Kool-Aid?

[O's Fan Rich]

drink the Kool-Aid v. To become a firm believer in something; to accept an argument or philosophy wholeheartedly or blindly.

Example Citation:
One top executive named McMahon, the treasurer, was known for going around the company after he met with Skilling, Lay, and Fastow, and they directed him to do some bogus deal and say, 'Well, we've all got to go drink the Kool-Aid.'
—William Lerach, quoted in Marie Brenner, "The Enron Wars," Vanity Fair, April, 2002

Earliest Citation:
You don't follow anyone blindly, my brothers and sisters . . . . We love Marion Barry. He is the mayor . . . . But if Marion Barry disrespects us, we will cry out . . . . We will not blindly drink the Kool-Aid any longer . . . .
—Cathy Hughes, transcript from a radio call-in show as reported in "Being Stood Up by Mayor Leaves Radio Host Fuming," The Washington Post, July 17, 1987

Notes:
This phrase comes from the 1978 "Jonestown massacre" in which members of the Peoples Temple cult committed suicide by drinking cyanide-laced Kool-Aid (although some say the drink of choice was actually Flav-R-Aid).

Discuss.....

[Paul T. Casey]

New Citation: To firmly believe, in April, the Orioles will stand any chance of be in front of the Yankees come September. (Sorry, but it's baseball season again.)

[O's Fan Rich]

New Citation: To firmly believe, in April, the Orioles will stand any chance of be in front of the Yankees come September. (Sorry, but it's baseball season again.)

Ahhhh, all we need is Mussina to pitch every third game....:baaa: :baaa:

[SergntMac]

If this thread is still open 24 hours from now, I'll add some input.

[Tallboy]

drink the Kool-Aid v. To become a firm believer in something; to accept an argument or philosophy wholeheartedly or blindly.

Example Citation:
One top executive named McMahon, the treasurer, was known for going around the company after he met with Skilling, Lay, and Fastow, and they directed him to do some bogus deal and say, 'Well, we've all got to go drink the Kool-Aid.'
—William Lerach, quoted in Marie Brenner, "The Enron Wars," Vanity Fair, April, 2002

Earliest Citation:
You don't follow anyone blindly, my brothers and sisters . . . . We love Marion Barry. He is the mayor . . . . But if Marion Barry disrespects us, we will cry out . . . . We will not blindly drink the Kool-Aid any longer . . . .
—Cathy Hughes, transcript from a radio call-in show as reported in "Being Stood Up by Mayor Leaves Radio Host Fuming," The Washington Post, July 17, 1987

Notes:
This phrase comes from the 1978 "Jonestown massacre" in which members of the Peoples Temple cult committed suicide by drinking cyanide-laced Kool-Aid (although some say the drink of choice was actually Flav-R-Aid).

Discuss.....

How 'bout this?

"Rich, it looks like you've been doing a lot of research on which supercharger to buy."

"You must be tired. And thirsty."

"Here, drink this...:drink: You'll feel better."

[O's Fan Rich]

Kool aid consumption can be based on negative information and general rumor.
Often this flavor results in mis-information being delivered to an unsuspecting consumer. When this occurs, the Kool-Aid becomes a bitter potion that adversly affects both drinker and the target of the negative info, obviously. But often what is not accounted for is the negative effect it has on the provider of the Kool-Aid. For that one experiences a loss of reputation that is often irrepairable. (For instance, how many have a positive view of Jim Jones? Adolf Hitler?)
Therefore I firmly believe that one must use discernment when deciding to pass the cup around, lest he suffer a fate worse than death, the loss of good repute!

On the other hand, Kool-Aid consumption can be based of well informed and documented positive information and factual events or proofs. This flavor results in real benefit to the consumer of the liquid allowing for that one to reach his decison without causing damage to himself or reaching an unwise conclusion. When this occurs there is no negative result for both drinker and the target of the information. The provider of the Kool-Aid has now put himself in the position of providing true refreshment to the drinker and the target. This can only bring that one increases in stature and a feeling of a job well done. This definantly provides a sense of deep satisfaction to the provider.
This one can pass the cup with the certainty that he is building for himself a good reputation that will glow beyond the initial topic.


BTW, I'm partial to Raspberry.

[Dan]

"Drink the Kool-Aid" started out with a very negative connotation. Back in the Jonestown days it was never said in a positive light. Now it is used by people who are saying, "I walk the walk."

There is an older expression that this happened to, as well. The expression, "In like Flynn" is now almost exclusively used to signify that you are "on top of your game" or "very well established.'

The funny thing about this is that during Erol Flynn's day "all in" or "in" was used to describe feeling low, meloncholy or depression. Erol Flynn went through a period of deep depression which was well known. Thus the expression.

Best,

Dan

[Krytin]

Very well put Rich!
I think that sometimes we ARE asked to "drink the Kool-Aid" as you put it.
At that point it is easy to fly off the handle and go into a "rant" but all people involved are better served with a simple straight forward and open discussion of the facts w/out any disparaging remarks.

"You chose wisely."

I must try the Raspberry!

[MikesMerc]

I beleive "drinking the Kool-Aid" has always had negative connotations, still does, and always will. The posts above cover the roots of the expression well enough (Jonestown). But I do not believe the expresssion has changed in meaning at all from the original point.

"drinking the Kool-Aid" still means buying into a idea, thought, or philosophy, without any self thought. In other words, blindly following.

As for what it means around here. The story is simple. Someone on this board, who shall remain nameless, posted yet another a disparaging comment about MV-III last year a few weeks before the event, cautioning would be attendees "not to drink the Kool-Aid." As usual, it was a just another shot at the MCM group, Trilogy, and its customers.

Many of the MCMers, as well as many other Trilogy customers, found the comment simply hilarious. There was already 100 happy customers that felt even better with their decision after they installed the Trilogy blower and knew first hand the quality of the kit and the performance it delivered. Accordingly, many felt that if their well informed, and well thought out decisions as to SC choice that turned out so positively was tantamount to "drinking the kool-aid", well then, so be it! Go ahead and bring on the big guy carrying a pitchure of the stuff!! LOL...since then many Trilogy have adopted the motto! Its quite funny IMO.

[KillJoy]

Mmmmmm...... Grape Kool-Aid....

KillJoy

[metroplex]

Colt Kool-Aid drinkers are the ones that think Colt AR-15 and parts are THE only parts and rifles to get. :help:

[Dan]

I beleive "drinking the Kool-Aid" has always had negative connotations, still does, and always will. The posts above cover the roots of the expression well enough (Jonestown). But I do not believe the expresssion has changed in meaning at all from the original point.

"drinking the Kool-Aid" still means buying into a idea, thought, or philosophy, without any self thought. In other words, blindly following.

As for what it means around here. The story is simple. Someone on this board, who shall remain nameless, posted yet another a disparaging comment about MV-III last year a few weeks before the event, cautioning would be attendees "not to drink the Kool-Aid." As usual, it was a just another shot at the MCM group, Trilogy, and its customers.

Many of the MCMers, as well as many other Trilogy customers, found the comment simply hilarious. There was already 100 happy customers that felt even better with their decision after they installed the Trilogy blower and knew first hand the quality of the kit and the performance it delivered. Accordingly, many felt that if their well informed, and well thought out decisions as to SC choice that turned out so positively was tantamount to "drinking the kool-aid", well then, so be it! Go ahead and bring on the big guy carrying a pitchure of the stuff!! LOL...since then many Trilogy have adopted the motto! Its quite funny IMO.
Thanks for the back story on this. I have heard more than one person who is considered an expert in their field use the term "I drink my own Kool-Aid" to mean that they practice what they preach.

It is in this context that I have heard it used in a positive sense.

Best,

Dan

[Festus]

Notes:
This phrase comes from the 1978 "Jonestown massacre" in which members of the Peoples Temple cult committed suicide by drinking cyanide-laced Kool-Aid (although some say the drink of choice was actually Flav-R-Aid).

Discuss.....

Interestingly, I had forgotten about this until recently when I found the reference to it in my father's passport. My father, who passed away last year was in the U.S. Secret Service. The mass suicide at Jonestown occurred after Democratic Congressman Leo Ryan went to Jonestown to investigate human rights abuses, torture and people being held against their will by the Jonestown cult.

Long story short, after a number of Jonestown residents decided to leave with Ryan, Jimmy Jones had the Congressman and his entourage assassinated. Apparantly, Jimmy Jones realized that the ***** was going to hit the fan from this, had everyone commit suicide, or murdered, by drinking cyanide laced kool-aid or shot. The assassination of Ryan was caught on film by a cameraman in Ryan's entourage who got away.

President Jimmy Carter was privately incensed, imagine that of Jimmy Carter, over this and sent team down to investigate it and report back to him. My father was in charge of the Secret Service protection detail sent to protect the group. When they left the suicide wasn't fully confirmed and they didn't know what they were going to find when they got there.

[Tallboy]

Personally, I don't know a Trilogy owner who is offended by the "Kool-Aid" thing. I happen to think it's funny as hell, and refer to it often. Now, if you'll excuse me, it's time for a glass of my favorite, the old stand-by, "Fruit Punch"! :drink:

[shakes_26]

MMhhhhMMM My favorite flavor 'Fruit Punch'!



Personally, I don't know a Trilogy owner who is offended by the "Kool-Aid" thing. I happen to think it's funny as hell, and refer to it often. Now, if you'll excuse me, it's time for a glass of my favorite, the old stand-by, "Fruit Punch"! :drink:

[O's Fan Rich]

I DO NOT want this to turn into a S/C war at all.

My idea is to get us thinking about how we view, approach, conclude, discuss, receive, dispense, the information we have/get/ask for.

I know that I have gotten many useful tidbits of info sent to me and discussed with me via the phone. I am very thankful for the input.
I keep what I want, and discard what I don't. I also refuse to cast dispersions upon peoples choices or thoughts, as I am a moron, and require assistance alot.

[O's Fan Rich]

Interestingly, I had forgotten about this until recently when I found the reference to it in my father's passport. My father, who passed away last year was in the U.S. Secret Service. The mass suicide at Jonestown occurred after Democratic Congressman Leo Ryan went to Jonestown to investigate human rights abuses, torture and people being held against their will by the Jonestown cult.

Long story short, after a number of Jonestown residents decided to leave with Ryan, Jimmy Jones had the Congressman and his entourage assassinated. Apparantly, Jimmy Jones realized that the ***** was going to hit the fan from this, had everyone commit suicide, or murdered, by drinking cyanide laced kool-aid or shot. The assassination of Ryan was caught on film by a cameraman in Ryan's entourage who got away.

President Jimmy Carter was privately incensed, imagine that of Jimmy Carter, over this and sent team down to investigate it and report back to him. My father was in charge of the Secret Service protection detail sent to protect the group. When they left the suicide wasn't fully confirmed and they didn't know what they were going to find when they got there.

I'd have loved to talk to your Dad at length. I'm sure you miss him more than you could explain.

[MikesMerc]

Personally, I don't know a Trilogy owner who is offended by the "Kool-Aid" thing.

Neither do I. In fact, the Kool-Aid phrase for Trilogy owners has evolved to represent the immense positive customer satisfaction and resulting brand loyalty than anything negative. So, what started out as a negative comment has been turned into a positive. Its all in good fun now.



I DO NOT want this to turn into a S/C war at all.


And it shouldn't. I hope I did not offend. All I was doing is explaining the reason for the sudden increase in the "Kool-Aid" phrase here on mm.net. I've received a few PMs asking about the "inside kool-aid joke" so I thought this was an opportunity to elaborate.

[Bluerauder]

.. so I thought this was an opportunity to elaborate.
Your effort to fill the "rest of us" in is appreciated !! :)

[mcb26]

I thought it had something to do with the Grateful Dead and the Electric Kool-Aid Acid test. :drink: The art of mixing LSD and/or Mushrooms in Kool-Aid.
Not that I have ever done anything like that. WOW LOOK AT THAT CLOUD.
Where was I? Oh yeah never mind.

[Festus]

I'd have loved to talk to your Dad at length. I'm sure you miss him more than you could explain.

Yeah I do. He told me some of his work, but most of it went with him.
He was in the Secret Service from Kennedy to Bush 41. He lived a life that was truly remarkable. Some of it I didn't find out about until after he died, from my mother and from his old personnel file.

He was there at the White House for the Cuban Missile Crisis, the Bay of Pigs, the Kennedy assassination, Watergate, Nixon's resignation, the Iranian Hostages, Desert-1, the Reagan assassination attempt, Iran-Contra, Gulf War 1, the fall of the Soviet Union, etc. He helped design Kennedy's Limo, he was on Johnson's personal protection detail, he was at the 68 Democratic Convention and was part of the arrest of the Chicago 7, he went with Nixon to China and Moscow, he went to Vietnam and Cambodia with Kissinger, he was there when Squeaky Fromme tried to assassinate Jerry Ford, he was at the Camp David Accords with Carter,he went to Guyana following Jonestown, he was in Iceland when Reagan first met Gorbachev, and he was in Berlin when Reagan said "Tear down this wall." To name but a few of the amazing things he was a part of.

I mentioned his passport before. I have one of his passports from those days. I say one of the passports, because most people replace passports when the expire, he replaced passports when it ran out of room for stamps. The passport I have is a Diplomatic Passport that must have more than 200 stamps in it from just about any country you can name. Some of the stamps are from historical events, like Jonestown, Moscow and China.

After the bombing of the Marine Barracks in Beirut in 1983 the White House was radically altered to protect from various types of terrorist attacks. He was in charge of that overhaul and was ultimately promoted to being in charge of all security for the White House complex until he retired.

One thing that blew me away, that I didn't find out about until recently was that our house was bugged during Watergate. Dad found several bugs in the house and it scared him. They were illegally planted and he never found out who did it. He left them alone but he and mom had to be very careful about what they said and did around the house. They never told me, which is a good thing as I was only 9 at the time, I'd want to put the bugs in a jar. Eventually, the bugs just went away on their own. But can you imagine what that must have been like?

[Bowman9]

Yeah I do. He told me some of his work, but most of it went with him.
He was in the Secret Service from Kennedy to Bush 41. He lived a life that was truly remarkable. Some of it I didn't find out about until after he died, from my mother and from his old personnel file.

He was there at the White House for the Cuban Missile Crisis, the Bay of Pigs, the Kennedy assassination, Watergate, Nixon's resignation, the Iranian Hostages, Desert-1, the Reagan assassination attempt, Iran-Contra, Gulf War 1, the fall of the Soviet Union, etc. He helped design Kennedy's Limo, he was on Johnson's personal protection detail, he was at the 68 Democratic Convention and was part of the arrest of the Chicago 7, he went with Nixon to China and Moscow, he went to Vietnam and Cambodia with Kissinger, he was there when Squeaky Fromme tried to assassinate Jerry Ford, he was at the Camp David Accords with Carter,he went to Guyana following Jonestown, he was in Iceland when Reagan first met Gorbachev, and he was in Berlin when Reagan said "Tear down this wall." To name but a few of the amazing things he was a part of.

I mentioned his passport before. I have one of his passports from those days. I say one of the passports, because most people replace passports when the expire, he replaced passports when it ran out of room for stamps. The passport I have is a Diplomatic Passport that must have more than 200 stamps in it from just about any country you can name. Some of the stamps are from historical events, like Jonestown, Moscow and China.

After the bombing of the Marine Barracks in Beirut in 1983 the White House was radically altered to protect from various types of terrorist attacks. He was in charge of that overhaul and was ultimately promoted to being in charge of all security for the White House complex until he retired.

One thing that blew me away, that I didn't find out about until recently was that our house was bugged during Watergate. Dad found several bugs in the house and it scared him. They were illegally planted and he never found out who did it. He left them alone but he and mom had to be very careful about what they said and did around the house. They never told me, which is a good thing as I was only 9 at the time, I'd want to put the bugs in a jar. Eventually, the bugs just went away on their own. But can you imagine what that must have been like?

All I can say is Wow!!!
Just imagine what he did that you don't know about.

[Bowman9]

We used the expression "drink the kool-aid" at one of my jobs.
Because management was always changing procedures with no explanation and we were just to do what we were told.

[BUCKWHEAT]

Jerry, can we have seconds?

[CBT]

Yeah I do. He told me some of his work, but most of it went with him.
He was in the Secret Service from Kennedy to Bush 41. He lived a life that was truly remarkable. Some of it I didn't find out about until after he died, from my mother and from his old personnel file.

He was there at the White House for the Cuban Missile Crisis, the Bay of Pigs, the Kennedy assassination, Watergate, Nixon's resignation, the Iranian Hostages, Desert-1, the Reagan assassination attempt, Iran-Contra, Gulf War 1, the fall of the Soviet Union, etc. He helped design Kennedy's Limo, he was on Johnson's personal protection detail, he was at the 68 Democratic Convention and was part of the arrest of the Chicago 7, he went with Nixon to China and Moscow, he went to Vietnam and Cambodia with Kissinger, he was there when Squeaky Fromme tried to assassinate Jerry Ford, he was at the Camp David Accords with Carter,he went to Guyana following Jonestown, he was in Iceland when Reagan first met Gorbachev, and he was in Berlin when Reagan said "Tear down this wall." To name but a few of the amazing things he was a part of.

I mentioned his passport before. I have one of his passports from those days. I say one of the passports, because most people replace passports when the expire, he replaced passports when it ran out of room for stamps. The passport I have is a Diplomatic Passport that must have more than 200 stamps in it from just about any country you can name. Some of the stamps are from historical events, like Jonestown, Moscow and China.

After the bombing of the Marine Barracks in Beirut in 1983 the White House was radically altered to protect from various types of terrorist attacks. He was in charge of that overhaul and was ultimately promoted to being in charge of all security for the White House complex until he retired.

One thing that blew me away, that I didn't find out about until recently was that our house was bugged during Watergate. Dad found several bugs in the house and it scared him. They were illegally planted and he never found out who did it. He left them alone but he and mom had to be very careful about what they said and did around the house. They never told me, which is a good thing as I was only 9 at the time, I'd want to put the bugs in a jar. Eventually, the bugs just went away on their own. But can you imagine what that must have been like?Sounds like his life story would make a great book or movie.

[Hotrauder]

I don't drink the cool-aid...I live it...for the boost! Anytime I need reasurrance that the KOOL-AID works...I just have to get the keys. Thanks Jerry, Claude, Chuck, Marc and Lidio...KOOL-AID Brewmeisters Supreme. Dennis :drink: :drink: :burn:

[Festus]

Sounds like his life story would make a great book or movie.

He was approached more than once for just that. He always turned them away because he took an oath and would say, "It's called the Secret Service for a reason."

He was retired by the time Clinton was in office and he was approached by a couple of the cable news channels to be a talking head. He didn't feel right about that.

[CBT]

Well it sounds like he got out at the perfect time, some of us had to serve under Clinton.:mad::censor: :mad::censor: :mad::censor: The only good thing that ever came out of Arkansas is I-40!! And my 1981 Z-28!!

[Jerry Barnes]

I beleive "drinking the Kool-Aid" has always had negative connotations, still does, and always will. The posts above cover the roots of the expression well enough (Jonestown). But I do not believe the expresssion has changed in meaning at all from the original point.

"drinking the Kool-Aid" still means buying into a idea, thought, or philosophy, without any self thought. In other words, blindly following.

As for what it means around here. The story is simple. Someone on this board, who shall remain nameless, posted yet another a disparaging comment about MV-III last year a few weeks before the event, cautioning would be attendees "not to drink the Kool-Aid." As usual, it was a just another shot at the MCM group, Trilogy, and its customers.

Many of the MCMers, as well as many other Trilogy customers, found the comment simply hilarious. There was already 100 happy customers that felt even better with their decision after they installed the Trilogy blower and knew first hand the quality of the kit and the performance it delivered. Accordingly, many felt that if their well informed, and well thought out decisions as to SC choice that turned out so positively was tantamount to "drinking the kool-aid", well then, so be it! Go ahead and bring on the big guy carrying a pitchure of the stuff!! LOL...since then many Trilogy have adopted the motto! Its quite funny IMO.

I agree completely with Mike. The comment was meant to be very negative for the MCM Club, Trilogy and its customers, but it has turned out to be just the opposite. It has turned out to be one of the funniest things we talk about. The reference to tragic events in our history and the relationship to our product or our customers is very sad and at first bothered me a lot. But, when you consider the source of the comments, it takes on a completely different meaning.

I personally do not give people a high pressure sales pitch to buy our products, nor do I encourage others to do it. I hope everyone does their homework and picks the products that best suits their needs. As I have said before, "it's a lot of money to spend on a performence upgrade to your car". Make sure it is what you want and you feel you have made the right decision.

As for my competitors, they have great products also! And at the end of the day are we enjoying our cars with our friends and families?

Some people mix alchohol and the internet and you get irrational comments and non-factual information thrown into the publics eye. The majority of people that have common sense recognize it for what it is, miscellaneous ramblings, and disgard the remarks.

But, after reading the one gentlemans comments about his father being in the Secret Service, it made me think seriously about the sacrifices people have made, so that others will have the freedoms to say what they want and not be punished for expressing their views. And when you think of the people in the Armed Services and other branches of government that protect our freedoms, arguing over what type of supercharger to buy seems pretty ridiculous.

Everyone should enjoy the right to be different and enjoy the Marauder Meetings that happen!

Just one persons opinion.

But, the Kool-Aid thing is pretty funny here in Detroit.

Jerry

[Dan]

It seems that more than one person is familier with the positive side of the term.

I guess it started out as something like this, "blindly follow the message - the message is BAD" to "follow the message."

My thinking is that is the message is good I can also "drink the Kool Aid."

Jerry, you should find a hidden place on your SC kits to engrace the Kool Aid guy. Either that or engrave something like the next 20 and sell them as "The Kool Aid Series." Now, just think about that for a second. What kind of a "go screw yourself" message would that be to the original "drink the Kool Aid" accuser?

Best,

Dan

PS: Let's have another supercharger war, please. This site needs a kick in the pants. :)

[Jerry Barnes]

It seems that more than one person is familier with the positive side of the term.

I guess it started out as something like this, "blindly follow the message - the message is BAD" to "follow the message."

My thinking is that is the message is good I can also "drink the Kool Aid."

Jerry, you should find a hidden place on your SC kits to engrace the Kool Aid guy. Either that or engrave something like the next 20 and sell them as "The Kool Aid Series." Now, just think about that for a second. What kind of a "go screw yourself" message would that be to the original "drink the Kool Aid" accuser?

Best,

Dan

PS: Let's have another supercharger war, please. This site needs a kick in the pants. :)

Dan,

Yes, the Kool-Aid term has grown to be a very positive thing for us and our customers. We have a lot of laughs at that term these days. Mike Z. uses it as his avatar and every time I see it I chuckle to myself.

I think we should have races wars, not supercharger wars. It seems to be less personal and more fun. I hear MartyO may have gotten into the 10's today. That's a great bit of competition, I am looking forward to chasing Marty.

Have a good one!

Jerry

[Hotrauder]

Jerry, come on down. Thanks to your generosity and the Tallboy connection to the STARS we will have a PARTY on the 21st. at Bradenton. My understanding is that the City Water Tower will have 6.5 million gallons of Fruit Punch KOOL-AID on hand..just for us. :drink: :drink: :drink: :drink: We won't run any 10's BUT we will have fun. Thanks. Dennis