She wont start

[Reek09]

My 03 won't start unless I put my key in the on position, then go under the hood and jump the starter with a metal rod that I bent to touch the contacts on the starter to make it engage! Help!

[fastblackmerc]

Ignition switch is bad.

[Reek09]

Is this a do it yourself job? Or should I take it to the dealer? If I can fix it, how do I get to the awitch?

[fastblackmerc]

Is this a do it yourself job? Or should I take it to the dealer? If I can fix it, how do I get to the awitch?

I'd do it myself. I was a Ford / Lincoln / Mercury mechanic for 10 years. Buy the switch at the dealer.

[Reek09]

You wouldn't happen to have pics or detailed info to replace would you?

[fastblackmerc]

You wouldn't happen to have pics or detailed info to replace would you?

No, I did look it up in the repair manual.

Make sure you have the correct tools. The attaching bolts for the switch look like Torx head and may be security Torx head (Torx head with a stud in the middle.)


Buy a new switch
Key in the OFF position
Disconnect the battery (negative side onyl)
Remove the trim panel under the dash
Remove the metal plate covering the underside of the steering column
Disconnect the electrical connector from the switch (it's big and had alot of wires coming out of it). The switch should look just like the new one
Remove the 2 attaching bolts (they look like Torx head bolts)
Replace the switch with the new one
Torque the bolts to 9 inch pounds
Reconnect the electrical connector
Reconnect the battery and test
Replace all the trim.

[Reek09]

Sounds simple except for the torx head bolts. I had to use a torx wrench to open the LCM up. So i need the same tool for this? You said something about security torx screws with a stud in the middle, is that a different wrench, or i can use the same kind I opened up the LCM with. And how do i know im putting 9 inch pounds on the bolts? Is it some type of meter on the wrench?

[fastblackmerc]

Sounds simple except for the torx head bolts. I had to use a torx wrench to open the LCM up. So i need the same tool for this? You said something about security torx screws with a stud in the middle, is that a different wrench, or i can use the same kind I opened up the LCM with. And how do i know im putting 9 inch pounds on the bolts? Is it some type of meter on the wrench?
The security Torx head bolt looks like a regular Torx head except there is a stud in the middle of the bolt and a security Torx wrench has a hole in the middle of the wrench.

To get the proper torque you need a torque wrench. If you don't have a torque wrench just don't tighten down the bolts like a gorilla. I'd just snug them down and a 1/4 turn further. Maybe use some locktite on the bolts.

[Reek09]

I replaced my ignition switch today, she still won't start! I have to do the same thing, touch the two contacts on the starter while the key is in the on position. Could it be the solenoid on the starter? If so I heard replacing the starter is a PITA!

[Blackened300a]

I replaced my ignition switch today, she still won't start! I have to do the same thing, touch the two contacts on the starter while the key is in the on position. Could it be the solenoid on the starter? If so I heard replacing the starter is a PITA!

Thats possible or maybe the starter connections are loose. I had that happen as well. The starter isnt that bad to remove if you have stock exhaust manifolds.

[marauderoner]

Check all ur grounds, if u hook up the wires on the on position and it starts, they're has to be a open wire some where maybe, or it could all be in ur steering colum


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[Reek09]

I was told you had to take the right motor mount off to take the starter off. Sounds like a pain.

[ImpalaSlayer]

I was told you had to take the right motor mount off to take the starter off. Sounds like a pain.
uhhh what? definitely not, its ezpz

[Blackened300a]

I was told you had to take the right motor mount off to take the starter off. Sounds like a pain.

I never heard of that. I havent replaced my starter but I highly doubt the motor mount has to come out to remove it.

[Reek09]

When I called Ford and asked them, that's what they told me. You had to take the right motor mount off to get the starter off.

[Blackened300a]

When I called Ford and asked them, that's what they told me. You had to take the right motor mount off to get the starter off.

They have to justify the ridiculous money they will charge you if you bring it to them.

[SpartaPerformance]

No need to remove motor mount, starter is not that bad. It's 0.6 hours labor.

[sd8683]

I would first start off by cleaning the battery terminals, I had all my accessories on and everything seemed fine with the battery, but low and behold I cleaned the terminals really good and it fired up like a champ.

[FordNut]

Starter change is easy, but if it starts with the jumper wire it's probably ok. Since it starts with the jumper wire, I'd say the battery and battery connections are ok too.

I don't know a whole lot about the PATS function, but if it detects an un-programmed key it prevents the starter from engaging. Does anybody know, does it disable the ignition power also?

[bob6364]

Does this car have a remote starter??? Hit the reset buttton somewhere under your left knee and try again....or check the hood up kill button.
Try another key.....or get a lock guy to make a new key and reset the PATS for you....or or or....this could be awhile.

[MM_BKK]

It does not sound like PATS issue. If it was, you wouldn't be able to hot-wire to get it started as the engine won't be getting fuel and spark. I've already tested this out to see if our car could be hot-wire. We're safe!

I would check out the Neutral Safety switch. Try playing with your gear shifter while trying to start. If it effects it, that is probably the problem.

[Blackened300a]

It does not sound like PATS issue. If it was, you wouldn't be able to hot-wire to get it started as the engine won't be getting fuel and spark. I've already tested this out to see if our car could be hot-wire. We're safe!

I would check out the Neutral Safety switch. Try playing with your gear shifter while trying to start. If it effects it, that is probably the problem.

The PATS will allow the engine to crank but it wont fire. I tried this already with a key that I cut without the chip in it. It just cranked over, ran for a second and stalled, so I would say it cuts the fuel.

If it started when he jumps the solenoid, Im going to say the solenoid in the starter is the problem. The key switch completes the circuit between the 2 posts. If its a broken connection, it wont complete the circuit and wont crank. Replace your starter. Its not hard to do.

[MM_BKK]

The PATS will allow the engine to crank but it wont fire. I tried this already with a key that I cut without the chip in it. It just cranked over, ran for a second and stalled, so I would say it cuts the fuel.

If it started when he jumps the solenoid, Im going to say the solenoid in the starter is the problem. The key switch completes the circuit between the 2 posts. If its a broken connection, it wont complete the circuit and wont crank. Replace your starter. Its not hard to do.

That's funny, when I tried it with an invalid key, the starter would not even engage. I tried to outsmart it and and left the key on and hot-wire the starter and it would just crank with NO spark and fuel.

If the starter can crank the engine by bypassing the ignition key, I would say that the starter is fine. Again, check the Neutral Safety switch.

BTW, if the anti-theft light flashes rapidly when turning the key on, that would mean wrong key. If the light stays on for several seconds, then key is correct and can start if the gear shifter is in Park or Neutral.

[Reek09]

I know this sound crazy but I remember getting in to start it one day and it didn't crank..so I held the key forward and held it there for a few seconds then it cranked up. But been trying to see if it would crank again like that by holding it forward but it won't do it again.

[Reek09]

I'm looking to change my starter because I think the solenoid is preventing it from cranking. I got up under it before to take it off, but how the hell do you get to that bolt by the manifold? Can somebody tell me how to get it off?

[Reek09]

Well I changed that switch yesterday...that wasn't the prob. Now gotta try to get the starter off. But I don't know how to get to that bolt by the manifold.

[Blackened300a]

Well I changed that switch yesterday...that wasn't the prob. Now gotta try to get the starter off. But I don't know how to get to that bolt by the manifold.

Can you take a pic of it? Usually a universal in a extension works wonders for the hard to reach areas.

[FordNut]

Three bolts. Two nuts for the wires.

[justbob]

A six inch extension and good ole feeling around is your friend!

[ImpalaSlayer]

once its in the air, it will take 10 mins to swap them out. it will take you longer to jack it up

[juno]

that bolt by the manifold?

Yeah, its a touchy feely thing, a little hard the first time around.
At least you don't have a 3-1/2 inch exhaust pipe blocking it. :)

[Cheeseheadbob]

Hmm, how to get your starter off? Well first you start by dimming the lights.. Oh, this thread is in shop talk. Sorry. :D

[Glockafella]

I like to start with a little foreplay myself...

[Reek09]

Ok, so its either my starter or the neutral safety switch. I'm guessing the starter would be easier? Has anyone changed their neutral safety switch before? If so fill me in on where its @ and how to change it.

[FordNut]

Ok, so its either my starter or the neutral safety switch. I'm guessing the starter would be easier? Has anyone changed their neutral safety switch before? If so fill me in on where its @ and how to change it.

It's on the transmission, where the shift linkage connects.

Did you put the car in N and try to start it?

[Reek09]

Yeah I put it in neutral and tried to crank...still silence. I'm gonna change the starter then go from there.

[imorb1994]

How about you use a test light, and check and see if power is even getting to the starter, before you waste money on a starter you may not need. I am willing to bet its either a PATS system problem or neutral saftey switch.

[Blackened300a]

How about you use a test light, and check and see if power is even getting to the starter, before you waste money on a starter you may not need. I am willing to bet its either a PATS system problem or neutral saftey switch.

He is able to touch the contacts of the starter and it cranks and runs. If it was the PATS, it wouldn't run. The starter is your issue. Replace it and go from there.

[imorb1994]

He is able to touch the contacts of the starter and it cranks and runs. If it was the PATS, it wouldn't run. The starter is your issue. Replace it and go from there.
Ok power on the S(signal) terminal on the starter.

[imorb1994]

He is able to touch the contacts of the starter and it cranks and runs. If it was the PATS, it wouldn't run. The starter is your issue. Replace it and go from there.
Did some searching and found this:



Ford passive anti-theft Systems (PATS) come in two configurations. The first takes away the ability to crank the engine over, using a starter interrupt relay to control the starter relay. The second configuration allows the engine to crank, but takes the fuel injector pulse away. Some systems use a separate anti-theft module, while others are incorporated into the powertrain control module (PCM) or instrument cluster. All PATS systems use a chip in the large black plastic end of the key to trigger a start. The chip is under a small square plug in the key. If there is a hole there, the chip has fallen out.

A small electronic device, a transceiver, is mounted to the bottom of the steering column. It has a loop of wire that goes around the lock cylinder. When the key is put into the ignition cylinder, and turned to the run position, the transceiver sends out a small electronic signal to wake the key up. The key sends out a preset signal to the transceiver. If the transceiver recognizes the key, it will allow the car to start. If the key is not recognized, the car will not crank (if equipped that way) or it will crank but not start. In either case, the theft light will flash rapidly. All keys must be programmed into the PATS system. At the time of this article, the only scanners that can do this type of programming are the factory scanners.

Not all PATS systems operate the same way. By reading that I believe that our MM's just have a starter interupt. If it wasn't so cold out side i would go put a inactive key in and jump the starter, to see what type we have.

[Reek09]

Thanks guys for your time! I'm gonna replace my starter and come back and let you all know what happened.

[Reek09]

I gave up guys. I could not get the top bolt out of the starter. I had an extension and either way I tried I couldn't get enough leverage to break the bolt. Its no room to get a good turn on the wrench up under there. I guess I will have to take it to the shop, cause where those bolts are is impossible to get to.

[FordNut]

You need to buy some tools.

[Reek09]

I have tools and an extention with a swivel head but its no room to turn it...you go from underneath the car or from under the hood cause a six inch ext. Didn't work.

[fastblackmerc]

Maybe you need like a 2ft extension.

[FordNut]

I have no problems getting all 3 bolts out. Gotta have the right tools.

[justbob]

Swiveling head 12" 3/8 ratchet or straight. I don't use anything else in 3/8". Leverage is king, sounds like you came up short on your "handle" is all. LOl

[Joe Walsh]

Maybe you need like a 2ft extension.

Yep,
When I removed and re-installed my starter (with Kook's headers no less...:()
I used a lonnnng 3/8" extension.
I ended up with the ratchet wrench all the way up by the front of the engine, where I had enough room to get two hands on the ratchet.

Did the same thing with a 1/2" ratchet and extensions for the transmission to block bolts.

[FordNut]

I always use 1/4" drive 6-point sockets on the starter bolts, they seem to fit in the space better for me. Only use 6-point sockets to break them loose so the bolt heads don't get rounded off. Depending on which bolt it is I may have to use a short socket & long extension or deep socket and short extension to get it to line up straight. Then I break it loose with a 1/4" breaker bar. You could possibly use an adapter and 3/8" breaker bar. The extensions and socket length are setup so that the breaker bar is just in the front of the starter and behind the motor mount, with a straight shot to the bolt. Once the bolts are broken loose, switch to a ratchet.

[Kennyrauder]

I bought & installed my Kooks Headers 3 years ago... If anyone can tell me how to remove my starter without taking off the right header , let me know. Cuz it ain't coming out any other way.

[MM_BKK]

Did some searching and found this:


Not all PATS systems operate the same way. By reading that I believe that our MM's just have a starter interupt. If it wasn't so cold out side i would go put a inactive key in and jump the starter, to see what type we have.

I've already tested it by turning the ignition on with an unprogrammed key and then hot wiring the starter to crank the engine because this key would not engage the starter. Engine does not start but just turn and turn over.

[FordNut]

I bought & installed my Kooks Headers 3 years ago... If anyone can tell me how to remove my starter without taking off the right header , let me know. Cuz it ain't coming out any other way.

Disconnect the wires and take out the bolts. Twist, rotate, cuss, wiggle it, twist it around the other way, get it turned around backward and upside down, it drops right out between the tubes.

[Joe Walsh]

Disconnect the wires and take out the bolts. Twist, rotate, cuss, wiggle it, twist it around the other way, get it turned around backward and upside down, it drops right out between the tubes.

LMAO....Yep...been there done that!

Brian isn't joking, that is the absolute truth.

[FordNut]

LMAO....Yep...been there done that!

Brian isn't joking, that is the absolute truth.

Beats pulling the header though, doesn't it?

[Reek09]

LOL...well ill give it another try tomorrow. Ive done enough labor this week. I changed my ignition switch, fixed my LCM, and changed my rear brakes this week, oh and I also changed my plugs too. So i will get back at it next week with a longer extension and see how that works!

[cougit25]

What do the letters "LCM" abbreviate? Sorry, I'm a newbie.

[FordNut]

Lighting Control Module... Lots of TLA's in the new cars. Too bad you can't find them with the search function, it requires 4 characters.