Stock stereo huge bass????

[CanadaMarauder]

So.I like the clean look of the stock headunit and don't really want to spend tons of $$ on a Nav setup but I miss the bass.Right now I'm running a single 12 off the stock amp...meh it works and it's ok BUT can I run a larger amp from the stock head unit...do i require a Line level converter and run it off the rear speakers or can I use the stock amp input as a source or am i just wasting my time.

The only thing about using the stock amp as a source if it's possible is that the bass max's out at 3/4 volume...I want more.

If anyone has done it please let me know the setup/converter your running

Thanx in advance

[pantheroc]

I just soldered the signal wires to an RCA plug and plugged it right into a sub amp. Works great!

[KillJoy]

Ask Magindat this question. He will tell you the "correct" way to install an aftermarket amp and sub into the MM.

KillJoy

PS - I have EVERYTHING required to to so. I would be will ing to part with it, if interested. ;)

[magindat]

Only problem with straight RCA is you are only getting HALF the signal. The input to the factory amp is balanced (no RCA shield to ground). KillJoy is right. I have, in the past, instructed on how to get this done correctly for ALL the signal. However, I have discovered MTX amps with RCA turn on will work with a balanced RCA wired in, Y'ed and do NOT need a separate turn on. They sense the RCA voltage.

Buy an MTX amp from John Kuhn. Ask someone who has one of my harnesses or has followed my instructions for the right colors for RCA (I don't remember). Wire it up and go.

Gotta love how technology continues to march on!!

[RF Overlord]

Rich, how do you have a "balanced" RCA connector? They only have one signal terminal...

[pantheroc]

Only problem with straight RCA is you are only getting HALF the signal. The input to the factory amp is balanced (no RCA shield to ground). KillJoy is right. I have, in the past, instructed on how to get this done correctly for ALL the signal. However, I have discovered MTX amps with RCA turn on will work with a balanced RCA wired in, Y'ed and do NOT need a separate turn on. They sense the RCA voltage.

Buy an MTX amp from John Kuhn. Ask someone who has one of my harnesses or has followed my instructions for the right colors for RCA (I don't remember). Wire it up and go.

Gotta love how technology continues to march on!!

You're right. Luckily, my RCA input on the amp is not grounded.

[magindat]

Rich, how do you have a "balanced" RCA connector? They only have one signal terminal...

Balanced has a slightly different meaning/usage in auto due to the presence of 12v- ground.

Balanced on the RCA means potential between the pin and shield (usually 0-5V), but the shield is NOT ground. Both pin and shield will show potential to ground where 'unbalanced' will show potential to ground only on the pin and not on the shield. Auto RCA started out same as studio, but evolved into the shield being grounded since the AC signal below 12v would run on the DC ground. This was common in (and evolved from) old stereos where the neg speaker term was ground and only need a pos. Cheaper, yes, but a source of noise and under power, only good to about 15W peak and 5WRMS. Radios designated 'High Power' eliminated the neg term to ground, but grounded RCA persists today as a norm. It is now considered 'high end' to have a 'balanced' signal in a car.

In order for a modern (auto) amp to accept the 'balanced' signal, it needs to lift the shield from ground. Although I have not studied the MTX circuitry, I believe the same circuit that senses the RCA voltage in order to turn on the amp (removing the need for a separate 12v+ remote trigger) also lifts the RCA from ground, allowing the amp to 'see' both sides of the balanced signal and not dump the shield to hard ground thus giving the amp only 'half' the signal.

The signal to the factory amp in the Marauder IS balanced by the above definition. I have celled on it, tested it, confirmed it and discussed it with and Alpine certified Ford repair shop.

The penalty for not paying attention to the signal is deeper, muddy, bass with a decided lack of precision. It'll sound fine for most, with the sound rattling around in our big ol' trunk, but those in the know would wonder what was wrong. The reason for the lack of precision would be the 'push' without the 'pull'. For example the sub gets the message to go out, but not the message to come back. It only comes back because it's suspension (and hopefully air cushion in the enclosure) say to. The SIGNAL is supposed to say 'go out' and 'come back'. The result of this 'half' control is muddy bass with no precision.

[magindat]

You're right. Luckily, my RCA input on the amp is not grounded.

What kind of amp? If that's true, it's unusual and I'll add your amp to my known good amps for our cars!!!!

[rvaldez1]

What kind of amp? If that's true, it's unusual and I'll add your amp to my known good amps for our cars!!!!

Rich, I am not sure I am following you here. Are you saying that the actual RCA signal wire has to be grounded, like in the OOOOLLLLDDDD school amps?

[magindat]

Nope, just the opposite. It's only recently amps are being made WITHOUT the RCA grounded (whether directly or resistively) internally. Grounded RCA shield isn't so OLD SKOOL as you'd think. It's more like CHEAP these days.

[rvaldez1]

Nope, just the opposite. It's only recently amps are being made WITHOUT the RCA grounded (whether directly or resistively) internally. Grounded RCA shield isn't so OLD SKOOL as you'd think. It's more like CHEAP these days.

I got ya Rich, I was under the impression that you were suggesting the signal wire ITSELF was to be grounded. You have to remember OLD for me is anything pre 2000.

[magindat]

I got ya Rich, I was under the impression that you were suggesting the signal wire ITSELF was to be grounded. You have to remember OLD for me is anything pre 2000.

HA HA!!! Old for me is my 1982 K40 6 channel (yes K40 made amps back then) that took speaker level in the RCA or my 1986 Linear Power 5002 that's running my sub TODAY!!!! Yep, I have a hand modified 21 year-old 994W tested (500W rated) amp running TODAY in my car!!!

Many middle aged amps of the late 90's had a resistive ground internally to try to correct for noise by anticipating (guesstimating) the potential difference between your radio ground and amp ground. Trouble is, that's impossible to get right 100% of the time, forcing many to ground the RCA shields to prevent noise.

Even today, Audio Control factory integration products contain a switch for this very reason. The selections are 'float', like 2 ohms, 20 ohms, and dead short for RCA to ground. They are also, balanced/unbalanced switchable.

[rvaldez1]

Cool, thanks Rich.

Back to action... Why use the stock sub wiring when all that is needed is a Line-out convertor, and possibly a signal amplifier?? When I had a stock headunit all I had was a lineout from PAC-Audio. The TRUNK LOC is an all in one unit, remote and all to compensate for any amp.

[magindat]

Because the rear speakers are high passed at 100HZ in the stock stereo. How you gonna get bass from a high pass signal with no bass in it?!

[magindat]

PLUS, why do that (for non-high pass stock systems) when it's built into the MTX amps in the first place?!

[rvaldez1]

Because the rear speakers are high passed at 100HZ in the stock stereo. How you gonna get bass from a high pass signal with no bass in it?!


OK, that makes sense, but I have to disagree with you a bit Rich. I was comfortably hitting 60hz with my trunk-loc connected. Dont get me wrong, I agree with you 100% that there are better ways. I was just getting more options out there.

[rvaldez1]

PLUS, why do that (for non-high pass stock systems) when it's built into the MTX amps in the first place?!

Granted you will be buying a MTX amp. I think you will agree that MTX is great when you are not on a budget, but there are comprable cheaper solutions.

[Aren Jay]

That is why I'm not following this very well.

Old school for me is my Old Hifi from the 60's.
(Wish I still had it)

[VAmarauder03]

ok guys im kinda lost as stereo **** and me mix like oil and water...it gets me every time, my question is what is the simplest easiest cheapest way to get an aftermarket sub in our car that will provide decent clean bass?

[magindat]

ok guys im kinda lost as stereo **** and me mix like oil and water...it gets me every time, my question is what is the simplest easiest cheapest way to get an aftermarket sub in our car that will provide decent clean bass?

MTX Thunderlink. Period. Call John Kuhn for pricing.