Kook's Headers Dyno Results!!

[Logan]

Wow!

I just got back from doing the post-dyno on my car with the Kook's exhaust on and was so excited I just can't contain myself!

Wow! (It bears repeating)

The only caveat I have to mention is that my car has a 3000rpm stall in it, so getting number much below 4000rpm is near impossible on a dyno. BUT, I can tell you, the newly available amount of power and torque down low launches my car like you wouldn't believe out of the hole.

That being said, my car prior to the header install, was making 256.3rwhp and 278.6rwtq.

My car, post header install is now making....

285.7rwhp and 293.5rwtq!!

That's peak, 29hp and 15tq!!

What's important to examine is that although the peak numbers are high, there are even higher spreads in the torque and power bands throughout the curve. There's almost a 50hp spread on power at 6000rpm!!!

All in all, what a kick ass investment!!

[nick filippides]

Logan, Im real happy to hear great news. Much like the 4V Mark VIII, the headers made a huge difference. 29hp at the wheels is more like 45-50hp at the crank. I'm estimating 3-4tenths drop in et and 2-3mph increase at the track. Logan I'll bet dollars to donuts that your gas mileage will improve as well. Thanks for your help. Nick "Kook's Headers"

[sailsmen]

Woooooow!

Thanks for posting the info.

Let us know about the install, how difficult? Can an occasional wrench turner master it?

Any welding, air wrenches or special tools required?

[Directedby]

Good going Logan.

Can you post a pic of your engine with the headers?

Also, how long did they take you to install?

[Logan]

Patience... :) I'm writing up the full report, with pics. It'll be up on Thursday.

I will say in advance though that I'd recommend they be installed by a competent shop. From the time we pulled the car in, to the time we pulled it out including welding up an entire exhaust system was about 12 hours labor. About 8 hours on install, 4 on welding, pipe bending and exhaust assembly.

If you give the installer a copy of the review I'm working on, he should be able to save himself a couple hours by not having to relearn the install.

http://www.mercurygallery.net/mmnet/watermark.php?file=503/1DSC01173-med.jpg

[JET]

Logan,
Awsome numbers I'm just pissed I didn't get a ride. Thanks for a great weekend
John

[JamesHecker]

We can't pass smog here in California with those, can we?

[Logan]

Not sure if Kook's has a Carb number on them, give them a shout and ask.

[FordNut]

That's more like it! For so long all we heard was "headers will not help produce power in a NA MM". Just been anxiously waiting for somebody to prove it. Thanks. (I think... now that's more money I gotta spend).

BTW, I got a quote on a Bassani SS x-pipe. It looks sweet and costs less. I'm thinking of trying the Kooks/Bassani combo. So many possibilities!

[Logan]

I'll just say that the Kook's X is worth every penny. It may not be "pretty" as the bassani unit, but having had both, I'll say the Kook's unit is technically superior. They put ALOT of manual handiwork into the interior of the Kook's X.

I wish I took pictures of the inside of the kook's X... Seeing is believing.

[jgc61sr2002]

Logan - Thanks for the report. Waiting to see pix.:up:

[studio460]

WOW, LOGAN! THOSE NUMBERS/CURVES ARE AMAZING!!! Yeah--"ditto" what FordNut said!!! I know you're busy writing the full report (and thank you for doing that), but as to the factory cats, did you replace two/delete two, or did you replace all four factory cats with the Magnaflow high-flow cats? Us California guys want/need/deserve that kind of header performance, too! Your exhaust MUST'VE gotten LOUDER and BEEFIER sounding too, right?!?!?!? In fact, the damn thing must have a screamin' ROAR to it now, eh? Which mufflers did you have again? Incredible post, Logan!!! Incredible!

[Logan]

I believe the secondary units are simply resonators, not convertors. I went with two High Flow Magnaflow Cats, and welded the secondary O2 sensors right behind them, no codes have popped, so it must be working just fine. :)

[Constable]

AAGGHHH!!! I can't wait to get mine installed!! Yippeeee!!!

[studio460]

Well, Logan, that sounds damn fine to me, then. Aww, to Hell with passing California emissions . . . I've got four years on a new car until I have to smog it, right? Damn, those Kook's headers and X-pipes got me all excited now . . . Just think how great the car's gonna run once you get a blower on there too! Can't wait to see your pics and descriptions of your install, Logan! Thanks for doing all the legwork on this one! And THANKS for getting us the club discounts from Kook's!

[John F. Russo]

nick filippides

Re: Kooks Headers
What facts do you facts to support your statement, "I'll bet dollars to donuts that your gas mileage will improve as well"?

Logan

You should have smiled in your first ever (for me) of the man behind the MM website. Send another photo to all of us showing that happy smile. It will tell us you really like the volunteer work that you are doing for the thousands of us MM enthusiasts.


Re: Kooks Headers

Thanks for the update and help you are giving to the uninformed.

Will I get the same improvement in hp and torque with my Kenny Brown supercharged engine?

Is the Kook's exhaust noisier than the stock exhaust you use to have?

Do you believe there is any evidence that the gas mileage will improve even if it is minimal improvement? (If I can get a payback on this investment, I'll do it in an instant.)

____________
2003 Blue 300B (Canadian) (traction control, mini spare, trunked 6 disc
CD changer,clock-in-the-radio, heated front seats, hood light)
Born 12/10/02
10,000 miles
Stock transmission (upgraded with Performance Automatic
clutches and band after stock tranny failed in 8,800 miles)
Wheel locks (Ford)
Mileage: 18 mpg at a steady speed of 80 mph
Kenny Brown: 6th “signature series” conversion (450 hp) 3/28/03
Dead pedal
Badgeless or Godhead badged front grill (trying to achieve)
Baer front brakes 14 in. two piston, vented rotors
MMX Driveshaft
4.10 gears
Vortech supercharger (7 to 8 psig boost)
Pirelli P-Zero Asymmetric
FordChip
One coil of each front stock spring removed to produce
the “same” effect as an Eibach spring

[John F. Russo]

I should have read SargentMac's comment before I posted the above comment. He says the new Kooks exhaust is louder on the inside the car (he was a passenger in Logan's car). I do a lot of business talking on my cell phone and the MM at highway speeds with no changes in the exhaust, is louder than other Ford Crown VIcs that I have bought over and over again.

Is there anyway to make the Kooks no louder than what I already have?

[Mike M]

What is the chance of installing these and trying to utilize the stock exhaust? I know I would have to do some fabricating where the collectors meet the stock exhaust pipes but I feel it would be cheaper and quieter.

[SergntMac]

Originally posted by FordNut
That's more like it! For so long all we heard was "headers will not help produce power in a NA MM". Just been anxiously waiting for somebody to prove it.

As one who took that position, that headers will not improve performance, let's clarify what took place one year ago.

One year ago, there were few choices for the MM owner. One option was a set of full length headers from Sean Hyland, which showed minimal performance stats for the cost, approximately 1500 bucks for a system with high flow cats. 15 HP wasn't worth 1500 bucks, and the advertising of greater performance was flawed in testing.

During the research and exploration of the MM by Kenny Brown, three sets of headers and exhaust were fit to the 1x car, including a custom fab from Hooker. None of them provided HP/TQ improvements that would justify the expense. But that was last November too, and a lot has changed today.

Next came Reinhart's header/cat solution which showed greater performance with greater savings, under 1K for a complete system. This "shorty" based system is still a viable option for those of us who need to watch the pocketbook. It's a clean and simple install, with any talent you cn do it yourself in a few hours.

I have a new product from Renhart I will be testing soon, custom ported and polished manifolds from Pauls' High Performance. They were on display by my MM in Ennis, for those of you who passed by. This design should show greatly improved exhaust performance, without being visibly detected by the warranty hawks. A great idea from Reinhart, for those looking to improve without the risk of a full header setup. I have the "before" dyno on file, I'm waiting my turn for the install and "after" numbers. I expect good things from this setup, with benefits for the conservative owner.

I do not consider either of Reinhart's designs to be in direct competition with the Kook's setup. Indeed, it's nice to have a choice of designs allowing us to dial in our performance, and our out of pocket expenses as well.

Remember now, you should know where you are going with your mods before you purchase headers/custom exhaust. Investing in the wrong design because you want them now, may cost you lost performance, or, added costs for a swap out down the road. Think ahead, let your choice of headers be one of your last desicions. You'll get he most bang for the buck out of the correct design...IMHO

PS added after post.
I just noticed that this is posted in the Kook's forum, and I apologize for my error. None of it is meant to conflict with Kook's products in any manner. Kook's offers a selection for the MM, please check them out before you buy.

[TooManyFords]

Just got off the phone with Nick and purchased the complete set. Thanks to Logan for getting us the Club discount!

I'll be studying Logan's write-up and making changes (if necessary) as I find short-cuts. I'm going to try to streamline the install and have a local shop already hooked up to do the finishing touches to the custom exhaust.

All that said and done, I'll make my shop available to help others get these kits on.

Cheers!

[FordNut]

So Logan,
I guess you'll have a used 1-5/8" set for sale before too long... When you put the supercharger on you'll naturally need the bigger ones!

[Constable]

Mike, mine will be on within the next two weeks (although I said that a few weeks ag too... hmmm...). We'll have to meet up somewhere and you can check these bad boys out. There's no reason to hook up those 2" pipes to these monsters. You can use everything from the stock mufflers back. A custom cat / x-pipe is neccessary to run between the collecotrs and mufflers.

[Logan]

Part of the reason the exhaust is actually making power is because the stock exhaust is just plain restrictive. All you need to do is look at the dyno graph. The stock exhaust gives up the crapper after 5200rpm.

So just adapting the header to the stock, restrictive exhaust system may net you a couple horse, but no flow no where near what a full aftermarket custom job does.

If you want quiet, use the 18" magnaflows instead of the 14's I use... The 18's are ALOT quieter than mine.

[nick filippides]

John, As efficientcy increases so should fuel mileage. If an engine requires less effort to move the same weight, it should be more fuel efficient. Obviously this may not apply to engines that have had their air/fuel ratio altered. Of course most of us have a tendency to alter our driving habits when we introduce headers to our cars. There's something about the installation of headers that makes us want to drive the bee jeesus out of it until we get it out of our system. Unfortunately these new found driving habits, as much fun as they are, have a tendency of taking our fuel mileage and sending it into the toilet. Regardless of that, if all else is equal, Kooks headers will increase HP and torque and should give you a tick or two increase in fuel mileage. Nick "Kook's Headers"

[Strider74]

Logan, you are just too much. I have no idea what I would do without this site, thanks for all the hard work.

[Logan]

Nick is right, my mileage has increased...I'm getting roughly another .9-1.0 mpg on average...

So there ya have it, a mod that pays for itself!! :D Or at least, that's what you can tell the wife... :)

[TooManyFords]

Hey Logan!

Do you have that write-up for the header install done yet? I just got the x-pipe and hi-flow cats from Kooks yesterday and the headers are not far behind.

Thanks!

[nitrovic]

Nick,

Any plans for a vic long tube soon?

[MarauderHI]

Logan, Did you opt for the entire Kooks system, headers, x-pipe, convertors etc? The numbers you gave are truely outstanding as it seems this DOHC motor really needs to breathe. Thanks for sharing the dyno results.

MarauderHI
2004 Merc Marauder Red in the 50th state



Wow!

I just got back from doing the post-dyno on my car with the Kook's exhaust on and was so excited I just can't contain myself!

Wow! (It bears repeating)

The only caveat I have to mention is that my car has a 3000rpm stall in it, so getting number much below 4000rpm is near impossible on a dyno. BUT, I can tell you, the newly available amount of power and torque down low launches my car like you wouldn't believe out of the hole.

That being said, my car prior to the header install, was making 256.3rwhp and 278.6rwtq.

My car, post header install is now making....

285.7rwhp and 293.5rwtq!!

That's peak, 29hp and 15tq!!

What's important to examine is that although the peak numbers are high, there are even higher spreads in the torque and power bands throughout the curve. There's almost a 50hp spread on power at 6000rpm!!!

All in all, what a kick ass investment!!

[CRUZTAKER]

In the event Logan is busy or offline...


I am pretty sure he did what most of us have done, and that is purchase the ENTIRE Kooks kit which includes Headers, cats, h-pipe, and optional magnaflow mufflers.

And yes, the numbers are REAL!

[Logan]

What Cruz said. :)

[maraudernkc]

The Kooks system sure post some nice numbers and looks good to boot! :burnout:

[Yamaha]

Wow!

I just got back from doing the post-dyno on my car with the Kook's exhaust on and was so excited I just can't contain myself!

Wow! (It bears repeating)

The only caveat I have to mention is that my car has a 3000rpm stall in it, so getting number much below 4000rpm is near impossible on a dyno. BUT, I can tell you, the newly available amount of power and torque down low launches my car like you wouldn't believe out of the hole.

That being said, my car prior to the header install, was making 256.3rwhp and 278.6rwtq.

My car, post header install is now making....



285.7rwhp and 293.5rwtq!!

That's peak, 29hp and 15tq!!

What's important to examine is that although the peak numbers are high, there are even higher spreads in the torque and power bands throughout the curve. There's almost a 50hp spread on power at 6000rpm!!!

All in all, what a kick ass investment!!
Hi, I'm close to going the kooks full system route. Couple questions: Did you do the 1 3/4 or 1 5/8 diameter pipes and is there an exhaust drone at speed (80mph) ? I've go the 4.10's, Lidio chip and CAI. I'm in New Jersey and can drive to Kooks in LI for a local install. Thanks, Stan

[Ken]

Hi, I'm close to going the kooks full system route. Couple questions: Did you do the 1 3/4 or 1 5/8 diameter pipes and is there an exhaust drone at speed (80mph) ? I've go the 4.10's, Lidio chip and CAI. I'm in New Jersey and can drive to Kooks in LI for a local install. Thanks, StanI just got my 4:10 's last week; with the Lidio chip, CAI, and the Kook's full system. It is a pleasant sounding exhaust, I don't notice any drone. You won't be sorry. Go for the larger pipes, let it breathe!
Note: you may need to get dynoed and the A/F ratio adjusted, I didn't notice it after the Kook's, but I did after the JLT CAI install. Lidio said that it was about 13.7-13.8, instead of about 13.0.

Ken

[Logan]

The cars that have had a mild drone, it tends to dissipate after 1000 miles or so after the new mufflers get broken in a bit. My headers were 1 5/8's...

[Dan]

I have the Kooks and was hoping to go there for a "local install," too. Nick was my rep and made it all sound like going there for the install was ok. I also asked him to let me know prior to his finalizing the order and shipping so that I could make sure that I had the cash in my account.

The next thing I knew the headers were delivered and I was being told by Nick that they were "too busy" to do a local install. I'll leave open that Nick could have forgotten but I have been in sales and marketing a long time and am inclined to think that not forgetting stuff like that is part of the job.

I am happy with the product. I, personally, feel that they have a little too much drone but I also am in love with the HP gains and the comments that others make about the exhaust note.

There has been an occasional contact problem which I noticed by seeing light scratches in the Jet coating on one of the pipes. Again, not a major issue. Stuff like this is sort of to be expected from aftermarket parts; expecially in a set up where it is all so very tight.

I was mostly happy with the service. The only thing that I disliked was that I was overpromised and underdelivered with reference to the local install and pre credit card charge phone call.

I mean NO disprespect to anyone, especially a club sponsor and especially to not to Nick but I feel it is necessary to say how I felt I was treated for the sake of others who might be planning to drive to LI for an install. Please don't flame me for thinking about fellow club members.

Best,

Dan

[Marauder2005]

Wow!

I just got back from doing the post-dyno on my car with the Kook's exhaust on and was so excited I just can't contain myself!

Wow! (It bears repeating)

The only caveat I have to mention is that my car has a 3000rpm stall in it, so getting number much below 4000rpm is near impossible on a dyno. BUT, I can tell you, the newly available amount of power and torque down low launches my car like you wouldn't believe out of the hole.

That being said, my car prior to the header install, was making 256.3rwhp and 278.6rwtq.

My car, post header install is now making....

285.7rwhp and 293.5rwtq!!

That's peak, 29hp and 15tq!!

What's important to examine is that although the peak numbers are high, there are even higher spreads in the torque and power bands throughout the curve. There's almost a 50hp spread on power at 6000rpm!!!

All in all, what a kick ass investment!!

Logan, if you don't mind me asking, around how much did it cost you

to have the Kooks sytem installed? I need to have mine installed but

I am scared to ask for an estimate. :( Thank you.

[Dan]

I had mine installed by a shop and they charged me $600.00.

Dan

[Logan]

Count on 10 hours labor x whatever the shop rate is... The guy I work with is $40/hr... At a dealership, it's typically $75/hr...

[CRUZTAKER]

I paid $450 to a fellow that builds race cars from scratch. He did it in 5 hours, said it was relatively easy, particularly since I gave him all the install notes from our members here. BillyG has quite a writeup around here somewhere explaining every possible Marauder issue that could happen. The little things like a mis-aligned steering wheel shaft can wreak havok on an otherwise uneventfull install if unknown.;)

[Marauder2005]

I paid $450 to a fellow that builds race cars from scratch. He did it in 5 hours, said it was relatively easy, particularly since I gave him all the install notes from our members here. BillyG has quite a writeup around here somewhere explaining every possible Marauder issue that could happen. The little things like a mis-aligned steering wheel shaft can wreak havok on an otherwise uneventfull install if unknown.;)

Thanks guys, Cruz seems like you got a GREAT deal. Ill have to do a

search to find the install notes. Again, thank you

[MADDOG]

Aloha all,

Just recently bought my me a 2004 Marauder(only had 6,784 miles) and i am new to this forum. My current upgrades are: Flowmaster Super 40's with a Bassani X-pipe, JTL/RAI just arrived in the mail. (soon to be installed) I was wondering who has the KOOK's headers installed in their Marauders and how do they like it? More power, torque. Dose the headers make the exhaust louder and more aggressive? Would it work well with my current upgrades? Or what other headers works well with the Marauders?

Thanks MADDOG ; )

[MarauderMarc]

Aloha all,

Just recently bought my me a 2004 Marauder(only had 6,784 miles) and i am new to this forum. My current upgrades are: Flowmaster Super 40's with a Bassani X-pipe, JTL/RAI just arrived in the mail. (soon to be installed) I was wondering who has the KOOK's headers installed in their Marauders and how do they like it? More power, torque. Dose the headers make the exhaust louder and more aggressive? Would it work well with my current upgrades? Or what other headers works well with the Marauders?

Thanks MADDOG ; )

I have the setup. As of now I have the full setup with Magnaflow 14" mufflers and stock tail pipes. Im not crazy about the sound right now, but that will change tomarrow when I install my Super 40s and non delete tips. Heres a video for ya. Its of me doing a 0-90 launch with the windows cracked. It sounds okay, but I want that deep musclecar growl.

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/showcase/misc.php?do=downloadfile&i=1509

[SergntMac]

It sounds okay, but I want that deep musclecar growl. If you don't like what you have, listen around the Mustang and Cobra crowds? But, remember that no exhaust system can deliver what's not there in the first place...Cubic inch displacement.

[Constable]

If you don't like what you have, listen around the Mustang and Cobra crowds? But, remember that no exhaust system can deliver what's not there in the first place...Cubic inch displacement.


^^^ Good advice ^^^ -- It took me a while to accept that fact. I went through three sets of mufflers before I finally settled on Flowmaster 40's (which I had swore that I wouldn't put on my M).

BTW, listen more to the exhaust systems on Mach 1's. They're a bit closer to the M then GT's or even Cobra's. I know they have the same basic motor as the Cobra, but for some reason they do sound a bit different.

Also, check out Mac mufflers. Similar to Flowmasters, but they have more of a rasp. I've always liked the way they sounded.

[LVMarauder]

I just watched that video, Its tight. If you didnt get off of it you would have been at 110 in third in no time.

[BK_GrandMarquis]

I just watched that video, Its tight. If you didnt get off of it you would have been at 110 in third in no time.


:lol:
If he didn't get off it, he would have been in the middle of crossing traffic.:eek:

[mpearce]

Whats with the hesitation at the beginning?

Tire spin?

-Mat

[Vortech347]

Does anyone else have before/after dyno results from this system?

[KillJoy]

Does anyone else have before/after dyno results from this system?

What MOD are you referring to? Logan posted Before and After results of the Kooks in Post #1.

KillJoy

PS -Nice way to bring a post back from the dead ;)

[Vortech347]

The Kooks system. Other than just one car.