Caddy CTS-V

[Silver_04]

Had a CTS-V at work. The slight body changes make it one good looking car. Didn't get a chance to ride in it but the interior is fantastic and that Z06 plant barely fits between the fenders and a 6 speed. Ooo-la-la. Hope Lincoln does something like this with the LS.

[SergntMac]

Eh? You okay Silver?

Check your blood sugar lately?

[junehhan]

The CTS-V has the Z06 engine in it? I thought they were just going to put an LS1 in it, but an LS6 is awesome. Too bad I would never consider one since I just can't get past the ugly exterior design of the CTS in general................

If Lincoln was to at least give the LS a 6 speed manual transmission, it would be a great vehicle to drive.

[RCSignals]

that Z06 plant barely fits between the fenders and a 6 speed.

I thought it was an LS1 too. From everything I've read, it sounds like it was pretty jury rigged to get it together, the thing was designed for the V6 and this V8 version was an afterthought.

Lincoln really should do a lot of things .......

[bigslim]

Lincoln had the chance a couple of years ago. They had an agreement to sell a supercharged 350hp LS from Saleen but backed out. They figured they would lose sales on the supercharged Jaguar S-Type if they sold a blown LS. Also, Ford wimps out on a lot of performance cars.

[BlackHole]

Originally posted by bigslim
Lincoln had the chance a couple of years ago. They had an agreement to sell a supercharged 350hp LS from Saleen but backed out. They figured they would lose sales on the supercharged Jaguar S-Type if they sold a blown LS. Also, Ford wimps out on a lot of performance cars.

How can you say that other than the Vette/CTSV and now the GTO GM has practically killed performance

Fbody RIP........Impala SS Bbody RIP............. Silverado SS 5000+ounds and only 345 HP. And now the SSR with 290 HP when the concept had 330 HP

Now Ford has the New GT with 540 HP........Lightning with 380 HP........03/04 Cobra.........03/04 Mach1............Merc Marauder.................new Ford 500........Futura in 2006 and this is just Ford with the MM thrown in. I agree on that Lincoln needs something and fast I think the Mark XI concept would be nice.

[BillyGman]

ofcourse you're entitled to your opinion, but here is mine:
I luv my Marauder, but even though it's one of the coolest looking cars on the road, I've had to put $3500 just to get it to turn a 13.5 sec ET in the quartermile. To me it's unfortunate that we live in the day and age when you have to drop a few grand into a new car that you've just spent 30K for to get it to turn 13's. And that's merely because Ford chose to put the rather small 4.6L V8 engine in a car that weighs well over 4,000 LBS.

I want soooooo much to own a 2005 Ford GT, but you won't even be able to touch one of them since Ford has chosen to make so few of them that there is going to be some serious price gouging being accomplished by all the Ford dealers who do get one of those cars. So unless you're a rock star, movie star, top sports pro, or an Arab oil tycoon, you're not likely to be one of the few who will be driving a Ford GT. So the Ford GT is just a dream, and can hardly even be considered a true production car.

I agree w/you that the Ford Lightning is pretty cool, and that is within reach of the average guy, but to me it's a slap in the face that a number of American car manufactures are producing pick up trucks w/engines that cannot even be had in regular production cars that are under 80K!!!! The same goes for Dodge. They've put a Viper motor in a pick up truck that costs 42K, while at the same time, you can't even own one of their cars w/that same 500 HP engine for less than 80K+!!!! What are you gonna do w/a 2 wheel drive pick up truck??? You can't plow snow w/it, nor can you even use it for a fast grocery getter in significant snow storm.

The new Caddy is very quick and atleast has some cubic inches under the hood like the Marauder should've had to begin with. If Ford can produce a 5.4L engine that will put out 500HP, then why can't they put that in a car that people who earn less than 100K can afford? Why do we have to pay 6 figures for a car that churns out 500HP, if you can buy a pick up truck for 42K that puts out that much HP? I think that's rediculous, and shows how out of touch car manufactures are w/their performance minded customers.:rolleyes:

[Silver_04]

Definately an LS6-405 horse. This car should move pretty good. The one we have is black-which I think is the only color a CTS looks good in. Very big brakes. I parked the Marauder next to it just to remind the Caddy it wasn't the only 300+ horse four door in the lot.:D

[BillyGman]

you're correct about the engine and HP output of that new Caddy(but ofcourse you already knew that) but I just want to add that IMO your Marauder as well as all Marauders look a whole lot better than that new caddy does, or any other Caddy for that matter. So for the extra money that you would spend on the caddy, you can take and easily make a 450-500HP Marauder that would out handle that Caddy around the turns, and blow it away on the straight aways and in the Quartermile, and still have some cash left over. And ofcourse you would still have your marauder that will turn more heads than that Caddy will.;)

[MMdriver03]

How much does this caddy cost and does it have a full frame ?

[merc406]

If I remember right it was 65,000-75,000. Don't know about the structure.

[bigslim]

The Cadillac CTS-V will cost $50,000. That is before dealer mark-up. You better believe that the dealers will mark this car up because it will be a low volume car. And to Billy, the CTS has really grown on me look-wise. The CTS-V looks real aggressive with a deeper airdam, dual exhaust, and 18 inch wheels. I really like this car and have to give Cadillac some props for doing a car like this.

[merc406]

I'm on the wrong page, Caddy's with their CTS, CTV"S, CVS, whatever, wish they would name their cars like normal and not follow the crowd, I was thinking of the C something 2 pass. folddown conv.

[GordonB]

MMdriver03 and others,
"How much does this caddy cost and does it have a full frame ?"
1. As mentioned above, it will sticker around $50 LARGE. For my money, I would MUCH prefer a REAL Corvette to a CTS-V.
2. NO, there is NO FRAME with the CTS-V; it is unibody with a gawd awful amount of reinforcement under the car, in the trunk and in the engine compartment just to withstand the stress of that big, powerful LS6 engine (for the Z06 Corvette, 405 HP).
3. To all considering the CTS-V, save your money and mod the MM and come out with money leftover! OR buy a real sportscar -- buy a Vette!
4. IMHO, what makes the MM so great is the redesigned (for 2003) full perimeter frame UNDER the car (ALL Panther cars starting in 2003). Performance cars are built from the chassis UP. The frame gives us that SOLID fell with very little body flex and it will take whatever engine you can stuff under the hood, incl 5.4L with a revised hood.

GordonB

[MAD-3R]

I agree w/you that the Ford Lightning is pretty cool, and that is within reach of the average guy, but to me it's a slap in the face that a number of American car manufactures are producing pick up trucks w/engines that cannot even be had in regular production cars that are under 80K!!!! The same goes for Dodge. They've put a Viper motor in a pick up truck that costs 42K, while at the same time, you can't even own one of their cars w/that same 500 HP engine for less than 80K+!!!! What are you gonna do w/a 2 wheel drive pick up truck??? You can't plow snow w/it, nor can you even use it for a fast grocery getter in significant snow storm.

The reson you see Hot Rod trucks is that trucks follow lighter emmisions and gas millage laws then cars do. You don't pay guzzler tax on trucks.

[BillyGman]

I didn't know that MAD-3R.........so in light of that I guess that's just another scenario that indicates how emissions standards and the Government are killing HP #'s in cars, and causing the prices of high HP cars to go through the roof(Like perhaps the 2005 Ford GT or the Viper). That's a very interesting point Dude.;)

Bigslim, thanks for your opinion on the Caddy. Obviously you and Silver_04 really like the way this Caddy looks, and so I say, go for it then when it is made available. But just do me one favor......... Give me your Marauder when you get the Caddy, cuz I much rather have a second MM, then buy one of those Caddys, cuz I think the thing is just plain UGLY. But ofcourse that's simply my opinion and nothing else. I respect your opinion as well.

IMO, the body style of that car is just too blocky looking, and that's why I like the way the Marauder looks a whole lot better. That new Caddy, reminds of how that Ford 427 Concept car looks.If that's the shape of cars to come, then I'll be hanging on to my Marauder for atleast a decade even if I have to rebuild the whole drive train and get it painted again. To each his own I guess.:)

[MMdriver03]

[\The Cadillac CTS-V will cost $50,000. That is before dealer mark-up.] YIKES!!!!!!!! :eek: I would have to agree with gordon.... I won't be trading in my bad a$$ black MM for somethig that looks like Will Robinson drove on lost in space!!:lol: :flamer:

[BillyGman]

....."Will Robinson......Danger....Danger .....alien approacheth":P

yeah, it definately looks like you should be driving it on the moon............kinda like that beast of a thing that they drove on the moon during one of the Apollo space missions......

[MMdriver03]

Guy at work has a silver one..Drives him nuts when i park nose to nose ....All he can do is shake his head and smirk as i know he wishes he had a MM instead....:cool:

[BillyGman]

but I guess that looks are in the eye of the beholder. ......some guys like Blondes, whereas I often lean towards dark eyes, and dark hair.........

[bryanknie]

Sounds like our MM's are a better deal. We can add 12K for upgrades to what we paid, so for 40K +/- we have a car that totaly smokes the Caddy at th 50K base price.

With 12K of upgrades I should be able to get my best friends Z06!

B

[TAF]

Originally posted by bryanknie
With 12K of upgrades I should be able to get my best friends Z06!

Yep...and still put 5 golf bags in the trunk:up:

[Silver_04]

Let’s put things in perspective here. Aside from having V8's, RWD and four doors, the MM and Caddy are apples and oranges and like I said the CTS is more akin to an LS. The CTS-V should run circles around the MM but that doesn’t mean the MM isn’t a lot of car for the money. The CTS-V is meant as a BMW M3, maybe M5, or the new V8 Audi S4 fighter. I doubt Mercury had German performance sedans in mind when developing the MM. I was just shocked to see how well the Caddy seemed to be executed and everyone at work that has driven it has been delighted. Will I ever buy one-maybe, but it would be in addition to the MM. Mostly I am very glad to see another V8, RWD, American sedan and if the Caddy sells well, which I hope it does, may Ford respond with good things for us Ford/Lincoln/Merc fans.

Regarding the sticker price, the Caddy offers many things the MM doesn’t; Navigation system (dual playback with in dash changer and if I remember right the DVD plays movies while the car is parked), dual material seats (suede or alcantara-very supportive and grippy), six speed transmission, HID’s, big Brembo brakes, over 1 more liter in displacement yielding approx. 100 more naturally aspirated hp & ft-lb’s producing a 0-60 time in the high 4’s and quarters in the low 13’s, paint that doesn’t look like crap, better fuel mileage of 18/27 and a 3 year factory warranty that $12K of mods to the Marauder would more than likely void. Does that make the CTS a $50k car? Heck, a loaded LS costs ~$49k (source: Lincoln web site). Compared to an LS I’d say yes, but I believe my MM has a ton more attitude and I can’t put a price on that. Yet remember the CTS-V will be responsible for getting people that typically wouldn’t be caught dead in a Cadillac dealership in the door. Mercury applied a similar principle which resulted in me getting rid of my cheaper/better performing Mustang for the Marauder.

[merc406]

Sounds like your sold on it, as long as it's more or less American made that's all that matters.

[bigslim]

What Cadillac has done with the CTS is give people an alternative to the foriegn cars such as BMW and Benz. I think the CTS is a nice car in that market. The MM is in another market. Would a buyer of a BMW M3 look at a MM. I don't think so but he/she may look at a CTS-V as a car they may buy. And no Billy, you can't have my MM. First of all I work for Ford and drive nothing but Fords. Second, I love my MM too much.

[merc406]

You hit the nail on the head Darryl.

[BillyGman]

Originally posted by bigslim
And no Billy, you can't have my MM. First of all I work for Ford and drive nothing but Fords. Second, I love my MM too much.

AWE, man o man, I was just beginning to count on having another Black beauty on four wheels:(

But okay, even though I personaly can't stand the way that caddy looks, I understand the point that some of you guys are making about the market, however consider this: you guys are talking about American car makers competing w/the European car makers for customers by them following the lead of Euro trends in car styling, and I say that the American car makers should take the bull by the horns and start leading again like they did in the 60's by being the trend setters in car styling instead of following the lead of the Euro trash.

And it's because of that concept and Phylosophy that I've just stated that I just LUV the 2005 Ford GT. Ford has taken pure American styling of the 60's when American car makers were setting the trends in styling, and has come up w/a winner. IMO it's just a major dissapointment that this car will have such a rediculously abbreviated production, and therefore will have an astronomical price tag. But IMO there's NO European car that looks as good as the new 2005 Ford GT does, and I don't think that there will be ANYTHING that will outhandle it, and only a handfull of cars that will out accelerate it.

So Ford is taking the lead w/the production and styling of the 2005 GT, instead of trying to copy Euro car styling, and therefore is focusing on being the trend setter instead of being the follower. The Ford GT is ALL American, all muscle, and all Macho and that's what I LUV about it.

[bigslim]

I agree with you on the styling point. Detroit once again has to come to the head of the class and make styling a priority. I loved my LS when I had it but it looked like it was cut from the same cookie cutter that a lot of the europeon cars are made from. It drove good and had good power. There are some that go for handling and power dynamics and some that go for the look. We lucked out with the MM. It looks good, draws a lot of attention and has good power. Do I miss a car like the LS, sometimes, but I would not give up my MM for one.

[BillyGman]

you said it....the Marauder looks great, has excellent styling, instead of the wussy (can I say it?)Faggot type styling of many American cars these days, as well as many foreign cars. Okay, there I've said it. Sorry for the lack of subtleness in my statement, but I couldn't hold it back any longer.

I looked at a magazine today that had a lot of pics of 04 and 05 cars that are coming out, and it made me want to puke. The styling of most of these cars look like tinkerbell or Boy George should be behind the wheel.......There have been cars that have had poor styling in the past, sure. Take the Impala SS of the mid 90's. IMO, their styling isn't anywhere as good looking as the Marauder, but atleast they don't have that gay boy styling to them like many 04 and 05 cars will have. Especially those 05 Jap cars that will be coming out. Check out the pics before you argue, please.

And the one suggestion by another member here that the Caddy will run circles around the Marauder, well for 50K it should, and I've only put $3,500 into my Marauder, and I ran five 13.5 ET's at the track Saturday w/the factory tires on, and I'm a novice racer who hasn't even perfected a good technique yet for coming off the starting line w/a good reaction time too. So after spending merely a few thousand bucks for Mods, my car will already come VERY close to that Caddy, and look a whole lot better while doing it too.;)

[RCSignals]

MAD-3R is correct about trucks, and it's the reason Chrysler has pushed (and succeeded) to get many of it's new offerings classed as a truck. The PT Cruiser, the upcoming Magnum, etc

[deerejoe]

The 2004 Dodge SRT-10 (with 500hp Viper motor) at approx. $45K. MSRP is hardly a heart pounder.

1/4 mile ETs. are nothing to brag about.
Ugly, cheap interior.
Long throw, difficult, manual six speed trans.
2 whl. drive.
20 inch (high dollar tires) wheels.
Front weighted load distribution.
And...gas mileage only an oil sheik could love!!

Put $45K TOTAL dollars in your Marauder and run with the best of the best!!
(Recall DRs friend posting the $49K. LOADED car for sale awhile back. That thing had all "the stuff" necessary to blow 'em ALL away!!).

I like a large interior car...I need a large interior car!!
The Marauder out of the box is no rocket ship...but its no sloth either.

You want style, spaciousness and performance at a reasonable price...the Marauder has it.
Spend a few bucks more and 'run' with the fleetest of the pack.
It's merely a matter of choice AND money!!

[merc406]

Since they went with the German's, their's not a good lookin Chysler built anymore, all their products look like a truck, they need Lutz back like........ yesterday.

[Silver_04]

Originally posted by BillyGman
And the one suggestion by another member here that the Caddy will run circles around the Marauder, well for 50K it should, and I've only put $3,500 into my Marauder, and I ran five 13.5 ET's at the track Saturday w/the factory tires on, and I'm a novice racer who hasn't even perfected a good technique yet for coming off the starting line w/a good reaction time too. So after spending merely a few thousand bucks for Mods, my car will already come VERY close to that Caddy, and look a whole lot better while doing it too.;)

I said should run circles, not will. :rolleyes: Your posted performance is only close wrt accelerating straight line performance. What about turning, stopping, fuel mileage, standard equipment and daily drivability (4.56 gears, yikes)? When you address ALL of those let me know how much you spend. Also, bring your car to the dealership I visit and your warranty would probably be voided too. So what if the MM can be just as fast as the Caddy in a straight line with a few grand in mods. Why didn’t we all buy CV’s instead of MM’s and slap S/C’s on them then? The bottom line is the Caddy is a rare bird regardless of price. It’s a US made factory hot rod RWD sedan with a V8-very cool.

And look at the big picture-if the Caddy sells well, perhaps GM will speed up the development of the RWD Impala platform-upon which a real SS is created. Ford then looks across town, sees GM pumping out hot rod sedans and decides to develop exciting new product and/or keep the MM around and give it some more teeth. I’d much rather have another Ford in the garage, but if Ford doesn’t react then I’ll keep the Caddy on my shopping list because I find it appealing.

Speaking of Chrysler, did anyone see they found some notes regarding the merger/takeover deal? Doesn't look too good for Daimler's argument that the deal wasn't a take over.

[bigslim]

Hey Silver, it looks like Kerkokian is going to get paid. He said all along that the deal was dirty. Athough he and Iaccoca were trying to put together a takeover too he did lose on the "merger" deal. I don't feel as sorry for him as much I do for the employees that work there now. One good thing about the outcome of that merger is that Chrysler now can work on quality and have the "rear-drive" engineering to back them. It may take some getting use to to look at the new 300C, it will have rear wheel drive and a 345hp V8 engine. Not bad.

[BillyGman]

I know what you mean about the big picture. Yes, that's a good point that you've made. But as for the mods, my dealer knows about the mods I've done to my car, and the service manager himself told me that he doesn't have any problem w/that, and that he wouldn't void my waurantee:) I know that all dealers aren't like that though.

As far as handling, I find it hard to believe that the Caddy will out handle the Marauder. I think the MM handles extremely well for a big car. Don't you agree? And I haven't changed anything in the suspension at all in my MM.

As for the gas mileage, sure w/4.56's I only get 13 MPG in the city, and 15 MPG on the highway. That doesn't concern me. But keep in mind that Marty's car is so close to being as fast as mine, that you wouldn't even be able to tell the difference even if you were to drive both my car and his, and yet Marty has 4.10 gears in his car. And when I had 4.10's I was only getting 2 MPG's less than I was w/the factory gears. Furthermore, nothing I've done to my car has effected the driveability at all. I drive my car every day back and forth to work as wel as to many other places, including in the snow, and I've had no problems at all. The only difference in the way my car drives is when I hammer down on the gas pedal.......it moves better than it did before.

I guess for me, the whole issue w/the Caddy is it's price tag, but even more, it's looks, cuz I think it's just ugly. But like I've stated in one of my previous posts, that's simply a matter of my opinion, and that isn't neccessarily any better than your opinion. It's just different. That's all.:D

[Silver_04]

BillyG, heck yes I agree the MM is an excellent handling car. But unfortunately the Caddy will more than likely out handle the MM. The Cadillac can pull 0.91 lateral g's, the MM 0.85 (which is incredible considering the weight). Braking from 60 is 121ft and 137ft respectively. Those aren't big differences but they're enough.


bigslim, yeah that whole merger never sounder right. The relationship looks like some neat products are headed for the street but potentially at a pretty hefty cost, that is if Kirk gets the billion dollars he's asking for. I just hope that sum doesn't cause further payroll reductions-they've already let go of enough people.

[RCSignals]

The Cadillac can pull 0.91 lateral g's, the MM 0.85

Is that for the CTS V or the V6 CTS?

I had read previously that the MM numbers were more like .90 or a little higher. Very surprising.

[Silver_04]

The numbers I posted are for the V. The V6 CTS pulls 0.83g. I haven't seen Marauder numbers higher than 0.85. A Mustang GT only pulls about 0.85 or 0.86g.

[BillyGman]

thanks for the info Silver.:)