clearcoat/paint

[dave]

:bat: It is with a heavy heart that i tell all black marauders owners the time has come...... the clearcoat is fading away. Can this be fixed easily or must I now consider a complete new paint job? :help:

[GordonB]

Need the body shop and paint experts to check in on this one.

Might come down to 'how far gone is gone'?

GordonB

[Stranger in the Black Sedan]

Probably looking at a repaint. If the clear is failing, it is also probably failing to protect the base coat underneath it. Actually a lot of the time clear coat appears to fail because the substrate underneath is failing, not the clear itself.

Especially if you can't be sure what caused the failure, you're playing russian roulette if you don't strip the car back far enough.

[bobsawyer7]

There are a lot of threads about paint, especially 2003 Black problems. The cancerous spotting which seems common.:( From what I can determine nothing short of a repaint solves it in a permanent way.
I just got an estimate for the upper surfaces (roof,trunk,hood) which is to strip, re-etch and re-do.
The sides surfaces are pretty good and can probably use a wet sand and new clear to make them better again.

[Stranger in the Black Sedan]

I forgot to lend my example. My 300A was repainted before it was ever even sold, 37 miles on the OASIS reports, due to clear coat blistering of the factory paint. They did a scuff and shoot, definitely not stripped back past the failing OE clear. It has held up mostly well but you can see a few little blisters here and there up close, coming through the refinish clear. Probably only I notice it right now but if I had paid to have the repaint done and it started doing this I would be pissed.

Do it right once or you'll end up doing it twice!

[Rocknthehawk]

it needs to be stripped.

it is not fun.

[juno]

I need a repaint also. I don't know whether to paint it or sell it. :(

[Ms. Denmark]

Just got an estimate to have the hood painted and touch ups on some minor road rash issues. Going to run $1000 and be in the shop a week. Looking to have it done for Indy if possible. They penciled me in for mid Sept.

[Rocknthehawk]

Just got an estimate to have the hood painted and touch ups on some minor road rash issues. Going to run $1000 and be in the shop a week. Looking to have it done for Indy if possible. They penciled me in for mid Sept.


a hood is very minor compared to doing the roof on a Marauder....

to do it correctly, it involves removing the glass.


the cars with the lifting issues....the paint is rediculously thick. I know, I've stripped/painted one. I'll never do it again.

[Egon Spengler]

That is what I was thinking for mine!

I need a repaint also. I don't know whether to paint it or sell it. :(

[Stranger in the Black Sedan]

Heh yeah a really truly well done repaint is going to cost money, there are no ifs ands or buts about it. The cost of materials and the cost for someones time to do it RIGHT is gonna be high because there is a ton of time involved in properly prepping a car for paint. A good all over, stripped to metal repaint with high end finish products is going to be somewhere between 30%-50% the fair market value of these cars now!! But a really well done repaint, sanded and buffed will be far better quality than the factory paint on these cars, and the clear will be a lot thicker too to afford the ability to do paint correction far into the future. At least if you have your personal car repainted and done right, you will know what products are on your car. If you sell your car and try to buy one that appears to be in better condition you don't know as much about the finish and how good it will look in a couple years.

[gmtech]

I need a repaint also. I don't know whether to paint it or sell it. :(

Sell it, a good paint job exceeds the bluebook for most MM's:alone:

[Ms. Denmark]

Sell it, a good paint job exceeds the bluebook for most MM's:alone:The paint guy at my Ford Dealer quoted bet. $3500-5000 for a complete job.

[Stranger in the Black Sedan]

A dealer is the last place I would have a car painted. I have had several dealer repaints done and none of them were done to a high level of quality. They were all good enough tha tmost people would think the car looked nice and not bring it back (not me). Especially if its a volume shop, their priority is getting cars turned around fast, at a level of quality that the average non paint/detailing oriented enthusiast won't object to. Just a general rule, I'm sure there are occasional dealer shops that do really good work.

[juno]

Sell it, a good paint job exceeds the bluebook for most MM's:alone:

My mods exceed the blue book for all MM's. :D

[bobsawyer7]

I did get a ballpark estimate from a pretty good shop for a complete re-paint of $4-6K
so yours is close to being on the mark.
By the way, I've seen really good work from dealers and even from a Maaco shop. It all depends on the shop.


The paint guy at my Ford Dealer quoted bet. $3500-5000 for a complete job.

[wchain]

The guy I use for body work will do a complete repaint for $2,000 without any major bodywork. Basecoat/Clearcoat PPG Deltron.

Dave, whats the paint look like? How many times have you waxed your car, other than the one time that SID210SA has washed/waxed your car for you?

[cassidy]

If the paint under the clearcoat is still good, gently hand buff the remaining clearcoat (maybe using a mildly abrasive polish from Meguiars listed for removing fine scratches) so that the finish is even and level.

Clear coat is JUST really durable car wax (plastic film)...it would be up to you to keep a heavy coat of wax on it to make up for missing clearcoat. Total cost $50 and six hours of your time.

That's my advice...

[cv2000pi]

The questions that you need to ask yourself are how picky are you about the appearance of your car and are you going to own it forever? If you’re going to just paint the tops, hood, roof and truck lid, have the shop remove the hood and truck lid to paint so the base and clear is sprayed over the edge of the hood and truck lid and there are no rough edges plus it saves a chance of overspray but then you need to worry about header color match and appearance. On the roof, pull front and rear glass and all body edge seals so color and clear can be sprayed with the doors open and you will not end up with a tape line or edge that is able to be seen. How is the clear coat on the top of the doors if questionable, now you are chasing it and might consider a full repaint $$$???? If that is the case then pull front and rear bumper covers, front and rear lights, all door handles, gas door, mirrors, window rubbers, trim etc and just loosen the header from the front fenders leaving a gap when sprayed or R&R fenders and paint off the car too. If it’s your pride and joy it’s all in the preparation and details before and after the paint and clear coat are applied.

[hamcheese]

Just get 30 Grit sandpaper and go over the entire car, whip your ands together, and call it a day...j/k. I have a friend who works for a privatly owned shop, and has worked on cars(entire paint jobs, flames, pin stripping, etc)for at least ten years, ill ask him see what he says and post back.

[Rocknthehawk]

Has anyone else in this thread actually TRIED stripping and painting the roof?


It's perfectly easy to sit here in my chair and give advice and cost of what "should" or "could be done". It's very different to look at it in person, and work on it.

the paint problem that some black MM's have on the roof is not an easy fix. the easiest method would be a chemical strip. The paint is EXTREMELY thick. Don't believe me? try it yourself. I used a high speed sander with a 36 grit disc just to cut through the paint/clear. Followed by a DA with 80/180 down to the primier and/or bare metal.

[cv2000pi]

Not a big fan of chemical paint removal unless you leave three to six inches of paint area to sand around all panels, There as good and bad on both, but normally sanding is less work intensive in the long run. Is the base coat appear cracked or the old term crow fêted like GM vehicles of the 80's, if not base should be ok, sand with 240grit? Apply sealer then paint and clear. Would really look at media or soda blasting but that presents other problems, if taking to bare metal PPG has the best etching product and it’s a black base color.

[Rocknthehawk]

Not a big fan of chemical paint removal unless you leave three to six inches of paint area to sand around all panels, There as good and bad on both, but normally sanding is less work intensive in the long run. Is the base coat appear cracked or the old term crow fêted like GM vehicles of the 80's, if not base should be ok, sand with 240grit? Apply sealer then paint and clear. Would really look at media or soda blasting but that presents other problems, if taking to bare metal PPG has the best etching product and it’s a black base color.


I'll strongly disagree on the sanding being less work. I personally repainted GoMifuni's roof. I intially thought, yeah, no big deal, I'll hit it with the DA, feather the rough spots, and paint it...WRONG. I gave him an estimate based on this...I don't think I broke even, but I stuck to my word that I would do it for the price quoted. My fault for not properly inspecting the roof.

It's not crows feet, it's the actual base seperating and peeling from the primer. My best guess would be that the paint was just much much to thick (I didn't use a mil gauge, but having been doing bodywork for years, it was pretty obvious it was way too thick). The paint may have flashed and looked great for a time, but as it tried to dry underneath, the VOC's had nowhere to go, except bubbling up/splitting through the clear. This lead to cracks in the actual paint, and moisture getting in, causing rust and other issues. My second guess would be there was moisture somewhere in the system or on the base when the clear was sprayed...but the paint was seperating from the primer.


As I said, I had to take GM's car to bare metal in most spots. The paint was simply to thick to even feather. I used a combination of a high speed sander and a DA, and put at least 10 hours into his roof. I'm certainly not happy with how it turned out, but maybe I'm too critical. As I said, chemical strip would be the fastest, but I agree on leaving the edges to sand. That's why I'm trying to explain to others giving advice that this is not a simple or easy task, like painting a hood/trunk.


I also used the PPG black etching primer.

[dave]

:bat:Well thanks everybody for your imput on this matter. To answer some of your replies........ NO!!!!! I will NEVER part from my car for any reason. And I will never allow a dealership to paint my car. I've seen how bad they are. And yes I have cleaned and waxed car many times since sid#### did it thank you. Its just that coming up with the $$$ to do the job the right way and having to deal with the way it looks. I truly do love my car,but no $$$no repainting. So much for a bandaid fix. Maybe if a really bad hail storm happens I can then get a new repaint. Please feel free to donate to..... Repaint Daves car.com. Oh well thought I try anyway. Again thanks my fellow MARAUDER friends for your help on this matter:thanks: -DAVE-