EBC Brakes Please Read!!!!!!!

[Dennis Reinhart]

I wanted to take the time to tell all of you members, that over the years I have tried to provide the Marauder, Crown Victoria, GM, Mark 8 and Thunderbird owners with quality products. I feel that I have done this very well. If any problems arose the manufacturer, as well as myself, diligently worked to resolve the issue.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comhttp://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/ /><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P><P class=MsoNormal style= <o:p></o:p>
I contacted EBC brakes and, in the beginning, they appeared helpful and technically astute. Over the years I have bought a considerable amount of products from them for the community, as well as for many Police agencies. <o:p></o:p>
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Over the past year I have had three customers that complained of brake pulsation, after install and about 10k put on the car. In each case, the top person at EBC gave my customers and me a hard time, in trying to resolve their issues. <o:p></o:p>
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Case in Point: Warren, a personal friend who put me in contact with EBC initially, purchased a set from them directly. He paid for shipping and after several thousand miles they warped. He called EBC, they refused to replace the brakes, made him buy a new set, pay for that shipping, then send his old set in and pay for return shipping, for them to examine. Well, they lost the rotors, and it took him four months to finally get his money back, minus all his shipping costs.<o:p></o:p>
Then three months later these rotors warp, he calls EBC, and they send a third set at no charge. Then <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comhttp://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/ /><st1:City><st1:place><SPAN style=Warren</st1:place></st1:City> orders a set for his son’s Marauder, they warp. EBC said they would sell him another set at cost, since his son could not confirm the shop that installed the rotors could not verify if they checked the rotors for run out. All this is complete hog wash.<o:p></o:p>
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Second case: I got hit with credit card fraud. Someone stole a man's identity, applied for credit cards, and ordered parts from me. Some of which was an EBC kit. Long story short, had the rotors been insured, (YES, EBC DOES NOT INSURE THEIR SHIPPED ORDERS) I could have filed a claim, since the person signing for the rotors was not the same persons name who ordered them. So, I ate that.<o:p></o:p>
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Third case: An FBI corrections officer had a set installed on his CVPI and they warped after 8000 miles. Same case, EBC asked me if the hubs were cleaned and did we check the rotors with a run out gauge? I said yes we did. They refused to replace them with out examing them first, and told me the customer needed to buy a new set, pay for new shipping, pay for return shipping of the old rotors, for them to examine. I was going to sell him a set, at cost, and pay for the return shipping of the bad rotors myself. EBC told me I could not sell them at cost, said he had to ship the rotors to me, at his cost, then I had to send them to EBC in <st1:State><st1:place>California</st1:place></st1:State> and pay for that shipping too. I tried to explain to them that he had already paid retail price once, and I would pay to have the rotors sent from his home to EBC. They said I could not do it. In other words, I had to pay for the rotors to be shipped to me, then I would have to pay shipping again to send them to EBC. This is total BS.<o:p></o:p>
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Now, we called today for another customer, with the same issue. They refused to do any thing, unless I provide documented dial indicator run out on the rotors that were installed six months ago. Rotors that I never installed, the customer did. This is just plain and simple hog wash. I have done brakes for years, if the rotor has excessive run out, you will know it immediately, not six months later. These people could care less my customers or me.<o:p></o:p>
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I am in not in a position to pay for replacement of defective parts that a company refuses to acknowledge. I have never, in 20 years of automotive service and repair, been treated so poorly, or seen the piss poor customer service that I have seen from EBC. If I did this in my business, it would be all over the internet and on every car web site out there. I will no longer sell nor indorse EBC products. <o:p></o:p>
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I hope they read this, as I intend to post it in as many places as I can. <o:p></o:p>

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[cyclopsram]

You were patient too long. I give my suppliers two strikes. Thanks for the detailed explanation.

[ChiTownMaraud3r]

Funny I almost decided to order some off your site the other day Dennis. Thank you for sharing the horrible experience.

[Dennis Reinhart]

Funny I almost decided to order some off your site the other day Dennis. Thank you for sharing the horrible experience.


I am now working with another company and there are sending a complete set for me to test, so just be a bit patient.

[KillJoy]

Glad to hear Dennis.

I would NOT consider the EBC Pads and Rotor as a PERFORMANCE UPGRADE. In my opinion, they are a good stock replacement, but not suited for any "performance gain".

KillJoy

[Hotrauder]

Wow, problems with EBC brakes....who would have thought? :mad:Dennis

[MM2004]

Dennis,

Thanks for sharing this detail with all of us.

You done good!

:beer:
:2thumbs:

Mike.

[2,4shofast]

Thank you for the information Dennis, I will be waiting for a replacement product you choose.

[jgc61sr2002]

Dennis - Thanks for the heads up.:D

[DOOM]

***** Ebc Brakes :banned: :argh: :tantrum: :down:

[TiTo35]

Well I know who I WONT be going with for upgraded brakes....Thanks Dennis!

[ctrlraven]

I bought EBC slotted/dimpled rotors about a year ago, had issues because their Green Stuff "street" pads were too hard for the rotors. Swapped the pads for some Napa Cermix ones and everything was dandy.

For the past month, maybe a little long I have noticed a brake pulsation. Funny to read this cause on my way home from work tonight I was thinking about replacing them with some Motorcraft ones. I think I have about 24-26k miles on my EBC rotors and I wouldn't doubt they are wrapped after reading this.


Thanks for posting this Dennis!

[Marauderjack]

Originally Posted by Dennis Reinhart View Post
If I did this in my business, it would be all over the internet and on every car web site out there. I will no longer sell nor indorse EBC products.
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I hope they read this, as I intend to post it in as many places as I can.

Dennis......I'd be careful spreading to much dirt around the internet on these folks or you may just end up with a "Slander" law suit on your hands......just move on to and "FAGEDABOUDIT"!!:rolleyes:

Marauderjack:rolleyes:

[Dragcity]

Sorry to hear you had so much trouble Dennis. Never any fun....

[magindat]

Dennis,
May I suggest you look toward BAER for a stock size replacement rotor?

I have had my Baer Decela rotors for over 50K. You have worked on (near) them (brake lines). I am very pleased with them. I installed them myself and I couldn't tell you what a runout gauge is if you hit me with one! I have no warping or vibration or anything from them. I've painted them, had them off and on the car twice (for other work) and STILL have yet to have issue. They carry a 3-year (must have receipt) no questions asked (says that on the box) warranty. As of now, if they crapped out TOMORROW, I'd feel I got my money's worth. The price was higher than those ebay sellers, but was SOOOO worth it.

For the rest of you... I live in Florida. I 'puddle jump'. I've used them on a closed circuit track. I power brake. I've got the pads so hot, they've smoked and still no warpy!!!!

Dennis, look in their direction...

Good luck and thanks for the wicked honest post!
Rich

[Thunderace]

I,ve been around motorcycles for many years,EBC has seemed to have quality products for them, (from what I've seen).Reguarding Dennis's (& others) problems with them,EBC should have steped up to the plate and stood behind their products they sell.If the problem pursist's pull the product off the shelf and find out why.Because of this I will think twice on installing any EBC products on my bikes,(or my Marauder for that matter!)What ever happend to customer service?and/or satisfaction!

[magindat]

Surely, Dennis was not the only dealer reporting issues. At what point do they bite the bullet and look at their own production and ask 'What are we doing wrong?'

To me this is the root of the issue. Figure out what you're doing wrong and FIX IT. Then make it right for those who have shown loyalty in buying in the first place and win continued loyalty for making it right. DUH!!!

[Thunderace]

Loyalty....America needs more...

[JonW]

I bought a set of EBC Red Stuff pads for Charger, and they are the dirtiest, nastiest brake pads I have ever seen. We took the Charger on a 2000 mile trip after I installed the pads, and I had to stop at a car wash every day to wash the wheels, they were so black.

They're coming off if they don't improve very soon.

[Blackmobile]

Loyalty....America needs more...

loyalty swings both ways.

[Thunderace]

Oh yes,very true...

[vkirkend]

Originally Posted by Dennis Reinhart View Post
If I did this in my business, it would be all over the internet and on every car web site out there. I will no longer sell nor indorse EBC products.
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I hope they read this, as I intend to post it in as many places as I can.

Dennis......I'd be careful spreading to much dirt around the internet on these folks or you may just end up with a "Slander" law suit on your hands......just move on to and "FAGEDABOUDIT"!!:rolleyes:

Marauderjack:rolleyes:

I'm no attorney but believe that slander is when you say something untruthful about a person or business. What Dennis says is what actually happened. That I believe is not slander.

[John F. Russo]

I am now working with another company and there are sending a complete set for me to test, so just be a bit patient.

I thought you were using KVR?

[Hotrauder]

I'm no attorney but believe that slander is when you say something untruthful about a person or business. What Dennis says is what actually happened. That I believe is not slander.


Just might be and irony issue,vkerkend:D. Lawyers win when they create a financial burden with their suit, BS or not. Dennis

[GreekGod]

This is a response from emails I sent to the CEO of EBC Brakes:


"Hi There

Well I dont quite know what we can gain or learn here except that we dont have the right compounds for Police spec Marauders. That is not an ambition of my Company anyway and we only ventured into this because of heavy encouragement by Dennis and Warren from Florida, who were issued free test sets and then decided to ORDER parts. It hasn't worked, I dont have the time to spend on this segment any longer so we will bow out and take care of any warranty issues on the POLICE VEHICLES if they arise. I notice one person on the forum you linked me to said they had a nasty experience with our reds and had to stop every few miles to wash his wheels, well this has not happened on my Lexus GS 300 in 5000 miles. The latest Red compound is the cleanest brake pad material you can find. A lot of your respected mechanics rhetoric is also wrongly founded especially the remark about rotor vibration being apparent at install. There is no such thing as a warped rotor, rotors wear thin spots and that is what causes vibration and it happens right around 4-5000 miles after install as the vehicle running OFF brake wears a thin spot on the high point of a rotor installed with runout. Anyway, thats enough from me, I thank you pointing this all out to me, I cannot now nor will ever likely be able to control the content of forums so I am pleased only a tiny percentage read those. EBC strives on to improve itself, to beat the Chinese at their own game with USA and UK made products and will continue on its way. Thanks again and have a great weekend. regards Andy Freeman"

[Dennis Reinhart]

I thought you were using KVR?

I do John, EBC was a low cost alternative to the KVR 14" kit

[Mike M]

Wow, I have been working on cars professionally for over 30 years and I have more A.S.E. certs then you can count and this is the first time I ever heard anyone say "rotors don't warp".
What color is the sky in your world?

[sailsmen]

Nothing in the post from EBC disputes anything said here other than a difference in symantecs.

That said am I interpeting correctly that they admit to selling rotors w/ runout and are blaming the mechanic for not checking for runout prior to install? If so why don't they check for runout at their factory?

If so we will have to mic and measure every single item before it is put on our cars?

Are the Chinese checking their rotors for runout?

Seems to me in lieu of checking for runout that they are running away!:mad:

Years ago I had a new crankshaft snap due to a bad casting. The factory admitted they were not checked because it was cheaper to just replace them. :mad2:

[GreekGod]

Wow, I have been working on cars professionally for over 30 years and I have more A.S.E. certs then you can count and this is the first time I ever heard anyone say "rotors don't warp".
What color is the sky in your world?

Hey! The GreekGod got a letter from EBC's CEO! Think of the power the GreekGod has, especially when people know he is "connected" with John Kuhn!

I doubt your certs are recognized in Great Britain. Obviously, if a CEO says rotors don't warp, then rotors don't warp!

Bow down, and ALL HAIL!...

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/../showcase/files/2/1/9/0/AllHail_623719.gif

[whd507]

I second the Baer rotors. I do sell them on a daily basis, have them on my Marauder, and also supply three local law enforcement fleets with them. Resistance to fade seems really good. No noticeble increase in pad wear so far, and no visible stress cracks. In 20+ full sets sold in the past 9 months since I started selling them, I have had no complaints. PFC pads are specified by the LEO contracts, but I use my house brand premium pads with no complaints with these rotors.

I'm in no way trying to influence or compete with Dennis's business which I am a customer, and with whom I regard highly. just offering my opinion and experience with this particular stock-replacement size option.
I have no experience or opinions with big brake kits.

[Meteorite]

Holy cow, well at least this post is timely for me. I put on the EBC pads and rotors 18 months ago, and mine are just now starting to make a very bad grinding sound. I will inspect them tomorrow to see what is up.

What are folks recommending now, if I need something that will be stock size? I still run winter wheels that won't handle larger rotors.

[Dennis Reinhart]

Wow, I have been working on cars professionally for over 30 years and I have more A.S.E. certs then you can count and this is the first time I ever heard anyone say "rotors don't warp".
What color is the sky in your world?

I posted this because of the fact, that in two of these incidents we did install, the rotors, we did clean the hubs, we did do a run out, and they did not warranty them. I have no control over my customers who installed them there selves, but it plainly states on EBC instructions that the hubs must be cleaned and a run out test must be done.

And those customers said they did it and I was trying to help with there issue. I have never spoke to the CEO, he should have never had to get involved, his sales manager should have taken care of this, I also do not want to beat this in the ground or start a bomb fire.

I am just explaining what took place with me, a small shop that spent a large amount of money with this company, when I was told I had to pay for the corrections officer to send me the rotors, then turn around and send them to EBC, and pay for that shipping to, that was enough for me. So you know what I did I sent the corrections officer a FREE XCAL 2.

I was told that the rotors could not be sent directly to EBC from the customer, trust me there is not a large profit here, I would be in the hole, even if they did send a replacement set because I would not be reimbursed for the shipping cost. Warren really got raked over the coals. I do like KVR 14" KIT I have a good relationship with them, I am looking for a affordable kit to replace EBC.

There is no ill intent here, had I not posted this sooner or later a customer would, so lets move on.

[JonW]

Being a business owner, I can say that we alll make mistakes. We try not to, but we're only human. But if we make a mistake, we own up to it and fix it right away. That is the measure of a good business. I don't see anything in that email from EBC's CEO where they intend to step up and fix their mistakes. Had I been him, and read my post, I would have sent an email either explaining why my brake pads are so nasty, or offering to take steps to solve the problem. He did neither, only pointing that his Lexus doesn't do it.

I have to agree with Dennis. Forget about them, never use them again, and move on.

[John F. Russo]

I do John, EBC was a low cost alternative to the KVR 14" kit

Thanks Dennis.

[jdenning002]

So I guess I just wasted $60.00 shipping them to you Dennis???

[Dennis Reinhart]

John we will help out any way we can, I am waiting on another company that is offering a similar rotor, we will test them before, making a decision as to whether we will use these, or not. Give me a call tomorrow.

[Icarus]

...I have never, in 20 years of automotive service and repair, been treated so poorly, or seen the piss poor customer service that I have seen from EBC. If I did this in my business, it would be all over the internet and on every car web site out there. I will no longer sell nor indorse EBC products. <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com[IMG]http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/ /><o:p></o:p></SPAN>
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I hope they read this, as I intend to post it in as many places as I can. <o:p></o:p>



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Interesting choice of words.
Others should follow suit and do the same as you about any businesses that treat their customers this way (sic)!