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RCSignals
09-17-2003, 05:28 PM
Ford says Crown Vic tests fudged
Dallas officials believe automaker is trying to take focus off safety

09:13 PM CDT on Tuesday, September 16, 2003

By JASON TRAHAN / The Dallas Morning News

Ford Motor Co. has accused Dallas officials of fudging Crown Victoria police car crash test results, which the city said demonstrated that the vehicle remains unsafe even when equipped with manufacturer-approved safety equipment.

This week, Ford posted the results of its analysis of Dallas' tests on its official Crown Victoria police interceptor Web site. Photos from the tests include a crowbar welded to a jack before it broke off on impact and a pry-bar wedged with its sharp end perpendicular to the fuel tank.

"The way Dallas welded these things together and placed the others in the trunk, it prevents them from behaving like they would in a real crash," said Doug Lampe, a Ford attorney. "It was a test with a purpose in mind, and the purpose was to fail the trunk pack."

City officials said that the tests it ordered in July on the Ford-recommended safety device are accurate and that Monday's accusations are more evidence that the auto giant is more concerned with trashing legitimate tests than with producing a safer car.

An independent consumer group said that Dallas' tests appear to be legitimate.

For the tests, items that the city said were commonly found in a police officer's trunk were alternately loaded into an empty Crown Victoria trunk and one lined with a plastic and Kevlar container called a trunk pack. Cars were then crashed into the rear of the Crown Victoria cars to see whether the packs made a difference.

The city deemed the trunk packs a failure, saying they didn't protect against fuel leaks in its tests.

Ford criticized the city for not disclosing the artificial conditions when reporting its testing results and for packing items not normally found in a police officers' trunk. It cited an ammunition box filled with sand instead of bullets, saying the weight forces gear into the tank.

Dallas City Attorney Madeleine Johnson said the placement of items in the trunks was meant to ensure consistency throughout the crash tests.

"I just feel that this is just typical of the way that Ford is approaching this whole issue," Ms. Johnson said. "We asked them to be a part of the tests and help come up with standards and help us analyze the results. ... They wanted no part of it. What have they done? All they've released is criticism of what we've done. The real losers are the police officers driving these cars."

Clarence Ditlow, executive director of The Center for Auto Safety in Washington, D.C., an independent consumer group frequently called on to testify before Congress on safety issues, said that Dallas' tests appear to be legitimate.

"I don't think it was deliberate attempt to rig the test to have a puncture source," Mr. Ditlow said. "There's no testing standard for how you pack the interior of a vehicle. It's a question of judgment. To my mind, the most obvious reason for doing it the way they did it was so you can replicate the exact same packing every time. If the objects are loose, you have harder job."

A representative of KARCO Engineering, which hosted the city's tests at its California facility, said this week that it did not pack the trunks. They referred questions to the Arizona company that oversaw the testing, Transportation Safety Technologies Inc. Officials there did not return phone calls Tuesday.

The tests were financed by attorneys representing the city in a lawsuit over the death of Officer Patrick Metzler. The 31-year-old officer died last Oct. 23 on Central Expressway after a speeding motorist struck his patrol car from behind, causing it to erupt in flames. More than a dozen law enforcement officers nationwide have died from fuel tank fires in Crown Victoria rear-end crashes.

Ford says the trunk pack and fuel tank shields, with which Dallas has retrofitted its fleet, are effective in preventing fuel-tank punctures on a car that it says meets government safety standards. The automaker also is developing a fire-suppression system in newer models.

Ford's statement:

http://www.cvpi.com/pdfs/CustomerBrochureImportantMsg.p df

cyclone03
09-17-2003, 08:37 PM
Why would you weld a crow bar to a floor jack?
And another thing who lays a floor jack on it's side when carrying
it in you trunk?

Ford should sue the Dallas PD for the bad press created by there "test"!

Constable
09-17-2003, 09:04 PM
First, let me say this: I mean no disrespect to anyone here or to anyone who has tragically lost their lives in the line of duty.

Now... I am sick and tired of hearing alll this ***** about the exploding CVPI's. Yes, there were some tragic deaths caused by rear end collisions. HOWEVER, look at the tens of thousands of rear end collisions Crown Victorias go through each year. I truly believe that 12-15 casualties is a decent number... just look at it statistically.

ALSO, the collisions that have resulted in deaths were pretty serious to begin with. No matter what kind of police vehicle I drive, I'd think that a rear-ender at 65mph would most likely result in my death or SERIOUS injury. It doesn't matter WHO manufactures the car.

Next, it's not the manufacturers fault if you load up loose equipment in the trunk... it will most likely play a negative part during an impact. That's like having an axe in the front seat during a crash and blaming Ford when your arm gets hacked off. Every time I begin my shifts, I ensure that all of my gear is securely bolted or screwed down in the vehicle. If it's something that can't (or shouldn't) be secured, then I make sure that it is in a safe position. The CVPI owners manuals specifically state where to load items and where not to. They also spell out how to install some equipment correctly so that it will not adversley affect safety.

Maybe this article did not correctly portray either party's viewpoints. I dunno. I'm just getting sick of this, especially since a CVPI saved my life during an accident.

cruzer
09-17-2003, 09:12 PM
I guess I'm just stupid----how can anyone sue Ford for the results of a 75 mph rear-end collision---I am sure no requirement for this was included in the original purchase specs---I don't believe there is any car capable of performing as safely as the CV available now or in the near future--buy at lowest bid and you don't get the goodies---PDs should pay for their own upgrades ---not Ford--I am not connected to Ford by any way--just a 74 year old high performance driver with over a million miles of driving under my belt who believes it is about time people started taking responsibility for their actions and decisions--wish all the CVPI could have bladder tanks--you guys deserve them--good luck

RCSignals
09-17-2003, 11:58 PM
Originally posted by cyclone03
Ford should sue the Dallas PD for the bad press created by there "test"!

Actually it was the "City of Dallas", specifically pushed by the City attorney and Mayor

Dallas was very quick to get press coverage of their "test" even before all the results had been analysed. They received quite broad national coverage.

This latest development will get none.