Another 5.4 question

[jdando]

Not that I want to do it, but a hypothetical question.


While looking at the Ford GT yesterday, it appears that it has a dry sump engine. What does the oilpan on a dry-sump engine look like? Whould this help with the overall height/hood clearance issues of stuffing a 5.4L engine in the Marauder?

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/showcase/files/3/1/0/2/gtside2.jpg

jeremy

[SergntMac]

I don't think a dry sump oiler will change things. The 5.4 has a taller deck height which won't fit in a Marauder without serious modifications to the stock engine bay. This has been, and will continue to be the one hang up in loading a 5.4 in a panther frame.

[O's Fan Rich]

Not that I want to do it, but a hypothetical question.


While looking at the Ford GT yesterday, it appears that it has a dry sump engine. What does the oilpan on a dry-sump engine look like? Whould this help with the overall height/hood clearance issues of stuffing a 5.4L engine in the Marauder?

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/showcase/files/3/1/0/2/gtside2.jpg

jeremy

Yesterday, I found this pic of a SN95 Mustang with the Lightning setup
http://www.mmperformanceonline.com/Customer%20Cars/Customers%20Cars.htm

Looking at that kinda makes me rethink the whole 5.4 deal.

[cyclone03]

Good question.
My answer is it depends.
In a dry sump engine the oil is held in a seperate tank out of the engine.Scavenge lines run from the pan,and maybe even the heads through the pump and back to the tank,a pressure line runs out of the tank to the pump and into the engine.

IF the area of the "pan" can be made to run close to the swinging crank and rods in the area right above the crossmember the engine "could" be lowered,how much?Don't know.The trans mount would also have to be lowered the same amount.
How much room do we need? 2-3" or more? I don't know.

But it may help.
But the $$$!!!!

[94_302]

An n/a 5.4 will fit in a mustang under a cowl hood. It's just the Lightning setup, with the intake coming over the top of the blower that requires you to chop the hood (pretty sure). Anyways I think this would be a better swap than a 5.4 in the Marauder. 6.9L 422 CID V-10 (http://www.bv10motors.com/) :bows:

[Breadfan]

You'd have to drop it too far for it to clear. I think the problem lies in the deck height, as mentioned, which basically causes the engine to not just be taller but wider too. It's a "V" so the furtherst points are the two top ends of the "V". Making the V taller you also make the top point further apart.

In our engine bays towards the back you'd probably be hitting the A/C lines, blower motor, wiper assemblies, etc. Think of the firewall and all the things very close to the valve covers. the new ones, even if the engine was lowered, would be further apart than our current engines, thus causing a problem.

I think you'd have to remove or relocate the A/C and heater inlets, blower motor, maybe refabricate the firewall too.

An alternative would be to move the engine physically forward to clear...but not sure you'd be able to get it forward enough without relocating the radiator or putting the fans on the other side. Plus you'd have to get a new driveshaft, relocate the transmision crossmember, new engine mounts, maybe fab the frame, etc etc.

Then your car will be front heavy with the bulk of the engine pushed forward.

Now, one thing I'd wonder if you could do would be to physically rotate the engine assembly. If you have more room on the drivers side, let the drivers side head sit sidewayes while the passenger side head is more vertical maybe clearing obstructions. But I don't know how an engine and trans would like to run that way, especially with factory oiling systems! (I guess for your engine it'd be like running on a NASCAR track all the time on your drive to work...sans racing oiling system.)

So all in all, YES it's possible if someone wanted to do it but you're going to find a fair amount of engineering hurdles to cross. It won't be a drop in and go affair.

[SergntMac]

^^^Ditto^^^ I agree with Breadfan's summary.

Nothing is impossible, it comes down to how much you want to spend, and what you're going to get for your money.

I said it in the last discussion of this topic...If it were possible at a reasonable expense, Ford would do it and market the car to police/public safety. The fact that they do not, kind of tells me that the necessary modifications are too costly in the overall program.

[ctrlraven]

Anything is possible just depends on how much you are willing to invest time and moneywise into something. I mean look at the Ford Focus and their RWD V8 conversion kits.

[SergntMac]

I mean look at the Ford Focus and their RWD V8 conversion kits. Indeed...You don't know how bad I want to build one of those cars.

http://www.kugelkomponents.com/focus/focus.html

[Marauderjack]

Also, Ford has to look at fuel economy and I would think the 5.4L engine would be worse than ours??:confused: It's kind of tough to please everyone especially the GOVERNMENT!!:cool:

I'd hate to be in charge of a large car manufacturing company these days....basic "Bidness" says.....sell a bunch of safe, fuel efficient units at a reasonable profit.....Sounds easy until you try to figure out what folks want!!:shake:

I don't think any Execs will put their eggs in the Muscle Car basket these days....I'm just glad Ford "Screwed Up" and made our cars...It may never happen again folks!!:shake:

Marauderjack:D :burnout:

[O's Fan Rich]

Indeed...You don't know how bad I want to build one of those cars.

http://www.kugelkomponents.com/focus/focus.html

Mac... we got two 2002 Focus wagons ready to retire from our service fleet... you know what I'm thinkin'!!!!

[dwasson]

Not that I want to do it, but a hypothetical question.


Admit it, you really wanna do it.

[jdando]

You'd have to drop it too far for it to clear. I think the problem lies in the deck height, as mentioned, which basically causes the engine to not just be taller but wider too. It's a "V" so the furtherst points are the two top ends of the "V". Making the V taller you also make the top point further apart.


So it is a girth not length problem, wink, wink.:rolleyes:


Admit it, you really wanna do it.
no, not really. The Ford GT just got me wondering.

later,
jeremy

[SergntMac]

Mac... we got two 2002 Focus wagons ready to retire from our service fleet... you know what I'm thinkin'!!!!Yes, I do.

Stop that!

I've been looking into this for a while, it's quite tempting. Start with a brand new Focus with all the trimmings, add a Cobra/Mach I powertrain, get to wrenching. It adds up to about 35K, but what an eye opener, eh?

[cyclone03]

Yes, I do.

Stop that!

I've been looking into this for a while, it's quite tempting. Start with a brand new Focus with all the trimmings, add a Cobra/Mach I powertrain, get to wrenching. It adds up to about 35K, but what an eye opener, eh?


Sounds like the perfect winter car to me!


Funney how the old V8 Vega was so much easier....

[BigCars4Ever]

An n/a 5.4 will fit in a mustang under a cowl hood. It's just the Lightning setup, with the intake coming over the top of the blower that requires you to chop the hood (pretty sure). Anyways I think this would be a better swap than a 5.4 in the Marauder. 6.9L 422 CID V-10 (http://www.bv10motors.com/) :bows:
There's more than one Crown Vic running a blown triton V-10 under a stock hood. Plenty of room in a Panther chassis.