help with purchase

[duhtroll]

I have been driving a CVPI in the winter and it sucks. So, for next winter I will have something with AWD. It will be something American.

I have gone back and forth on this 10 different ways and I'm looking for some opinions from truck/crossover owners.

I have been on the Big 3 websites to browse around. Right now I am thinking small pickup, but I have also looked at crossovers like the Edge or even the Taurus X.

My family numbers three, so our requirements are as follows:

1. Enough seating for the three of us (our daughter is only 4 so she is fine in a smaller rear seat for the next few years) - which kinda eliminates the Ford Ranger since the rear seats are pretty nonexistent. The Chevy Colorado, on the other hand, has nice rear seats. The Dodge Dakota is between the two.

2. Enough room that it can haul a bunch of stuff - either a removable seat cargo area or pickup bed

3. Aforementioned AWD. I want a winter beast that laughs at snow. I like snow and won't be living in Florida anytime soon - but I want to be able to drive on snow better. I like the clearance height of trucks but I'm assuming the handling of the crossovers is better, so help is needed here.

4. Mileage must be at least 20+ highway. Gas *will* go up again - it's only a matter of when.

"Used F 150" would be perfect, except I don't need a full size truck for towing and mileage is too low. I don't think I will be towing a Marauder, but some of the light duty trucks could do it in a pinch for short trips. The 09 F150 is really nice but I don't want to be spending ~40K. (list)

Handling in the snow -- the last time I drove a pickup with any regularity was in high school and the smaller trucks were terrible on snow due to no weight in the back. Have truck makers been able to compensate for this, or should I be looking at crossovers?

Any insight here would be appreciated.

[RoyLPita]

You might be able to get a good deal on a Taurus X because 2009 is the last year for it. Some dealers may also be clearancing out the 2008 F150s.

[Haggis]

Get an Explorer, Chris's '95, the one I drive is a workhorse and has 250,000mi on it and gets about 20mph on regular.

[bugsys03]

My AWD Chrysler Pacifica fits all your specs and gets good mileage too. You can get them pretty cheap because Chrysler decided in their infinite wisdom to purge all the Daimler influenced vehicles except the 300, so 2008 was the last year for production. We have had a lot of snow the last 2 years and it is fantastic, will go through 8-12 inches and not spin a wheel.

[Bradley G]

If you like the idea of a small p/u , the Explorer Sport trac offers excellent comfort for driver and passenger(s), excellent winter manners with a four wheel drive .
If you get the 4.0L W/3:55 gears you could easily get your twenty MPG highway.
Buy Ford! LOL

[Bluerauder]

I Any insight here would be appreciated.

My wife has been driving her '06 Ford Freestyle Limited (now Taurus X) for 3 years. Both of us love the car. It is roomy, comfortable, and can be configured for hauling lots of stuff very quickly. We get 26.2 MPG consistently on the highway even running at 70-75 MPH. Only about 16-17 MPG around town with lots of short trips and stop-and-go. Our Freestyle has the 3.0 Duratek with CVT. New Taurus X has the 3.5L with 6 Speed automatic (mileage might be a tad less with the Taurus X). Very comfortable on long trips. Lots of nice features. Limited towing ability (rated as Class I) 200 pounds tongue and 2,000 pound trailer.

Three rows of seats for up to 7 people. Enough room behind the third row for a good trip to the grocery store. Drop the 3rd row in under 30 seconds. Drop the 2nd row in another 30 seconds. You can even fold down the front passenger seatback if you have a long item like a surfboard (everyone needs those in Iowa).

In my opinion, the Freestyle is a perfect family vehicle. Wish I would have had the option when my family was growing. Both the wife and I are happy with the Freestyle (Taurus X).

PM me if you have any more questions related to the Freestyle/Taurus X. Pic below.

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/showcase/files/1/8/9/1/Freestyle2_thumb.jpg (http://www.mercurymarauder.net/showcase/showimage.php?i=1036&c=3&userid=1891)

[PSG]

We have a few of the ford Escape's at work , some with pretty good milage on them and they have been really good , not one mechanical problem that i can think of

[Got_1]

i would say ford escape is your best bet. i work at a ford dealer and we only see those vehicles in for scheduled maintenance. barely a problem at all with them. the explorer would be a great choice if towing is a concern but i would get one with the 4.6l V8. it is a much more reliable engine that gets decent gas mileage and has the extra power if needed

[duhtroll]

Good replies. Another friend of mine (who is rather large of build) raved about the Pacifica also - she said they got 7 inside with no troubles very comfortably.

Is the Taurus X the same as the Freestyle? They look a bit different. We had considered an Escape, but I think my wife might be getting one of those soon, or an AWD Fusion.

In the small pickup department Ford just gets owned in the seating department. It's a shame that if I want a small pickup I have to go Mopar or Chevy.

[mpearce]

Having owned 4WD SUV's since 1992, and now an AWD...I would definitely suggest you "dont" get a pick up for the winter. I have enjoyed hauling all my crap around for years, in a warm, dry, SUV.

I had a 1992 Jeep Cherokee, a 1995 Yukon GT, and now a 2006 AWD SS Trailblazer.

I can't even begin to tell you how much I love the SS Trailblazer. You can get them used now for awesome prices. The only thing though is that LS2 V8 nails you on the gas @ 15mpg...but seriously...it's not that big of a deal...unless you make 30K a year and drive 60 miles a day for work.

With a set of 17" black steelies, and fresh Pirelli Scorpion Ice and Snow's, I've had absolutely no issues whatsoever...and the winter in Cleveland is rough this year.

Love the SS Trailblazer.

-Mat

[Bluerauder]

Is the Taurus X the same as the Freestyle? They look a bit different. We had considered an Escape, but I think my wife might be getting one of those soon, or an AWD Fusion.

The Freestyle was rebadged as the Taurus X beginning in 2008. Comes in FWD and AWD versions. The vehicle is basically the same. However, as I mentioned above, the Freestyle had the 3.0 liter Duratek coupled to the Continuous Variable Transmission (CVT). The Taurus X was "upgraded" to a 3.5 Liter with a 6-speed automatic transmission. There were early reports that the Freestyle was underpowered. Personally, I never noticed that as a problem. I think the grill was changed on the Taurus X and the taillights were redesigned with the clearlook lights. The Taurus X offers a power liftgate option. Those are the basic differences that I can remember. Visually, they are pretty much identical IMHO.

I am a member on the Freestyle/Taurus X board. Many of the folks that end up buying the Freestyle/Taurus X had also looked at the Pacifica and others; but decided on the Freestyle/Taurus X. I think the net cargo room in the Freestyle/Taurus X is more than most others in it's class. Guess you will have to compare both and make your own choice. As I mentioned, we have had the '06 Freestyle for 3 years and haven't had a problem. Did I mention the 5-star safety rating? It is based on the Volvo XC90 chassis if I remember correctly. Our Freestyle has front, side, side curtain (back to the 3rd row) airbags and full safety package. Folks in the snowbelt and up in Canada say the AWD is among the best in bad conditions.

Just bought an '09 Ford Escape for my daughter. Much smaller and shorter. 4-5 seater with smaller cargo capacity. It is also a great vehicle. She just wanted something smaller and more SUVish than CUV/stationwagonish.

[LOWBUCKMM]

if you want a small pickup get a explorer sport trac. seats 4 comfortably, has a bed and the back window rolls down. i had a ranger and i love the hell out of it. it had the 4.0 v6 plenty of power and more with my superchips programmer. and i beat 2 dakota r/ts with and boy they were mad. if you like the rangers but need a 4door one thats baseicly a explorer sport trac. or even a explorer would be great they are great in the snow drive both of them and i think you would like one of them.

[Aren Jay]

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[hot-rauder]

Good replies. Another friend of mine (who is rather large of build) raved about the Pacifica also - she said they got 7 inside with no troubles very comfortably.

Is the Taurus X the same as the Freestyle? They look a bit different. We had considered an Escape, but I think my wife might be getting one of those soon, or an AWD Fusion.

In the small pickup department Ford just gets owned in the seating department. It's a shame that if I want a small pickup I have to go Mopar or Chevy.


My FWSD Fusion laughs at snow. I have gone through lots of it this year in New England and it is solid. The AWD, which my GFs uncles has, is super sticky. Highly recomended.

The interior has lots of room and can seat 6ft+ adults in the rear seats comfortably. The trunk amazed me and with fold down rear seats there is a lot of space.

I average 35mpg with mine.

[hot-rauder]

also the new Jeeps are nice, Grand Cherokee has lots of room and is solid.

Or my new favorite the Ford Flex lol

[Raudermaster]

I laugh at the 4.0l with 3.55's comment. The 4.0l gets the same mileage as a 4.6l does. We've had 2 Explorer's with the 4.0's, both sucked and were complete pigs. Our '04 4.6l Explorer was awesome. Very comfy, plenty of power, and maintained 17-20mpg on the highway (AWD kills that.) I really dislike the Colorado/Canyon's, but I haven't had experience with them. I've always liked the fact that you can get a Dakota with a V8. My boss had an '01 crew cab with the 3.9l and sold it last year, she got her money's worth out of that and didn't have to replace anything. I say if you want a small truck, I'd honestly go with the Dakota. Why get a Ranger with a 4.0, when you can get a Dak with a 4.7 V8 and get the same mileage right?

[Raudermaster]

My FWSD Fusion laughs at snow. I have gone through lots of it this year in New England and it is solid. The AWD, which my GFs uncles has, is super sticky. Highly recomended.

The interior has lots of room and can seat 6ft+ adults in the rear seats comfortably. The trunk amazed me and with fold down rear seats there is a lot of space.

I average 35mpg with mine.

True, an AWD Fusion would be nice. Our V6 FWD one is damn good in snow. Hey Adam, I like the Flex's too. They're so pricey though. A Limited one lists for $48k.

[Bradley G]

The 4.0 L will get 20 mpg, the Explorer has been in production as a segment leader for almost twenty years, I think your MPG info is dated!.
If you think a Dodge or Chevy p/u is nicer than a Sport Trac(current)for seating comfort, I would say you have not been inside them.:twocents:
I laugh at the 4.0l with 3.55's comment. The 4.0l gets the same mileage as a 4.6l does. We've had 2 Explorer's with the 4.0's, both sucked and were complete pigs. Our '04 4.6l Explorer was awesome. Very comfy, plenty of power, and maintained 17-20mpg on the highway (AWD kills that.) I really dislike the Colorado/Canyon's, but I haven't had experience with them. I've always liked the fact that you can get a Dakota with a V8. My boss had an '01 crew cab with the 3.9l and sold it last year, she got her money's worth out of that and didn't have to replace anything. I say if you want a small truck, I'd honestly go with the Dakota. Why get a Ranger with a 4.0, when you can get a Dak with a 4.7 V8 and get the same mileage right?

[Aren Jay]

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[duhtroll]

Taking a second look at the sport trac. Problem is if I go used they are harder to find.

Thanks, Bradley - this is the front runner. The V8 gets better mileage than the V6 due to gearing and tranny - go figure! Dang, I'll have to get another V8. :)


The 4.0 L will get 20 mpg, the Explorer has been in production as a segment leader for almost twenty years, I think your MPG info is dated!.
If you think a Dodge or Chevy p/u is nicer than a Sport Trac(current)for seating comfort, I would say you have not been inside them.:twocents:

[Bradley G]

20 year Ford seller here, I may be a little one way Ford, but it comes by me honestly.:P
Good luck

[n3fvg]

I have been driving a CVPI in the winter and it sucks. So, for next winter I will have something with AWD. It will be something American.

I have gone back and forth on this 10 different ways and I'm looking for some opinions from truck/crossover owners.

I have been on the Big 3 websites to browse around. Right now I am thinking small pickup, but I have also looked at crossovers like the Edge or even the Taurus X.

My family numbers three, so our requirements are as follows:

1. Enough seating for the three of us (our daughter is only 4 so she is fine in a smaller rear seat for the next few years) - which kinda eliminates the Ford Ranger since the rear seats are pretty nonexistent. The Chevy Colorado, on the other hand, has nice rear seats. The Dodge Dakota is between the two.

2. Enough room that it can haul a bunch of stuff - either a removable seat cargo area or pickup bed

3. Aforementioned AWD. I want a winter beast that laughs at snow. I like snow and won't be living in Florida anytime soon - but I want to be able to drive on snow better. I like the clearance height of trucks but I'm assuming the handling of the crossovers is better, so help is needed here.

4. Mileage must be at least 20+ highway. Gas *will* go up again - it's only a matter of when.

"Used F 150" would be perfect, except I don't need a full size truck for towing and mileage is too low. I don't think I will be towing a Marauder, but some of the light duty trucks could do it in a pinch for short trips. The 09 F150 is really nice but I don't want to be spending ~40K. (list)

Handling in the snow -- the last time I drove a pickup with any regularity was in high school and the smaller trucks were terrible on snow due to no weight in the back. Have truck makers been able to compensate for this, or should I be looking at crossovers?

Any insight here would be appreciated.

I personally own a Chrysler Aspen SUV (AWD/4WD) that meets all your requirements. It has a 5.7L Hemi in it though, you may be interested in the smaller V8. I get about 14MPG city and around 20MPG highway without towing and keeping my foot out of it. I do have a Magnaflow Cat Back Exhaust and a Airaid CAI on it. It is like a tank in the snow, especially when I am in the mountains. I have even towed my ATV in the snow without problems. I previously had a 2003 Ford Expedition which I also liked very much. Had the 5.4L engine and had the same gas mileage as the Aspen and handled/towed the same.
A very good friend of mine has a Ford Edge. He likes it but hasn't had it in the snow yet. He thinks it should be getting better gas mileage.

[O's Fan Rich]

I've been driving a Lincoln MKX AWD for almost a year now (17k miles) It's excellent.
The AWD works very well, even getting me up to Mom and Dad's via thier 1/4 HILL driveway with a hard S curve with no traction problems.
The Ford Edge is it's counterpart.

[duhtroll]

Wow - kinda stumbled on this but now I'm learning - seems 4WD and AWD are definitely 2 different animals, and 4WD is preferable if I want a snow monster:

Copied from wikianswers - comments?

4WD = Low range and High Range gearing
AWD = Only high range gearing

Part-time 4WD: No centre differential. Cannot be used on dry/wet, semi-slippery roads due to the lack of the centre differential. When activated, both front and rear axles are physically locked to each other and have to spin at the same rate. This becomes a problem when turning on sufficiently high friction surfaces. Examples: Suzuki SUVs, most 4WD pickup trucks, cheaper SUVs.

Permanent 4WD:. No two wheel drive mode. System is equipped with a centre differential, and hence is safe to use on all surfaces. All four wheels are powered all of the time (usually 50/50 front and rear axles). This is arguably the best system since the torque split ratio does not change and is the most predictable. All wheels "help out" all of the time and this stabilises the vehicle + improves handling. With the extra two drive wheels, the vehicle has twice the amount of traction all of the time (even in no-slip conditions) vs. a 2WD vehicle. Examples: MB M-class SUV, the Range/Land Rovers.

Full-time 4WD: Basically permanent 4WD but with a 2WD mode. This was born out of customer demand (for a 2WD mode). Examples: Toyota Sequoia, Mitsubishi Montero.

Permanent AWD: Basically permanent 4WD but without low range gearing. Examples include the Audi Quattro AWD system, the MB's 4-matic AWD system, Subaru's manual transmission AWD system.

Full-time AWD: System is active at all times, however in most cases, the one set of wheels (usually the rears) only receive 5-10% of the engine's power unless slippage occurs. At that point, power is progressively transfered to the opposite axle to help out. Some systems can transfer power to the rear upon acceleration to improve traction. However, they revert to 2WD mode when coasting.

[SC Cheesehead]

Wow - kinda stumbled on this but now I'm learning - seems 4WD and AWD are definitely 2 different animals, and 4WD is preferable if I want a snow monster:

Copied from wikianswers - comments?

Interesting! I wasn't aware of the substantial differences, thanks for posting!

[n3fvg]

Wow - kinda stumbled on this but now I'm learning - seems 4WD and AWD are definitely 2 different animals, and 4WD is preferable if I want a snow monster:

Copied from wikianswers - comments?

4WD = Low range and High Range gearing
AWD = Only high range gearing

Part-time 4WD: No centre differential. Cannot be used on dry/wet, semi-slippery roads due to the lack of the centre differential. When activated, both front and rear axles are physically locked to each other and have to spin at the same rate. This becomes a problem when turning on sufficiently high friction surfaces. Examples: Suzuki SUVs, most 4WD pickup trucks, cheaper SUVs.

Permanent 4WD:. No two wheel drive mode. System is equipped with a centre differential, and hence is safe to use on all surfaces. All four wheels are powered all of the time (usually 50/50 front and rear axles). This is arguably the best system since the torque split ratio does not change and is the most predictable. All wheels "help out" all of the time and this stabilises the vehicle + improves handling. With the extra two drive wheels, the vehicle has twice the amount of traction all of the time (even in no-slip conditions) vs. a 2WD vehicle. Examples: MB M-class SUV, the Range/Land Rovers.

Full-time 4WD: Basically permanent 4WD but with a 2WD mode. This was born out of customer demand (for a 2WD mode). Examples: Toyota Sequoia, Mitsubishi Montero.

Permanent AWD: Basically permanent 4WD but without low range gearing. Examples include the Audi Quattro AWD system, the MB's 4-matic AWD system, Subaru's manual transmission AWD system.

Full-time AWD: System is active at all times, however in most cases, the one set of wheels (usually the rears) only receive 5-10% of the engine's power unless slippage occurs. At that point, power is progressively transfered to the opposite axle to help out. Some systems can transfer power to the rear upon acceleration to improve traction. However, they revert to 2WD mode when coasting.

I learned that scenerio when I purchased my Chrysler Aspen which is Permanent 4WD. Has 4WD and 4WD Low along with "neutral". Does perform exactly as you described. I also had no idea about the differences until I purchased the Aspen, although I have owned 4WD vehicles all my adult life.

[duhtroll]

I kept wondering when building vehicles on the ford website "why does it list a 4WD AND AWD? That's really stupid." Then the edmunds.com comparisons did the same thing along with some other sites, so I started googling.

In any event, the pickups I looked at are 4WD, not AWD, and the Explorer Sport Trac has both options available.

Right now in the running I have: (all 2009 models are what I compared)

1) Explorer ST - has the edge because I think it will be better ride and better on snow.
2) Dodge Dakota (I just like the looks of this flareside and it's very comparable to the Explorer on paper, with better mileage, plus a bit cheaper -- the test driving will decide who wins).
3) F150 is still in the running - it's an excellent design with that new flat floor -- just not sure I want to spend that much. We'll see what the deals are this summer. It's only 1 MPG less than the EST. I definitely do not need this much vehicle but I keep it on the list in case I win Powerball or something.

[Qrsterling]

I had a similar problem in my 99 CrVic. I used to get stuck in wet grass, with one wheel on pavement/a driveway (late winter, early springtime on soft ground). I bought a used locking rear diff at the Carlisle Ford show, had it installed, and now drive flawlessly in the winter. It's still a 3.27 for good mpg. $400. total ($100. part, $300. install) is less than a new or used car. I also grew up in Buffalo, so snow driving is intuitive for me, but with this new differential, I drive in 2-3 inches of snow at 65mph on the highway with no worries.

[duhtroll]

Bumping this comment because all of the reviews I have read on the Sport Trac complain of dismal gas mileage. The V6 is worse than the V8 according to ratings, and I have yet to read reviews that state they get over 20MPG, either V6 or V8. Most say 15-17 MPG, which is just not good enough. If I were buying a full size F150 for real work I could see that, but this will primarily be a commuter vehicle that is good in snow and can haul if needed. I'd like the option of better MPG.

Thoughts?


If you like the idea of a small p/u , the Explorer Sport trac offers excellent comfort for driver and passenger(s), excellent winter manners with a four wheel drive .
If you get the 4.0L W/3:55 gears you could easily get your twenty MPG highway.
Buy Ford! LOL