameter you refer to??:confused:

Marauderjack:pimp:

[Canadasvt]

I usually turn the TC off. The 160lbs of kitty litter in the trunk helps with traction.

[Zack]

[QUOTE=Zack]http://www.mercurymarauder.net/showcase/files/4/0/4/TCoff.bmp

As simple as changing the 55 to a 0.
Gotta love SCT

Well, we tried this yesterday on Macs car and it did not work.
Im gonna hunt around the software and see if I can manipulate it elsewhere.
Im sure the TC is activated by a relay under the dash and unhooking it would be the easiest fix.
Or a dedicated fuse maybe?

[Marauderjack]

Zack.....

Somewhere I heard that the Trac Control on the MM was entangled with the ABS and could not be disabled??:confused:

I think I proved this to myself with the light show when I tried to disable it with the Diablo tuner??:argue:

Good Luck!!:beer:

Marauderjack:burnout:

[merc6]

On black ice there is no such thing. Best you can hope for is a well-aimed slide. :DIf it snowed where we were that day then hell froze over 4 real ;)


also wasn't there something they did with the vic to bypass it?

[Agent M79]

At my last tune, that was one of the questions the tuner asked everyone: "Do you want the traction control off by default?"

I think it reversed the switch so that TC was off at start up and turned on (if you wanted it) when you hit the button.

I do not know if that forced the TC light on or not.

I do think they were using SCT software so I think you are right, Zack, it is in there somewhere, somehow.

[SergntMac]

I have spent enough time underneath both my 300A and 300B to know there are only 4 rotational sensors (one at each wheel) on both editions. Obviously, these sensors count tire revolutions, and share duties between both ABS and Traction Control issues.

Zack...maybe it's in the front harness? Like our dual knock sensors?

We need to to add a sensor feed line to the EEC to activate the dual knock sensors, right? Maybe we need to delete a feed line for the Traction Control in order to side-step the Traction Control?

Ummm....I'm just guessing here...Wondering aloud.

[Master]

Hey folks,
I joined this thread rather late, but may I be permitted to offer my 2c worth? If so, read on. If not, please pass me by.
Growing up in Rural Nova Scotia, the passtime was not drinking, drugs, or partying. It was driving. Back roads, dirt or paved. Chases, tags, the whole lot. Very fast, very tricky. Often lots of snow. My point?
When evading, or performing fast tight manuevers, it is imperative that you, the driver, have total control of everything the car is doing. We all know that. And, this includes brakes and throttle. Did you ever try setting up a pendulum to make a gravel corner at >100 kph and have traction control kick in? Picture a foty thousand dollar MM sitting in several pieces in the woods if you did. Or, try making a reverse "J" (180) with ABS. No brakes, no slide, no longer in the middle of the road, but, rather, the ditch. This one happened to me in a new Explorer that I had completely forgotten had ABS. First vehicle to ever have it, and I was P__ed!
Too impractical an arguement? How about this?
Low speed, snow covered roads, read end the car in front of you at less than 5kph because the ABS refuses to let you modulate the brakes, but instead keeps the wheels rolling as per some Californian engineer's irrelevant algorithm. Exagerating? Not at all. You guys on the east coast and in the midwest know what I'm talking about. You've grown up driving in the white stuff. ABS at low speed is a law suit against Ford waiting to happen. I've already warned my lawyer (who in turn warned me not to even think about it - silly coward) that if I'm ever in a rear-ender in snow, sue Ford big-time.
OK. I've stepped away from the computer and wound down. Sorry about that.
May I say - more calmly now - that with the studded WinterTrac tires, and WITHOUT TC, the MM is phenominal in the snow. Ice is a battle with anything, and the MM is no better or worse than the rest. We can all handle this car without electronics, and should have a hoot doing so.
That is all. Let the bashing begin. :)
- David

[RR|Suki]

Hey folks,
I joined this thread rather late, but may I be permitted to offer my 2c worth? If so, read on. If not, please pass me by.
Growing up in Rural Nova Scotia, the passtime was not drinking, drugs, or partying. It was driving. Back roads, dirt or paved. Chases, tags, the whole lot. Very fast, very tricky. Often lots of snow. My point?
When evading, or performing fast tight manuevers, it is imperative that you, the driver, have total control of everything the car is doing. We all know that. And, this includes brakes and throttle. Did you ever try setting up a pendulum to make a gravel corner at >100 kph and have traction control kick in? Picture a foty thousand dollar MM sitting in several pieces in the woods if you did. Or, try making a reverse "J" (180) with ABS. No brakes, no slide, no longer in the middle of the road, but, rather, the ditch. This one happened to me in a new Explorer that I had completely forgotten had ABS. First vehicle to ever have it, and I was P__ed!
Too impractical an arguement? How about this?
Low speed, snow covered roads, read end the car in front of you at less than 5kph because the ABS refuses to let you modulate the brakes, but instead keeps the wheels rolling as per some Californian engineer's irrelevant algorithm. Exagerating? Not at all. You guys on the east coast and in the midwest know what I'm talking about. You've grown up driving in the white stuff. ABS at low speed is a law suit against Ford waiting to happen. I've already warned my lawyer (who in turn warned me not to even think about it - silly coward) that if I'm ever in a rear-ender in snow, sue Ford big-time.
OK. I've stepped away from the computer and wound down. Sorry about that.
May I say - more calmly now - that with the studded WinterTrac tires, and WITHOUT TC, the MM is phenominal in the snow. Ice is a battle with anything, and the MM is no better or worse than the rest. We can all handle this car without electronics, and should have a hoot doing so.
That is all. Let the bashing begin. :)
- David

quoted for truth

[merc6]

pulling abs fuse would also get rid of boosters right?

[DEFYANT]

Just do what I do.

Each and every time I get in the car, I automaticly hit the O/D off and T/C off. Even if i am just moving the car out of the garage, or going to the store.

Everytime.

If I hit the highway or reach cruising speed for extended periods of time, O/D is on.

It is to the point now that I do not even realize I hit the button.

[RCSignals]

Best I can figure Mac, and it isn't much, is that the electronic control module that is at the ABS control contains the electronics for ABS, or in the case of a car with TC, ABS and TC. So it may be a matter of not only disabling the eec, code, but changing that module.

Are you feeling brave?

[SergntMac]

Don't know Duncan, this gets confusing. Both Zack and I have 300As, with '04 EECs (MAV2) When Jerry set them up in April of '04, neither car has Traction Control, but the EEC does. We had to add some wires to the front harness for the second knock sensor, which is why I'm thinking that the Traction Control (to be activated) needs a hard line added too. Therefore, to deactivate it, remove the hard line? Make sense?

Doesn't matter, I'll do it Charlie's way. Much easier to train myself in turning it off, than cutting wires.

[RCSignals]

That does make sense. I'm sure in the electrical manual it shows two different control modules for '03 300As with ABS only, and 300Bs with both ABS and TC.
Probably all '03 eecs have the code for TC, but not necessarily the wire harness additions.
I don't know how different the '04 is in this area.

But I agree, it's easiest just to tune yourself to a routine.....

[metroplex]

I just leave Trac Ctrl on full-time. In the snow, my Traction-Lok differential does a decent job for take-off traction. However, the Traction-Lok helps reduce fishtailing. Knowing how to drive and actually having enough room/space to correct your car are 2 very different things. For ease of mind, I leave it on. If you're breaking loose your tires in 11" of snow, you either do not have snow tires or you're using too much gas. I do not have any issues with Trac Ctrl in the rain or dry pavement.

For the Crown Vics, you cannot disable TC via the PCM regardless of what the tuner says. On certain ABS systems (I think either TRW or Bosch, I forget which, but my 00 Vic has it) you can only disable the engine management portion of Trac Ctrl (which is controlled by the PCM) but the ABS portion is separate as it is part of the ABS module! Again, I leave it on full-time unless I'm drag racing. It isn't needed, but it was only $135. I have a switch on my dashboard in case I need to disable it. I only had to do that once because the car was bogged down in about 16" of mush and I wasn't going anywhere. My new strategy when it comes to heavy unplowed snow is to stay home. It's quite simple!

[metroplex]

[QUOTE=Zack]http://www.mercurymarauder.net/showcase/files/4/0/4/TCoff.bmp

As simple as changing the 55 to a 0.
Gotta love SCT

Well, we tried this yesterday on Macs car and it did not work.
Im gonna hunt around the software and see if I can manipulate it elsewhere.
Im sure the TC is activated by a relay under the dash and unhooking it would be the easiest fix.
Or a dedicated fuse maybe?


That's because you can't do that on certain vehicles. I believe this works fine on a Stang, but setting the TC to "0" only disables engine management. The ABS part of TC is still active. BTW the two digits "55" represent the rear axle ratio (3.55 = 55)

I have verified this with SCT and I cannot completely disable TC using the SCT Pro Racer Package on my 2000 Vic due to the TRW? ABS system.

[RCSignals]

Thanks Metro.

That's what I was trying to say about the ABS modules, but I think they made changes to the TC system for 2003. (Which is why there was a delay in availability)