POS Meziere - Never again!

[Svashtar]

I bought my Meziere WP from DR in 2005; registered it the same year. They have a 2-year warranty. Then from Dennis over the next few months ordered a full level II kit, rear engine cooling mod, PI 3000 stall, deep art carr pan, new gauges, pro-guard, etc., etc. etc. I called Meziere later in 2006 and ordered the optional wiring kit from them to make the install easier when it happened.

Had no $ for all the install so everything sat for over a year. No sense in just installing the WP anyway when the cooling mod had to be done. Finally got the bread together and had the works done in Jan. 2007 at 32,200 miles. Drove the MM very little that year, but finally got going with it as a daily driver this May.

2 months or so ago with just about 8000 miles on the WP it started making noise. Called Jay (the sales guy) at Meziere and he told me it was probably water cavitation and to burp the system. I wrote about it here and a couple of you told me that sounded like BS. It got a lot louder. At 11,400 miles on the 250,000 mile rated pump (5000 hours they rate it; mileage depends on speed of course) it got so loud I called back last Wednesday and held the phone to the pump with the key on and the engine off. Jay immediately told me to send it in, that "it wasn't right."

I explained to him that I only had the receipt from the mechanic showing the install date of 1/07, even though it was at least 3 years since purchase and he said he would honor that. He said to be sure to send in the receipt showing the install date. I spoke to him again last Thursday night 9/4 before dropping it off at the shop Friday morning and confirmed all the above, and he said if they shipped Friday they would get it Monday and it would be a two-day turn.

My mechanic pulled it Friday and I'm driving a rental. The pump made it down there Monday and they just got to it today. Jay is out of town. Their guy Thomas calls me and tells me it's ready, that the POS had a bad seal that let coolant ruin a bearing, but I own them $125! He seemed incredulous that I would expect them to do what Jay said they would do. Like I had it installed in another car for a few thousand hours, then bought another wiring kit and spent hours making it look brand new so it could be reinstalled again I guess.

I asked him to call Jay in Florida where he's traveling and he did. Now Jay doesn't know ANYTHING about the install receipt or the statement from my mechanic that it was brand new when he put it in. He won't honor what he told me on the at the end of last week.

So let's see: $320 for the pump, $15 for shipping, $35 for the wiring kit, $233 to have it installed with a relay and fused, $150 for a rental this week because the POS lasted less than 1/25th it's rated life, another $150 to R&R the pump, $20 to Priority mail it down there, and now they want $125 to fix their POS pump? $1050!!??

If the Stewart had been available 3 years ago I might have got it, I don't know. WHAT I DO know is that after this I would never buy another product from these lying ********. Who cares about the pissant drag on the system of the Stewart? Thomas tells me they have a very low failure rate on these pumps. Really? Then why does the completely rebuilt pump only have a 3 month warranty?

Finally, another lesson from my purchase mistake. Never register with them until you install it. Like I would have actually paid to priority mail it down there AND rented a ride for these last 5 days if he hadn't told me they would fix it based on the date of install... :mad2:

Norm

[red]

Sorry to hear about your troubles. I was happy when I learned about the Stewart alternative and have not regretted its install one bit. The car runs cooler, which is the only reason I wanted an upgraded water pump. The fact that I could run an electric water pump while sitting in the staging lanes did not outweigh the potential issues. Also, the whole gains/regains 10+ HP arguments are garbage. Sean Hyland, who developed the Stewart pump, says the following on his web site:


This water pump fills an industry void for a high performance water pump for this engine. The pump flows 6.4% more than the stock pump, uses .2hp (7%) less than the stock pump, and peak efficiency is 36% compared to 29% for the stock pump. At 6000 rpm, the pump flows 45.5 gpm at 36 psi, using only 2.8 hp. Also perfect as a cost effective original equipment replacement upgrade.
As you can see, the stock pump only uses an estimated 3 HP to begin with. My question is where is the extra HP coming from in these claims about electric pumps?

[Glenn]

Unfortunately, things like this happen and they are hard to take. The money you have spent makes it even worse.

Glenn :burnout:

[Svashtar]

Unfortunately, things like this happen and they are hard to take. The money you have spent makes it even worse.

Glenn :burnout:

No, your right of course Glenn, and the fact is that I was willing to spend the $ for a better product. AND if Jay had honored his word I would still be out about the same, just $125 less.

To my way of thinking their policy should be a direct _overnight_ replacement of your pump with a NEW, not rebuilt pump. Every day my car sits costs me $. One of the $525 chrome Ford Modular pumps would have been fair compensation for the PITA and expense I've had to go through this week because their POS 5000 hour rated pump lasted about 200 hours.

But I didn't ask for that, just that they fix their pump that I paid to send them, free of charge.

Thanks for putting it in perspective for me, life sucks sometimes and what can you do?, but hopefully someone else will read this and save themselves a headache.

Norm

[Svashtar]

Sorry to hear about your troubles. I was happy when I learned about the Stewart alternative and have not regretted its install one bit. The car runs cooler, which is the only reason I wanted an upgraded water pump. The fact that I could run an electric water pump while sitting in the staging lanes did not outweigh the potential issues. Also, the whole gains/regains 10+ HP arguments are garbage. Sean Hyland, who developed the Stewart pump, says the following on his web site:

As you can see, the stock pump only uses an estimated 3 HP to begin with. My question is where is the extra HP coming from in these claims about electric pumps?

Good question Red. Beats the hell out of me. I liked the Meziere with 55 GPM constant and I could run it with the engine off, but this failure really surprised me and irritates me at the same time of course. Of course the lying of their sales guy and BS attitude of the tech doesn't help.

There did seem to be more SOTP pull with the Meziere, but at 11,400 miles in the car @ 50 MPH avg. the 228 hours I got out of this POS pump cost me $4.60 for every hour I owned it. No thanks... :shake:

Norm

[red]

There did seem to be more SOTP pull with the Meziere, but at 11,400 miles in the car @ 50 MPH avg. the 228 hours I got out of this POS pump cost me $4.60 for every hour I owned it. No thanks... :shake:
For a little more, you could have just hired someone to turn a crank :D

[Dennis Reinhart]

I bought my Meziere WP from DR in 2005; registered it the same year. They have a 2-year warranty. Then from Dennis over the next few months ordered a full level II kit, rear engine cooling mod, PI 3000 stall, deep art carr pan, new gauges, pro-guard, etc., etc. etc. I called Meziere later in 2006 and ordered the optional wiring kit from them to make the install easier when it happened.

Had no $ for all the install so everything sat for over a year. No sense in just installing the WP anyway when the cooling mod had to be done. Finally got the bread together and had the works done in Jan. 2007 at 32,200 miles. Drove the MM very little that year, but finally got going with it as a daily driver this May.

2 months or so ago with just about 8000 miles on the WP it started making noise. Called Jay (the sales guy) at Meziere and he told me it was probably water cavitation and to burp the system. I wrote about it here and a couple of you told me that sounded like BS. It got a lot louder. At 11,400 miles on the 250,000 mile rated pump (5000 hours they rate it; mileage depends on speed of course) it got so loud I called back last Thursday 9/4 and held the phone to the pump with the key on and the engine off. Jay immediately told me to send it in, that "it wasn't right."

I explained to him that I only had the receipt from the mechanic showing the install date of 1/07, even though it was at least 3 years since purchase and he said he would honor that. He said to be sure to send in the receipt showing the install date. I spoke to him again last Friday 9/5 before shipping it off and confirmed all the above, and he said they would get it Monday and it would be a two-day turn.

My mechanic pulled it Friday and I'm driving a rental. The pump made it down there Monday and they just got to it today. Jay is out of town. Their guy Thomas calls me and tells me it's ready, that the POS had a bad seal that let coolant ruin a bearing, but I own them $125! He seemed incredulous that I would expect them to do what Jay said they would do. Like I had it installed in another car for a few thousand hours, then bought another wiring kit and spent hours making it look brand new so it could be reinstalled again I guess.

I asked him to call Jay in Florida where he's traveling and he did. Now Jay doesn't know ANYTHING about the install receipt or the statement from my mechanic that it was brand new when he put it in. He won't honor what he told me on the phone Friday.

So let's see: $320 for the pump, $15 for shipping, $35 for the wiring kit, $233 to have it installed with a relay and fused, $150 for a rental this week because the POS lasted less than 1/25th it's rated life, another $150 to R&R the pump, $20 to Priority mail it down there, and now they want $125 to fix their POS pump? $1050!!??

If the Stewart had been available 3 years ago I might have got it, I don't know. WHAT I DO know is that after this I would never buy another product from these lying ********. Who cares about the pissant drag on the system of the Stewart? Thomas tells me they have a very low failure rate on these pumps. Really? Then why does the completely rebuilt pump only have a 3 month warranty?

Finally, another lesson from my purchase mistake. Never register with them until you install it. Like I would have actually paid to priority mail it down there if he hadn't told me they would fix it based on the date of install... :mad2:

Norm

Instead of seeing :mad2:you could have called me, and I would have intervened I probably have more influence than you, because I buy and represent this company, and if they gave me the story they said they gave you I would have said I do not care warranty or let me speak to your CEO.They have a good product I still use and sell it. And I have copied this and sent it to there CEO.

[gja]

Instead of seeing :mad2:you could have called me, and I would have intervened I probably have more influence than you, because I buy and represent this company, and if they gave me the story they said they gave you I would have said I do not care warranty or let me speak to your CEO.They have a good product I still use and sell it. And I have copied this and sent it to there CEO.

That's nice of you Dennis, but the point here really is that a company that stonewalls when "just a customer" tries to get some relief shows its' true colors.

A person should not need a distributor/line rep. contacting the manufacturers CEO to get some satisfaction. How a customer is treated when there will be no hell to pay is the real mark of a company.

[FordNut]

Sorry to hear of your problems. My story is a bit different, I installed one and it lasted over 55k miles with absolutely no problems. When I built my engine I put in a new one, as the bearing for the pulley was making a little noise. The pump still worked great. With my latest rebuild I went a different route, but my Mezeire experience was positive.

[Dennis Reinhart]

I sent a letter to them, I guarantee you they will call me, I am small fish in a corporate sea, of automotive car parts, if we knew of the mistakes or failures of many large company's we would be scratching our heads, to me every customer is important, I have learned you can never make every body happy, and you cannot convert some one to like you no matter what you do do make up for any short comings you may have encountered with in any of the thousands of customers any business may deal with, as to what ever you sell from toilet paper to widgets, but when dealers call and complain this will catch a concerned company's attention, you can never win a argument on the INTERNET, but the INTERNET is a VERY powerful tool it can bankrupt a small business, any one can say any thing and there is nothing you can do, all I can do is go to bat for you, will they issue you a cash refund? no they will not, but I am sure I can get a free pump, call me any time if I can help I will post there reply when I recieve it.

[Windsor58]

Norm,
Sorry this happened to you.

Dennis,
This demonstrates why so many on here have such respect for you. You always try to go the extra mile that most folks in your position don't bother with. Even if I had never met you, that says a lot. Since I have met you, these things just reinforce my high opinion of you. You're a good guy.
Chip

[Svashtar]

Instead of seeing :mad2:you could have called me, and I would have intervened I probably have more influence than you, because I buy and represent this company, and if they gave me the story they said they gave you I would have said I do not care warranty or let me speak to your CEO.They have a good product I still use and sell it. And I have copied this and sent it to there CEO.

Dennis, that's really decent of you, but the fact is I bought this from you in April '05 and there's no way I would have the chutzpah to call you up over 3 years later and expect you to be any way accountable or to take time to front for me with the company. I have to say that I DID take the liberty of mentioning your name twice to this guy Thomas as a person who bought a lot of their product who I had bought the unit from, but he didn't budge. I guess this is like the deal with the 9100 tuner I had a while back and the incorrect file info I got from SCT; I should have phoned you first but after 3 years I didn't have the gall to bug you about it.

From their perspective I _could_ be trying to pull a fast one, but my mechanic wouldn't lie for anyone, and he faxed them the install invoice today showing when it was installed new.

The cost to buy and install the Meziere is fine with me. But the extra $ to cover the fault irritates me, and the extra $125 today to fix the bearing in less than an hour just adds insult to injury.

Bottom line is I was more upset that the thing failed after so little time. I don't mean to try and s&^t on your sales, you are a good guy or otherwise I wouldn't have gladly spent $4K+ with you over the years, just my experience with them. Thanks for your input, and I appreciate your shooting this off to the head guy there.

Norm

[BruteForce]

I'm on my second one. First one started leaking just inside of warranty but since the MM is a daily driver I had one rush shipped from Summit Racing. After getting back on the road, emails to Mezeire regarding a warranty replacement went unanswered. My fault for not following up. If anyone wants one to rebuild, let me know.

[Blackmobile]

I have one that's already rebuilt, but I don't think I'll be putting it back in the MM. There is a part of me that wants to, but the other part of me wants better.

ED

[mpearce]

Why do you need an aftermarket water pump? Whats wrong with your stock one?

[Hotrauder]

Why do you need an aftermarket water pump? Whats wrong with your stock one?

Not a thing, Matt; as you well know. I did replace mine with the "high performance" Stewart. Guess what? Not one degree difference in coolant temperatures as measured by my Aeroforce guage. My OEM was fine but at 39000 miles and the upgrade to the Twin Screw I felt it was a great time to do a preventative maintenance move. Dennis

[Zack]

I ran one for years, up until I had it on the Kenne Bell car and it mysteriously stopped working (only at WOT)

I firmly believe the less electrical devices you have on the car, the better.

[O's Fan Rich]

I firmly believe the less electrical devices you have on the car, the better.

Guess I'll have to take out the microwave...:mad:

On topic, my plans include the Stewart pump.

[mpearce]

at 39000 miles and the upgrade to the Twin Screw I felt it was a great time to do a preventative maintenance move.

I suppose it would be a good move when you're headed to the power level you're at, with the mileage you're at. I don't really think it's necessary in a N/A application only.

[Blackmobile]

I don't really think it's necessary in a N/A application only.

Not unless you want to go from a 13.6 down to a 13.5. :D

[Svashtar]

I ran one for years, up until I had it on the Kenne Bell car and it mysteriously stopped working (only at WOT)

I firmly believe the less electrical devices you have on the car, the better.

Yeah, you're probably right. I look under my dash now and it's like a maze. Viper alarm, underbody lighting stuff, the scanguage, a couple of other things.

I think the Stewart is kind of a neat upgrade to the OEM, and not that much more than the stock unit. I just loved the idea of driving it hard and shutting the engine down and still being able to cool the engine, and along with the other mods the electric seemed like a good upgrade.

[Dennis Reinhart]

What ever, its up to you as to what ever you put on your car. I like the Mez pump, Billy Shear wanted the stewart warner pump we ordered a brand new one it came we installed it and it had a bent shaft, we had to replace that, and Steve had to reem the watter pump pulley hole out for it to fit on the pump did I post this, NO because I know there are always exception to every thing nothing is perfect. So I think this thread has come full circle, can we move on now?

[Zack]

The guy posted up about a bad experience with a product, in a public designated forum.

Just because you sell the product does not mean you should sway members from continuing to post, regardless of it being positive or negative.

[Dennis Reinhart]

The guy posted up about a bad experience with a product, in a public designated forum.

Just because you sell the product does not mean you should sway members from continuing to post, regardless of it being positive or negative.

That was not my point or intention just your interpretation, the thread has come full circle I have tried to help and that is all I meant.

[Blackened300a]

Steve had to reem the watter pump pulley hole out for it to fit on the pump did I post this, NO because I know there are always exception to every thing nothing is perfect. So I think this thread has come full circle, can we move on now?

I have installed 2 EMP pumps so far, and I never had to modify anything. The only issue was that I had to add lock washers because the bolts extend past and hit the WP housing.

[Marauderjack]

Not a thing, Matt; as you well know. I did replace mine with the "high performance" Stewart. Guess what? Not one degree difference in coolant temperatures as measured by my Aeroforce guage. My OEM was fine but at 39000 miles and the upgrade to the Twin Screw I felt it was a great time to do a preventative maintenance move. Dennis

Same here....the EMP pump is nice and pricey but no difference from OEM and my OEM had 130K miles on it and still worked perfectly!!!:bows:

If the EMP goes out....I'm back to OEM!!:beer:

Marauderjack:cool:

[Svashtar]

Same here....the EMP pump is nice and pricey but no difference from OEM and my OEM had 130K miles on it and still worked perfectly!!!:bows:

If the EMP goes out....I'm back to OEM!!:beer:

Marauderjack:cool:

I've got my OEM WP in a small tool bag in the trunk along with the bolts and matching serpentine belt just in case. You never know.

[mpearce]

Not unless you want to go from a 13.6 down to a 13.5. :D

Or I could wait until October for cool weather to run a 13.5, save myself $300 bucks and a major headache. :D

[Svashtar]

Update, no return calls from Meziere. I'm calling again today to find out why the sales guy went back on his word.

FYI, I'm up to $1065. They charged me shipping, tax on all the parts, and then dumped the filthy WP in a box for shipping. Didn't bother to even wipe the grease off it.

The plus side, my coolant temps now avg. 8 degrees cooler than they have in the past few months...

[red]

Svashtar, glad it's working!

Just a general note on the coolant temps, my EMP/Stewart pump has kept my N/A marauder running several degrees cooler on average over the stock pump. And I recall others in the past reporting the same. Also, I had no issues with the pump installation.

[Shora]

I have no idea how any of you notice that your car is running cooler with aftermarket water pumps. You do mean coolant temperature right?

If so, how could it run cooler if you use your thermostats?

For example, I replace my OE thermostat every spring with a stock temp one and according to my Scan Gauge II my temp is always between 186-188 degrees no matter the outside temp (even in the South FL summer heat). I imagine that even a SUPER PUMP (if there is such a thing) won't keep the temps any cooler because the thermostat would just close at around 188 degrees and not allow the coolant to cool in the radiator until it gets hot enough.

I don't know if I am explaining it right, but from my understanding, there is no way a pump can keep the temps cooler because the thermostat would just close and keep the fluid in the engine making sure it is up to temp.

With that said, while my pump seems to be doing a perfect job, this spring I plan on replacing it with the Stewart pump (because it looks like a quality pump) and will keep the OEM for back up.

[red]

I have no idea how any of you notice that your car is running cooler with aftermarket water pumps. You do mean coolant temperature right?
Yes.


If so, how could it run cooler if you use your thermostats?

For example, I replace my OE thermostat every spring with a stock temp one and according to my Scan Gauge II my temp is always between 186-188 degrees no matter the outside temp (even in the South FL summer heat). I imagine that even a SUPER PUMP (if there is such a thing) won't keep the temps any cooler because the thermostat would just close at around 188 degrees and not allow the coolant to cool in the radiator until it gets hot enough.

I don't know if I am explaining it right, but from my understanding, there is no way a pump can keep the temps cooler because the thermostat would just close and keep the fluid in the engine making sure it is up to temp.
The thermostat regulates the minimum operating temperature. I noticed after installing the Stewart pump the temps dipped at warm idle and around town, which were reading well above the thermostat rating. And, IIRC, my car would vary by as much as 10 degrees or more. I'm inclined to attribute the lower temps in the said driving conditions to the pump; though, granted, there could be other things I may have fixed during the installation through coolant flush, thermostat change (same rating), and burping. I'll pay attention to the temps the next time I data log.