More Reinhart Magic!

[SergntMac]

A few weeks back, I dialed a phone number...

"Reinhart..."
"Dennis, this is Mac in Chicago"
"Yes..."
"I'm considering adding headers, and..."
"No you're not. You're gonna buy these new manifolds I just got from Paul."
"I am?"
"They will make more power than the Cobra shorties."
"Ummm...okay, but..."
"I have another call."
"Okay...Bye."

Don't you just love the warmth of this gentleman?

In Marauderville, Dennis handed me a set of ceramic coated manifolds, and I put them on display at the rear of my MM. Once I arrived home, the rest of the exhaust kit was waiting for me, a one piece pre-assembled exhaust pipe system with two high flow cats, four exhaust sensor mounts, an X pipe, and all the necessary hardware to bolt up to my OEM tail pipes.

Today, Zack and I went to High Performance in Chicago Ridge and strapped my MM down for a "before" pull.

411 RWHP/383 RWTQ...Real real wheel numbers, not peaks donchano.

Thankfully, this is an above ground DynoJet, and we could get to work on the exhaust system without any problems.

The install is straight forward. I prefer hand tools, Zack leans towards air tools and impact stuff. Nonetheless, we had no real problems, everything fit like a glove.

There is some cutting required, once your new exhaust pipes are almost in place, the OEM exhaust pipe needs to be tailored to fit. If you know what your exhaust system looks like, it will be somewhere after the "H" pipe, but before the "bowtie" support flange. How you cut this pipe is your choice, we used a "sawsall" reciprocating saw. Polished off some burrs with a file, and bolted it all together.

The "after" dyno is not impressive.

It's alarming!

439RWHP/399RWTQ...Real real wheel numbers, not peaks.

I don't know what Dennis is going to charge for this exhaust system, but it should be reasonable, and surely worth it, performance-wise. The fit and finish is almost perfect too.

There is another benefit here. This system appears OEM, all the parts have FMC part numbers on them. It would take another knowledgeable MM owner to detect any difference, and that has to be attractive to those of us who are warranty concerned. I seriously doubt that any factory rep from LM, or, any LM wrench anywhere, would be able to point to this exhaust system and call it an aftermarket mod. Besides, I like being sneaky on the street too. Now...About the sound.

My exhaust system tone and tenor is louder and deeper, at the tip, standing behind the car. She barks!

I hear no noticible increase in volume from inside the passenger cabin, and no more "drone" anywhere at 1500 RPM. But, I still know I am making more noise out of the tail pipe, noise that others outside the car hear. She barks!

Inside the car, you continue to get a pleasing hum throughout the RPM range, and without underfoot vibration, or, any cabin drone I can speak of. You could invite your boss to sit in the back seat, and he/she would not be uncomfortable there. Meanwhile, that snotty Corvette owner who just pulled up next to you? Laugh out loud...He's an appetizer to the business lunch y'all are heading to.

That's about it for now, folks, let the questions begin?

Dennis...Thank you. You have another MM winner here in this mod. 28 HP/15 FtLb TQ, @ the rear wheels is magic, what do I owe you besides my life?

Oh, BTW...Y'all better be looking past this recent snow tire deal. By next spring, y'all will be searching for the best RW replacement tire deal, once you plug into THIS Reinhart magic...IMHO.

[Marauderman]

I guess I musy have missed a bunch somewhere but I'm confused....

I thought you purchased KB # 1 awhile back --right and it already had 450 RWHP.....and all the installs from KB like you ref above...... where did I miss something?

[Zack]

Another day spent with friends, cars and stories in the making.
I expected to see a 10-12 hp increase, because after all, they are just cast manifolds reworked a little. But after inspection, these cobra pieces are the real deal; a ton of material is removed along with a 'swirling' exhaust flow design within the manifold.
The result is raw power, witness it for yourself!

[JET]

Mac what did you end up doing about the trans?

[Petrograde]

Wow, Big Sarge! sounds freakin' great! ..and you say they look OEM..... okay Dennis, how 'bout a ballpark figure?

[SergntMac]

Originally posted by marauderman
I guess I must have missed a bunch somewhere but I'm confused. I thought you purchased KB # 1 awhile back and it already had 450 RWHP.....and all the installs from KB like you ref above. Where did I miss something?
Thank you for asking, marauderman.

Y'all please read further down the thread.

[Mongoose]

okay Dennis, how 'bout a ballpark figure?

.....and a best guesstimate of HP & TQ increase for a stocker?

[RCSignals]

Are these completely new cast iron exhaust manifolds, or reworked stock ones?
Hopefully Dennis will have pictures like he did of the shorties

[Dennis Reinhart]

Originally posted by SergntMac
A few weeks back, I dialed a phone number...

"Reinhart..."
"Dennis, this is Mac in Chicago"
"Yes..."
"I'm considering adding headers, and..."
"No you're not. You're gonna buy these new manifolds I just got from Paul."
"I am?"
"They will make more power than the Cobra shorties."
"Ummm...okay, but..."
"I have another call."
"Okay...Bye."

Don't you just love the warmth of this gentleman?

tire deal, once you plug into THIS Reinhart magic...IMHO.

Darn I am blushing:alone:
RC
I will post pictures tomorrow, I was approved today for a brand new, above ground Dyno Jet Chassis Dyno today, I will be setup by the end of October then I can post and do more research and development on this car, I will post be fore and after dyno runs, The guys at Superchips are leaving me a brand new Blue Marauder tomorrow to put a S/C kit on, I am going to let them take my Blue one, and do before and after dyno runs with the ported intake, I will post these results as soon as I can, I am going to the bank tomorrow to close the deal on my new 7000 SQ foot facility, with in ground dyno.

[CRUZTAKER]

Mac:
Non-motorhead here....do I now keep saving $$ and skip the shorty header package and wait for this? The exhaust is next on my list after the t/c.

PM if you have a moment.
TX -Barry

[Logan]

Dyno sheet... Dyno sheet....Dyno sheet!!! :D

[SergntMac]

Originally posted by marauderman
I guess I must have missed a bunch somewhere but I'm confused. I thought you purchased KB # 1 awhile back and it already had 450 RWHP.....and all the installs from KB like you ref above. Where did I miss something?
I just got off the phone with a friend who said I should address this question. I don't think I need to, but I was warned that to ignore it would paint in the pastel of "he has something to hide."

I have nothing to hide, I feel it's a question that belongs elsewhere, and it takes away from my intent here. Nonetheless...

The KB 1x passed through a number of hands before I bought her. In March of '03, AutoWeek published a magazine article, as well as produced a televivion special for Speed Channel. Autoweek examined and tested this car, and proclaimed the "450+" HP. Following Autoweek was Car and Driver, who also examined and tested this car to their own standards. Again, "450+" HP was stated in their April, '03 issue.

All of this occured prior to my ownership, and the only proof I have are copies of the articles and television show. It's my understanding that you do not tell magazines and journals what to print. They test the car and report to the readers. I do not refute these claims, however, I have my own standards to be met.

When I took ownership, I received a dyno sheet and time slips from Kenny Brown, as follows;

11/16/02-448 HP. 5/19/03-457.0 HP. 5/19/'03-465.4 HP
I also got a handful of time slips from Indianopolis Dragway dated 5/20/03, showing ETs ranging from 12.7x to 13.1x, I believe Top Fuel driver Brendan Bernstein was the pilot. I don't have any skid pad numbers, but one drive in this car will tell you they are up. This is all great stuff for the scrap book, but it wasn't my car then, and I have my own interpretation of these facts and figures.

I'm intrested in one number, where the rubber meets the road. I call that the "mean" number, as opposed to the "peak," or "highest" HP number of the pull. Moreover, I'm more interested in building torque, because without torque, you won't develop HP. So, my dyno testing develops lower HP numbers than that which was published, and I am not further concerned about it.

My base line pull before the manifold install was 411 RWHP/383 RWTQ, and after the install, 439 RWHP/399RWTQ, you can backward calculate that to other numbers as you please. 'Nuff said, this thread is not about my car, KBs build strategy, or, a lesson in reading dyno sheets. It's about building your MM with quality mods, and getting the most bang for your buck.

Dennis Reinhart developed an exhaust kit that produces hard, clean power, without breaking your budget, or, your knuckles. By combining off- the-shelf FMC parts and adding a touch of Paul's clean up honing and polishing, Dennis assembles all the hardware into one box and with the attiude "this is your answer."

IMHO, if you have shorties in place, keep them. If not, and you plan on building your MM, here's the hard facts on polished manifolds and high flow cats from Dennis.

BTW, I spoke with the KB people this morning, and they are very pleased with this development. Last year, while developing the first S/C MM to hit the streets, they were frustrated by an aftermarket with no options at a reasonable cost. Headers were developed and tested, and were either too expensive to add to the option list, or, did not produce sufficient results for the cost involved. Kenny Brown's Marauder S is delived with OEM exhaust, and it still kicks azz. They are considering adding this mod to the Marauder S menu, "stay tuned"...LOL

Dennis "asked" me to do this because he knows I'm not going to BS any MM owner over it's true value. I did this a lot last year with his Stage I and Stage II packages. I believe I've tested just about everything he offers short of the full supercharger kit, and I've reported my findings here free of influence from Reinhart. I bought every mod I installed, and I paid for the dyno testing too. It's all in the history here, page back and read up.

This kit produces good bang for the buck, 28 HP and 15 FtLbs. TQ, and I would expect "ball-park" numbers on any MM. Pricing is Reinhart's turf, call him. But expect a very reasonable and affordable price, considering the results I hope we haven't drifted too far from that important point.

I don't have the dyno sheets in hand right now, the printer at the dyno was out of ink. I will have them soon. Meanwhile, anyone who's interested can call Mike at High Speed Performance for verification...708.499.5220 of my data. When I get the sheets, I'll e-mail them to those asking. I will not post them here, that just leads to tasteless cross-examination which I will not submit to. I'm here only as a MM owner, not as a represenative of KB, or Renhart.

BTW, my tranny is fine, 100 bucks in parts and two hours "on the bench" shop time. The diagnosis is the same affecting a lot of MM owners, production line screw ups and a weak intermediate clutch pack snap ring. IMHO, this failure is a FMC/LM problem and has nothing to do with KB, Reinhart, Trilogy, or supercharging at large.

I'm done...Anyone have change for a dollar?

[JET]

SergntMac,

I have 2 cents for a dollar. LOL

I’m glad to hear your car is fine.

So when are Windy City guys going to take those S/C Marauders back to the track and give us the only numbers that really matter? How it performs on the road.

[SergntMac]

Originally posted by marauder2306
SergntMac, I have 2 cents for a dollar. LOL I’m glad to hear your car is fine. So when are Windy City guys going to take those S/C Marauders back to the track and give us the only numbers that really matter? How it performs on the road.

I'd like to go tonight, GLD has a test and tune open from 6-10 PM, but I know this would not be as productive as it could be, without slicks. I'm working on it today, let y'all know if it happens.

[MERCMAN]

MAC, Is L/M aware of this "shortcoming" in the tranny? And if so, have there been any TSBs to that effect? Or are they using the usual logic of fixing it when it breaks, and re-installing the same type of "defective" (or sub quality) parts?

[MM03MOK]

Originally posted by mercman
Or are they using the usual logic of fixing it when it breaks, and re-installing the same type of "defective" (or sub quality) parts? That's our concern over this issue too..... Either L/M swaps it out under warranty and you take your chances again, or you spend the "100 bucks in parts and two hours "on the bench" shop time" to eliminate the problem. I will be watching this discsussion closely.

[MERCMAN]

And the NEXT logical question is,,,,(drum roll please) if you do spend the money and have it done right, does it void the warrenty?

[RF Overlord]

Originally posted by mercman
And the NEXT logical question is,,,,(drum roll please) if you do spend the money and have it done right, does it void the warrenty?

Are you new, here?...of course it will...

:lol: :lol:

[MERCMAN]

AH!!! Sarcasm,, and here i thought it was a lost art!:lol:

[MAD-3R]

Mac,
Some of the members are a little "warrenty shy" about mods.

Will this void warrenty? Only if the dealer is hell bent on voiding it. it is an OEM part, if not THE OEM part. It's just purty.

[cyclone03]

It would be nice to see a non supercharged cars response to this mod...

[MAD-3R]

The Wife said no. :(

[MAD-3R's Wife]

The Wife said "not at this time".

[MERCMAN]

mac, back to your original post, in your experience, do you think similar gains in H/P and torque would be seen on a N/A MM ie: STOCK? I like the idea of FMC parts and I LOVE the idea of more power without any engine mods. Also, do you have any idea when DR will be letting us know the $$ of this? Will this fall under stage 1 or 2??:)

[Marauderman]

Originally posted by SergntMac
Thank you for asking, marauderman.

Y'all please read further down the thread.

Thank you for pointing the way---( Earlier- I thought you may have had a bad day- I let it ride for awhile---edit works well) Tom

[Bigdogjim]

Mac: I think/feel it was a wise move on your part to explain the differance in HP ratings. I was thinking something was amiss when I first read the post. The gain in HP is nothing short of wild!:)

That beening said we can move on.>> To the transmission.
I guess its a wait and see.(If they step up and fix it) I still did not hear from the fleet dealer to see if this a issue on the F-series Super Duty pickups.

I will post if I hear anything.


How about our in house Ford & L&M guys anything?

[SergntMac]

Y'all...can I take a breath here? Please?

I'm going to a local track soon, to gather some performance numbers together, for a best "overall' evaluation of this mod. Give me a day or two to assemble this, please? BRB...

[RCSignals]

Mac, you back yet? ;)

[Bigdogjim]

Originally posted by RCSignals
Mac, you back yet? ;)

Time fly's when your having fun:)

Take your time we'll be here:cool: :)

[SergntMac]

Originally posted by mercman
mac, back to your original post, in your experience, do you think similar gains in H/P and torque would be seen on a N/A MM ie: STOCK? I like the idea of FMC parts and I LOVE the idea of more power without any engine mods. Also, do you have any idea when DR will be letting us know the $$ of this? Will this fall under stage 1 or 2??:)

I think the minimum performance you could expect to see from this mod, is 20 HP and 10 lbs TQ to a bone stock MM.

I suggest that the polished intake and exhaust kits should be Stage III mods, adding them to a N/A car will produce remarkable results.

There's another post out here from Reinhart, where he added the polished intake and exhaust to a Stage I/II N/A MM. and broke into the high 13's. With what these cars weigh, that would require more than 300 RWHP/TQ.

Way to go Dennis!

I was hoping to get to the track this afternoon, but we got rain. guess I get to hang here and bug y'all after all. Next chance for some times with be next Tues/Wed, we'll see?

[Ross]

This is a very interesting thread, and I thank Dennis for developing another great product, and Mac for his testing and reporting. Since I will be staying NA for the foreseeable future, this is the kind of mod I am looking at for adding HP and torque, while not breaking the bank. Now the big question for me: Assuming that Dennis' price for this kit is similar to the Kook's headers kit like Logan recently added to his car, and the results look very similar, what are the advantages/disadvantages of one versus the other? Obviously, if Dennis' kit keeps the OEM look and doesn't void a warranty, that's a big plus for a lot of people. Other than that, what are the ups and downs of one versus the other? If this post doesn't belong in this thread since this is on Dennis' forum, please remove it Logan, and I will re-post on the garage forum.

[MarauderBoy]

At the chicken run I had a chance to see the exhaust first hand. Other than the shiny paint, it's factory topside right down to the part numbers. Underneath, the pipes fit great and look factory. They don't hang too low or too close to the floor boards. Soundwise, mellow at idle with a slight increase in sound but nothing that couldn't be attributed to a change in mufflers. But... Mac was generous to allow a few quick joy rides to the members. All I can say is - joyous noise and sign me up!