Recommendation for comfort and concealed

[Egon Spengler]

I recently got my LTC and inherited a couple hand guns and a couple of shotguns, but I am looking for a gun I can call my own that I can carry COMFORTABLY and CONCEALED. Looking for something I can conceal nicely at my hip and also at the left pectoral area. Any ideas what to get? Pics would be great so I can get an idea. make/size/caliber etc would also be great. As much info as possible! Looking for personal protection both on the streets and out in nature.

[thathotrodlincn]

Many people like a .380. 38 Super automatic (different caliber) is more powerful. As to make/model of firearm, you need to look and handle. It is a very personal choise. What one person likes, you may not. Good luck in the search.

[Krytin]

Also depends on your physical size - I carry a .45 ACP government model w/some "mods" in a Safarilaminate padle holster on my right hip and in an Uncle Mike's horizontal rig under my left shoulder/arm. I'm 6'2" and weigh none of your business!

[Egon Spengler]

Well I am 6'-0" and weigh 220lbs. I live in Massachusetts and need something that wouldn't be very noticeable under a leather jacket. I have a .38 Smith and Wesson revolver nad a .22 Hi-Standard Duramatic. The .38 has too long of a barrel and the .22 is, well, a .22 and I want a larger caliber for carrying.

[Krytin]

The gov't. model isn't that much bigger than the High Standard and I can loan you the jigs/fixtures/files/stones to get a REALLY smooth trigger pull!
I also have a lot of load data for some high velocity 200 gr. loads that I've worked up over the past 25 years.

[LANDY]

Glock 19, I'm not big by any means and you cant tell is on my hip. Very easy gun to handle if you ask me.

[Egon Spengler]

Glock 19, I'm not big by any means and you cant tell is on my hip. Very easy gun to handle if you ask me.
My dad has a Glock with a hip holster. Maybe if I go hiking or something in the near future, I will borrow it and strap it on to see how I like it.

[dakslim]

You can conceal carry...in Massachusetts??????:confused:

[CBT]

You can conceal carry...in Massachusetts??????:confused:

You can conceal carry anywhere. :D

[Egon Spengler]

You can conceal carry...in Massachusetts??????:confused:
If you have an LTC, yes! And I happen to have one!

[Marauderjack]

Kel-Tec P-11!!!:beer:

http://www.keltecpistols.com/category/390-Kel_Tec_9mm_Pistols.aspx

[Motorhead350]

Why??????????????

[Egon Spengler]

Kel-Tec P-11!!!:beer:

http://www.keltecpistols.com/category/390-Kel_Tec_9mm_Pistols.aspx
ooooo I like! I googled good concealed pieces and saw a .38 snub nose by Ruger that looked nice too. A friend of mine carries and he said he would like to bring over some pieces he has for me to try out.

[CBT]

ooooo I like! I googled good concealed pieces and saw a .38 snub nose by Ruger that looked nice too. A friend of mine carries and he said he would like to bring over some pieces he has for me to try out.

Some, if not most, gunshops have a firing range and test models you can shoot and test fit holster rigs for them. Heck, even our local pawn shop has a gun range in case you see a gun you like and want to test it out before you buy it.

[Marauderjack]

ooooo I like! I googled good concealed pieces and saw a .38 snub nose by Ruger that looked nice too. A friend of mine carries and he said he would like to bring over some pieces he has for me to try out.


Certain folks down my way just get MAD when you shoot them with a .380....then ya gotta outrun 'em!!!!:eek::rolleyes:

[CBT]

Egon at the gun range, covering his ears.....

23316

[Egon Spengler]

Certain folks down my way just get MAD when you shoot them with a .380....then ya gotta outrun 'em!!!!:eek::rolleyes:
suggestions sir?

[TAKEDOWN]

I say a nice .40 or .45 with an extended clip on the hip, and a sure shot .38 revolver on you chest... You pick the brand name.

[Joe Walsh]

Why bother with CCW?......just move to a state that allows FBF!

*FBF = Flaunt & Brandish Firearms

[Haggis]

Why bother with CCW?......just move to a state that allows FBF!

*FBF = Flaunt & Brandish Firearms

Vermont!!!! :eek:

[Matt In Detroit]

I carry a 3" Kimber .45 and although the gun itself is a good size, once it is loaded with a full mag i find it a bit heavier than id like. Ive been looking at some other guns to carry and i am liking the Sig P238, its a .380, very compact. Probably my next gun.

[Kodimar]

The Walther PPS is a great C&C pistol. You can get it in 9mm or 40. S&W.
It's been super reliable and it is easy to clean, no tools required. I can field strip it in about 30 seconds.


http://www.waltherpistols.com/category/594-Walther_PPS_Handguns.aspx

[Kodimar]

Why??????????????

Because a pistol is easier to carry than a police officer...

[Egon Spengler]

Because a pistol is easier to carry than a police officer...
+1 and thanks for the recommendation.

[SID210SA]

I have a Ruger KP95DC....its a 9mm and maybe a bit big for a CC...or it may do the trick....I use it for work.....and I carry +P ammo so it has stopping power. I bought it back in 1996 and have never had a problem with it....very reliable and have a 16 round preban mag for it.

[Kodimar]

No problem, happy to help.

[LordVader]

S&W makes a good .40 cal that isn't too big and the prices are pretty good right now.

[RR|Suki]

Why??????????????

lol at the Republic of Chicago


I carry a Glock 39, same size as a 26 (sub compact) but in .45. Love it alot

[Egon Spengler]

I carry a Glock 39, same size as a 26 (sub compact) but in .45. Love it alot
oooo that's a nice looking gun! Thank God for Google images!

[prchrman]

Bersa....thoughts....

[Egon Spengler]

Bersa....thoughts....
Are you a preacher? Apparently the previous owner of my marauder was a fire department chaplain.

Along the Bersa lines, a guy at work has a Beretta... any thoughts on Berettas as well?

[SC Cheesehead]

Heck with concealed, go with the intimidation factor.

http://www.google.com/url?source=imgres&ct=img&q=http://techpaladin.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/model50.jpg&sa=X&ei=1v_3TMP0BoK0sAPYlbDWAQ&ved=0CAQQ8wc4FA&usg=AFQjCNF5-Pyj-7E-mtygbHvifEJ6f-eWgg

[prchrman]

Are you a preacher? Apparently the previous owner of my marauder was a fire department chaplain.

Along the Bersa lines, a guy at work has a Beretta... any thoughts on Berettas as well?



Yes me is.

[TAKEDOWN]

Springfield, Sig, Beretta, Glock, for auto., and Smith & Wesson for a revolver... Just my opinion.

[Egon Spengler]

Yes me is.
Cool dude! :beer:

[prchrman]

In related news................


New Jersey Gun Case Exposes 'Patchwork' of State Laws, Experts Say
By Joshua Rhett Miller

Published December 02, 2010
| FoxNews.com
Print Email Share Comments (382) Text Size


Brian Aitken, 27, seen here in an undated photograph, was sentenced to seven years in prison for guns his attorney and father claim were owned legally. Some experts told FoxNews.com the entrepreneur was a victim of the country's "patchwork" of gun laws.
The case of a New Jersey man who is serving seven years in prison for possessing two locked and unloaded handguns he purchased legally in Colorado is a perfect example of how a law-abiding citizen can unwittingly become a criminal due to vastly differing gun laws among the states, gun rights experts say.

Brian Aitken, a 27-year-old entrepreneur and media consultant with no prior criminal record, now spends his days "bored and depressed" behind bars at New Jersey's Mid-State Correctional Facility, his father, Larry Aitken, of Mount Laurel, N.J., says.

Brian was trying to get his life back on track two years ago when he moved back to New Jersey from Colorado to be closer to his young son and estranged wife. But on Jan. 2, 2009, his mood darkened when his planned visit with his son was canceled at the last minute. His mother, concerned for his safety, called the police, and when the police located him, they searched his car and found two locked and unloaded handguns in the trunk.

Aitken had purchased the guns legally in Colorado, and he passed an FBI background check when he bought them, his father said. And he said Brian also contacted New Jersey State Police before moving back back home to discuss how to properly transport his weapons. But despite those good-faith efforts, he said, Brian was convicted on weapons charges and sent to prison in August.

"I don't think there are words yet invented that could characterize the -- I guess anger would be one word, but it's a lot deeper than anger," Larry Aitken told FoxNews.com on Wednesday. "Whatever the word is that's a combination of anger, shock, disbelief, horror and a desire to expose all of this -- that's the word.

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Brian's relatives and his lawyer, Evan Nappen, believe he had a legal exemption to have the handguns in his car because they say he was in the process of moving from his parents' home in Mount Laurel to Hoboken when the guns were found. A formal appeal and clemency petition have been filed with the office of Gov. Chris Christie, and a "Free Brian Aitken" Facebook group has garnered roughly 7,000 supporters. A brief on his appeal is due on Dec. 30, officials told FoxNews.com.

Nappen claims the moving exemption issue was raised both during the trial and in a pretrial motion to have the entire case dismissed, but he said the jury was never given the exemption statute because then-Superior Court Judge James Morley refused to provide it to them.

Morley, for his part, told FoxNews.com on Wednesday that his recollection of the trial record did "not establish" that [Aitken] was in the process of moving. He declined further comment.

In an email to FoxNews.com, Joel Bewley, a spokesman for the Burlington County Prosecutor's Office, said "no evidence" was presented during the trial to support Aitken's claim that he was moving at the time of his arrest. And despite an appearance on FoxNews.com's "Strategy Room" in August 2009 to discuss his case, Aitken did not testify at his trial.

"However, his roommate testified that they had been sharing the Hoboken apartment since June 2008, and that he had seen the guns at the apartment in September 2008," Bewley wrote. "[Aitken's] mother testified that he had been living in Hoboken and working in New York City since June 2008. This incident occurred in January 2009."

Regarding Aitken's interview on the case, Bewley wrote: "While we fully recognize the defendant has a right not to testify, it is difficult to understand why he would grant an interview on national television yet choose not to explain his actions to a jury when his liberty was at stake."

Nappen, meanwhile, says Aitken's case "absolutely" shows how states' differing gun laws can put well-intentioned gun owners at risk.

"There's a wide patchwork of gun laws between various jurisdictions, and in some states, it can differ from a local town that passes an ordinance to another town," said Nappen, who also cited New Jersey's mandatory minimum sentences for weapons charges. "That's why it's so Draconian in its application and how you end up with a Brian Aitken situation."

According to a 2009 rating system by the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence, New Jersey is one of six states with the most restrictive gun laws in the U.S.. The others are California, Massachusetts, Connecticut, Maryland and New York.

Alaska, Arizona, Idaho, Kentucky, Oklahoma and Utah have the least restrictive gun laws, according to the rating system.

In New Jersey, a person must have a purchaser's permit and a carry permit to have a handgun in his or her car, neither of which Aitken had at the time of his arrest. But in Colorado, where he purchased the handguns, all he needed was a permit to carry concealed weapons; neither a purchaser's permit nor a license was required. Other states, including Florida and Texas, do not require purchaser's permits but mandate that gun owners obtain licenses to carry handguns openly.

According to the National Rifle Association's Institute for Legislative Action, out-of-state permits in New Jersey are technically available for non-residents, but they are rarely granted. A total of 15 states, including Arizona, Idaho and Kansas, recognize New Jersey permits, while New Jersey itself does not recognize licenses from other states.

Aitken is not the most recent gun-carrier to learn the hard way that gun permits are typically not transferrable to other states.

James High, 71, of Duluth, Ga., was charged with unlawful possession of a weapon on Oct. 29 when an officer found a gun on the front seat of his car in Madison, N.J., according to the Madison Eagle. High had been locked out of his car and sought assistance from a police officer, who found the handgun, which was properly licensed in Georgia. High was released after posting bail, pending a mandatory court appearance, the newspaper reported.

And just last week in Boyton Beach, Fla., a 49-year-old man was charged with two counts of carrying a concealed firearm and three counts of carrying a prohibited weapon after he was spotted carrying a holstered .40-caliber Glock handgun with a 30-round magazine at a Walmart store. The gun's owner, Christopher Scott, said he had a valid permit in Arizona and thought it was reciprocal in Florida, the Palm Beach Post reported.

Rachel Parsons, a spokeswoman for the National Rifle Association, said those cases collectively highlight the need for gun owners to pay close attention to the varying laws across the country.

"When you have a patchwork of gun laws within the country, and when you're crossing state lines, it gets very confusing and it makes it nearly impossible to comply," Parsons told FoxNews.com. "We do hear about these cases and that's why the NRA has a civil rights defense fund for people who are charged but are not criminals."

"The burden of the law should be on true criminals," Parsons said, "and not on individuals who are trying to follow the law, especially in times when our justice system is overtaxed

[PurdueRifleman]

... any thoughts on Berettas as well?


I carry a Beretta Px4 Type F in 9mm almost every day. The gun is a bit large (4" barrel), but is ergonomic, hides easily, and with practice you'll be able to out shoot the glock boys all day long. The rotating barrel makes them amazingly controllable. I've put around 2,000 rounds through mine and have experienced about 98% reliability in terms of feeding. The jams I've had were all with aluminum cased "Blaser" ammo. Capacity is 17+1 and you can expect to pay around $550 for a brand new one.

Don Hume Leather Goods makes top-notch holsters for just about whatever you wind up getting. You won't regret the extra time they take in getting your holster made and shipped out. I carry my Beretta in their 26-PX model as a lefty OWB holster. I also occasionally carry a 2.25" Ruger SP101 in .357 mag behind my back in their DAH model. Again, excellent quality holsters.

[Egon Spengler]

I carry a Beretta Px4 Type F in 9mm
Now that's what I'm talkin' about! Good lookin' gat!

[BADMERC]

Walther .380ACP
Colt Comander .45ACP
Springfield XD Sub-Compact .40 S&W




http://thumbp2.mail.re4.yahoo.com/tn?sid=30399297502882140&mid=AJEMDUwAAHXQTPgQ1gDAxUe4mu k&midoffset=1_1307404&partid=2&f=599&fid=Inbox

[burt ragio]

I recently got my LTC and inherited a couple hand guns and a couple of shotguns, but I am looking for a gun I can call my own that I can carry COMFORTABLY and CONCEALED. Looking for something I can conceal nicely at my hip and also at the left pectoral area. Any ideas what to get? Pics would be great so I can get an idea. make/size/caliber etc would also be great. As much info as possible! Looking for personal protection both on the streets and out in nature.

"Ideas of what to get. Looking for personal protection both on the streets ect"
It sounds like you work a dandy neighborhood. Don't forget a few hand gernades.

[GAMike]

I carry A Sig Sauer 229 .40 Cal. W/Hydrashocks in like a quarter, out like a hamburger. Meth, speed or dust, it i'll drop a fool if it has to;)

I had a concealed carry in MA back in the day.. Took an act of God to get it, but worth the effort.

Better to have one and never need it, than need it, and not have one...........:flamer:

[4drcbra]

I like the Ruger .380. you can get them with a knife style clip that attaches to the frame and can be easily concealed in a pocket or inside the waistline of your pants anywhere all comfy like

[Darrin]

I carry a Glock 30 and love it.

Darrin

[thathotrodlincn]

Certain folks down my way just get MAD when you shoot them with a .380....then ya gotta outrun 'em!!!!:eek::rolleyes:

Not if you shoot 'em in both knees. Maybe an ankle also might help.

[kernie]

Why??????????????

Bravo!

The one voice of reason, Motorhead, lol.

Good for you.

:beer:

[MercNasty]

Get a baby desert eagle, i think they have a 9mm and a 40 cal

[White Knuckles]

Why??????????????

In 1981, Morton Grove, Illinois became the first town in the U.S. to pass a flat out ban on the possession of handguns within the town limits by anyone except police and active duty military during the performance of their official duties. In response, the town of Kennesaw, Georgia passed a gun law of their own in March of 1982. The Kennesaw law was almost the exact opposite to the Morton Grove ordinance. Rather than banning handgun possession, Kennesaw required every head-of-household to keep at least one firearm and appropriate ammunition in their home – with exemptions for those who had religious or philosophical objections to maintaining or using weapons. In other words, gun ownership was mandatory except for people who didn’t want to own a gun.

I am proud to live in Kennesaw:uzi:

[Leadfoot281]

Bravo!

The one voice of reason, Motorhead, lol.

Good for you.

:beer:

Reason?! :eek: OK Kernie, you be the one to tell a 120lb woman she has no right to defened her self from a 220lb man that's trying to rape or kill her. What is fair about telling her she can't defend herself? Here's what Ted Nugent thinks about that. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCHtw6WbbnM&feature=related

Remember, God created mankind. Sam Colt made 'em all equal.

Reason? Whatever... here, listen to the voice of experiance. http://www.wimp.com/truemeaning/

[Blackmobile]

Kel-Tec P-11!!!:beer:

http://www.keltecpistols.com/category/390-Kel_Tec_9mm_Pistols.aspx

+1 on the Keltec P11 9MM ACP. It's a nice size piece (Not too large) for an average size person, and can be had for under 3 bills on gunbroker at any give time. Comes in blued, Crome, and rare SS slide. Or you can duracoat it any color you want, including camo.

http://www.goldenloki.com/gallery.htm

[CBT]

+1 on the Keltec P11 9MM ACP. It's a nice size piece (Not too large) for an average size person, and can be had for under 3 bills on gunbroker at any give time. Comes in blued, Crome, and rare SS slide. Or you can duracoat it any color you want, including camo.

http://www.goldenloki.com/gallery.htm

Love that Colt Officer Series....

[zr271cuda]

Check out http://www.defensivecarry.com/ there is a wealth of info on that forum and some good people too.

Oh and I carry Glock. I've spend a lot of money and time putting rounds down range with a Glock and I cant get comfortable with any other brand. Oh and I might have a HK p2000 .40cal for sale soon if interested.:uzi:

[Windsor58]

Love that Colt Officer Series....

+1 Love my Colt 1911 Officers Model (3.5" barrel). I'd have to look it up, but I've had it over 20 years, if memory serves. Got a full size 1911, but that is just too big for regular carry. The Officers Model is just the right size, in my opinion. It's a little heavy for carry until you get used to it and then you miss it when it ain't there. Even with the short barrel, it groups pretty good at typical distances. And reliable as can be.

When I grew up, a 45 was the only way to go, so I am a bit biased. Anything less just doesn't seem as serious to me. I do have a Smith 9mm but don't carry it. The last few years, loads of 9mm ammo have gotten a lot better than when I got hooked on 45s, and I know a lot of folks that swear by 9mm with the right load. I wouldn't recommend going smaller than 9mm, though. If, God forbid, you ever have to protect yourself or your family, you want enough stopping power to stop the threat quickly.

As was said before, quite a lot depends on what you like. If you get something you don't like or are not comforable with, you'll end up not carrying it. That won't do you any good, then. Spend time at ranges, making friends, talking about what they like, and just see what feels right to you.

Once you make your decision, spend a lot of time getting comfortable handling the weapon (at home and at the range), so it becomes second nature. You don't want to be fumbling around trying to figure out how to use it when you really need it. Get competent with it.

And congratulations for standing up for your civil rights!

[Vortex]

Having a CHL is one thing, having the right handgun is another. There are countless decent handguns available right now but remember, if its too big to conceal or if its uncomfortable when you are carrying it you will probably quit carrying. Then, one day, you wont have it when you need it. Ive got all sorts of handguns myself but for CHL purposes I recommend the North American Guardian .32 Half the price of a Seecamp, its small enough to fit in your front pants pocket in a front pocket holster and isnt any larger than a cellphone. I can put them in a 6 inch group at about 5 yards and that is about the limit for this weapon. It carries 6 in the mag and one in the chamber. Unless you tell them, nobody will see it when you carry.

http://www.naaminis.com/guard.html

[Mike M]

Kel-Tec P-9, it is the thinnest 9 mm made. I have a PF9 and a PF11 and the PF-9 is fantastic.
American made and great reviews.

[Mustang man]

Size of a keltec 380 but the power of a 40 cal. Kahr Pm40. Expensive also but much better quality than some of the pocket pistols.

[Egon Spengler]

Size of a keltec 380 but the power of a 40 cal. Kahr Pm40. Expensive also but much better quality than some of the pocket pistols.
WOW! That is a tiny gun! I like it! So many options! haha

[Kodimar]

Here's some gun porn of my PPS.

http://www.ramidok.com/091228/

Look at the images prefixed with tn_ they are much smaller and you won't rape my web server :)

[rayjay]

There are thousands of options out there. The suggestion to go to a rental range is outstanding if there is such a thing in your area. It all comes down to personal preference and ability. There are 5 foot 0, 95# women out there that can easily handle 45acp pistols. Concealing them on their person on a hot summer day is another story. Carry the largest caliber you can comfortably hide and are proficient with. No sense in carrying a gun you can't hit the broad side of a barn with. Funny no one here has mentioned the Glock Model 36. Single stack 45acp. 3.75" barrel, light and very concealable. One of my main squeezes year round. For those really hot days I have a S&W Model 432PD revolver, 32H&R Mag, 6 rounds, better ballaitics than .380, concealed hammer, very light 14-15 oz range. I defy you to tell me at a glance that I'm "carrying". I have a varied bevy of beauties, but these two I would recommend for CCW to a newbie. In the winter I prefer a full size 45acp if the situation will allow, but when you think about it, most of the time thats not the case. Take a good look at at the 36 and get 3 good holsters. Belt, paddle and inside the belt, maybe a deep cover. Then your all set. Oh, and high capacity, forgetabout, the average shoot out is three rounds fired at 1-7 meters. Practice, practice practice and then practice some more until its second nature. Know your states laws on use of deadly physical force. It will keep YOU out of jail. As an aside, Kahr makes an excellent pistol, I own several. My main summer squeeze for a number of years was a P9Covert until I aquired the 432PD. Their 40 in polymer is a bear on recoil though making the 1st shot knock down a must. You may not get a 2nd accurate shot off. Small guns in a large caliber = heavy recoil most of time. However, I find the Glock 36 very manageable for its size, probably because I am used to 40s in Glock as a duty weapon. 40 cal is snappy regardless of the pistol size.

[Krytin]

That's some good advice from rayjay^^^^^>

+1 on the high capacity stuff - adds weight and bulk.
Make the first shots on targets count through training and practice!

[Darrin]

The advice on making sure a gun is 'comfortable' for you to use and that you practice using it is golden. It matters a whole lot less what you choose as compared to making sure that you are totally comfortable with it and capable of using it if the need arises.

I don't have huge hands, but they aren't small either. That makes it tough for me to use the same thing that my wife might choose. One size does not fit all.

Case in point, I have a tiny little .22 Taurus that won't hardly fit in my hand. More than once the slide has bitten me while I was practicing with it. I originally bought it because it's awesome to carry since it's small, light and super easy to conceal in light clothes. All that doesn't matter because I won't carry the darn thing because after using it for a while I hate the little bugger.

If you either can't or won't use it and don't carry it then it's totally pointless.

[babbage]

This is my personal fav. .357 Magnum - 8 shooter - performance center quality.

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=23 321&d=1291404063

[PurdueRifleman]

Having a CHL is one thing, having the right handgun is another. There are countless decent handguns available right now but remember, if its too big to conceal or if its uncomfortable when you are carrying it you will probably quit carrying. Then, one day, you wont have it when you need it. Ive got all sorts of handguns myself but for CHL purposes I recommend the North American Guardian .32 Half the price of a Seecamp, its small enough to fit in your front pants pocket in a front pocket holster and isnt any larger than a cellphone. I can put them in a 6 inch group at about 5 yards and that is about the limit for this weapon. It carries 6 in the mag and one in the chamber. Unless you tell them, nobody will see it when you carry.

http://www.naaminis.com/guard.html

As Vortex said, comfort matters with whatever you decide to buy. However, also keep in mind that larger guns are also more comfortable (read: usually less snappy in a given chambering) than smaller handguns when it comes to shooting. Greater shooting comfort when you practice will help build confidence and that's half the battle when it comes to marksmanship. You'll always shoot better with a comfortable gun IMHO.

So my second bit of advice to you is to get the largest gun you can conceal comfortably in the largest round you can control. 9mm and .45 ACP would be great places to start your search. Lots of folks have recommended a 1911. They aren't small by any means but are comfortable to shoot, easy to conceal, ammo is available everywhere, and in the unlikely event that it breaks down almost anyone can work on them. They are the AR-15 of the pistol world. A man's barbie doll if you will! :beatnik:

[Taemian]

I recently got my LTC and inherited a couple hand guns and a couple of shotguns, but I am looking for a gun I can call my own that I can carry COMFORTABLY and CONCEALED. Looking for something I can conceal nicely at my hip and also at the left pectoral area. Any ideas what to get? Pics would be great so I can get an idea. make/size/caliber etc would also be great. As much info as possible! Looking for personal protection both on the streets and out in nature.

Carrying a concealed weapon is not supposed to be COMFORTABLE, it's supposed to be COMFORTING. If you're going to carry a gun, carry a big one.

If your personal security standards are lacking because you desire comfort over safety, just practice running away very quickly.
Seriously though, whatever you choose to carry, ask yourself this before you go out the door: "Is this the pistol that I most believe will save my life during an engagement?"
And yes, I have been to TR.:beer: Clint is the man!
Guns are like clothes. They are easily "tailored" to suit you better. People will ***** about money. Big deal. What's your life worth? Get a basic pistol that's manageable for you, and has room to be modified as funds and skill level improve.

EG: a S&W M+P 9mm compact. Inexpensive initial cost. Cheap ammo means lots of practice, tons of upgrades available, lots of gunsmithing options. +P ammo for daily carry= good knockdown power, good capacity with flush mag.

[SGT_MERC]

I carry a sub-comp XD40. Beretta just released a new sub-comp 40. Both have a 3" barrel and conceal rather nicely. I love my XD40.

[martyo]

I love my SIG 232.

It is chambered in .380 and is quite accurate for a shorter barrelled gun. Surprisingly the kick on this gun is not out of control for a small framed gin, making for excellent multiple, quick fire accuracy.

Loaded with the proper ammo, a .380 gun has plenty of stopping power.


http://munchkinwrangler.files.wordpre ss.com/2008/04/sigp232-6x4.jpg

^^ That is a stock photo -- mine is all blue and I added Hogue grips.

[En4cer71]

You're talking about 2 different guns. For the woods, depends on what you're worried about confronting. A nice magnum in a shoulder rig should do good.

For CC, it depends how you usually dress. Some of the mini Glocks are great. I live in miami where shorts an t- shirt are daily year round wear. Kinda limits your choices. I carry either a titanium .38 S&W revolver which can have a laser on grip. It's light, good caliber but that combination does give it a bite when you shoot. My preference is the .380 Ruger LCP which is the same dimensions as the Kel Tec. In fact I carry it in a Kel Tec holster either in front pocket or rear depending if I have jeans or shorts.

[En4cer71]

http://i1214.photobucket.com/albums/cc489/En4cer71/f809f4d5.jpg

http://i1214.photobucket.com/albums/cc489/En4cer71/fbd6cc40.jpg

Items are for size reference.

[Vortex]

I love my SIG 232.

It is chambered in .380 and is quite accurate for a shorter barrelled gun. Surprisingly the kick on this gun is not out of control for a small framed gin, making for excellent multiple, quick fire accuracy.

Loaded with the proper ammo, a .380 gun has plenty of stopping power.


http://munchkinwrangler.files.wordpre ss.com/2008/04/sigp232-6x4.jpg

^^ That is a stock photo -- mine is all blue and I added Hogue grips.

My nightstand gun.

[rayjay]

My nightstand gun.

I found the recent research into using FMJ ammo in 380s as the best defensive carry option for that caliber to be interesting reading. It was in Gun Test Magazine, October 2010 issue. They used as Sig 232 clone for the tests. I chose my S&W 432PD (revolver) based on concealability for the summer months and reliability. The fact that it also had a 6 round cylinder as opposed to 5 was a plus. The ballistics are similiar or better than .380 for the 32H&R magnum. I was able to aquire 50 rnd boxes of JHP (Hornady) from Georgia Arms, at 1200FPS/225#. Of course thats probably through a test barrel, they all are. The draw back is after one box of 50 your hand will know its done some shooting. With the .380 you can still blast away. I have a Browning .380 BDA in matte silver chrome that I will never part with. It was made by Beretta and is one of my best made pistols. Accuate as all get out, no failures of any kind. However, for carry, based on size, weight, concealability, my Glock 36 beats it and I have 45ACP to throw out of the barrel. I can see where someone could get soooo confused on which way to go. :bigcry:

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/gallery/data/500/medium/24-3.jpg (javascript:;)

My night stand gun.

[TAKEDOWN]

http://i1214.photobucket.com/albums/cc489/En4cer71/f809f4d5.jpg

http://i1214.photobucket.com/albums/cc489/En4cer71/fbd6cc40.jpg

Items are for size reference.

Nice pocket holster!

[sailsmen]

I cannot remember the source;
"This question will be debated until there is no more ammunition.

All of us have been exposed to the varying theories regarding which type of handgun bullet is best for defensive purposes. Some proponents (Dr. Julian Hatcher) believe that "bigger is better" while the National Institute of Justice performed a "computer man" study a number of years ago which suggested that light and fast bullets achieved the most lethal results.

As more and more data becomes available, theories change. Evan Marshall wrote definitive studies in 1992, 1996 and 2000 after examining the results of thousands of actual shootings. His conclusions came as a result of actual shootings and not from firing bullets into wet newspaper, gelatin or some other artificial medium.

His data is based on "one shot stops". This is defined as: 1. a single hit to anywhere on the body not counting the head, neck or extremity shot: 2. when a subject stops shooting or striking blows if that was what he was doing and 3. runs no more than 10 feet before collapsing. In other words, Marshall ’s studies examine what happens in the first few seconds after a shooting.

In the past decade, major advances have been made in bullet design which adds to the lethality of the projectile. Every major US bullet manufacturer has their own proprietary projective which they claim is best for the job at hand. New calibers such as the 357 SIG have appeared on the scene while more data has been accumulated on relatively new bullets such as the 40 Smith & Wesson. Marshall ’s newest study takes these events into consideration.

32 ACP - Most of the smaller caliber firearms such as this caliber and the .380 ACP are carried as "back-up" guns by law enforcement thus the increase in data from actual police shootings. The CorBon 62 gr. JHP round was involved in 17 shootings with 11 one shot stops which achieved a 65% rating followed closely by the Winchester 60 grain Silvertip which was fired 162 times and caused 104 stops for a 64% rating. The Federal 65 grain Hydra-Shok and the CCI 60 grain Gold Dot achieved one shot stops 63% and 60% of the time.

380 ACP - The top rounds in this category were the Federal 90 grain Hydra-Shok and the CorBon 90 grain JHP+P which both rated a 70% one shot stop rating. While Federal 90 grain FMJ ammo was used in a whopping 245 shootings, it only achieved 55% one shot stops.

38 Special - With the introduction of semi-auto pistols, this caliber was relegated to secondary status. This data is from 2 and 3 inch revolvers which limit muzzle velocity & therefore results are less than other comparable calibers. Both the Winchester and Federal 158 grain LHP+P offerings were involved in 158 shootings with the Winchester round making 121 single shot stops for a 68% rating and the Federal loading making 120 one shot stops for a 67% rating. Most all of the 16 loadings examined fell in the 60 percent range with the Federal 125 grain Nyclad LHP+P round earning a 61% rating. It’s clear than the long-used 158 grain lead hollowpoint pushed to +P pressures is the best round for this caliber.

357 Magnum - Once the king of law enforcement handguns, this caliber has also been replaced by large capacity auto-pistols. The data collected for this caliber came from 2 and 3 inch revolvers, not the longer barreled type. The top round was the Remington 124 grain JHP followed by the same loading by Federal. Both loads achieved a 91% one hit stop rating. Most other loads ranked in the 80% area with the Federal 158 grain Hydra-Shok achieving a 78% rating.

357 SIG - This is the most current law enforcement cartridge and therefore, shooting data is limited. The top rated cartridges were the Remington and Federal 125 grain JHPs. Both were rated at 91% one shot stops. Of the 9 loads evaluated, the poorest was the Federal 158 grain Hydra-Shok which was involved in 41 shootings with 32 one shot stops for a 78% rating.

9mm - This was the first semiauto pistol to be used extensively by police agencies and replaced the 38 Special and 357 Magnum round. Early loadings of the 147 grain round caused major stopping problems however current 147 grain designs are vastly superior. Clearly the best 9mm loads are those driven to +P+ pressures. Of the 20 loadings evaluated, the top load was the Federal 115 grain JHP +P+ involved in 209 shootings with 190 one shot stops for a 91% rating. The Winchester 115 grain JHP +P+ and 127 grain Ranger SXT +P+ both had 90% one shot stops. All five loads driven to +P+ pressures ranked in the top 5 followed by all bullets loaded to +P pressures. Rounds manufactured to standard pressure ratings comprised the bottom 12 loadings in the study.

40 S&W - This caliber has become extremely popular with law enforcement agencies due to the perceived deficiencies of the 9mm round. All manufacturers have at least 2 loadings of this caliber and it has served very well. The Remington 165 grain Golden Saber was used in 311 shootings and made 292 one shot stops for a 94% rating followed closely by the CCI 165 and 155 grain loadings and the Federal 155 grain Hydra-Shok bullet. These 3 loads made 93% one shot stops. Other manufacturers loads in the 90% range were the Federal 155 grain JHP and the CorBon 135 and 150 grain JHP bullets. Thirteen other loadings were evaluated with the poorest being the Winchester 180 grain FMJ that was involved in 134 encounters and made 95 (71%) one shot stops.

45 ACP - This caliber has been around for almost 100 years and is still the top rated round. More police agencies are using this round due to its proven stopping ability. The large diameter, heavy bullet is the basis for the "momentum" theory of stopping power however actual results in shootings show a mix of "light and fast" and "slow and heavy" rounds. The Remington 185 grain Golden Saber was involved in 148 shootings and caused 142 one shot stops for a 96% rating followed closely by the Federal 230 grain Hydra-Shok which caused 200 one shot stops in 211 shootings for a 95% rating. Eight of the 16 loadings examined rated above 90% one shot stops while 5 others rated in the 80s. The poorest stoppers were the Remington, Federal and Winchester 230 grain FMJ rounds which achieved 62% one shot stops.

It’s difficult to say that one type of bullet is best for all calibers and, in fact, these study results show that the best results come from a mix of heavy to light bullets which defy most theories. It is clear however that some loadings are much better than others and the decision is ours with respect to which we choose. "

Most pistols will shoot FMJ with out any issues. Some pistols have to be reworked to reliably shoot ammo that is not FMJ.

[rayjay]

Nice pocket holster!

That pocket holster has one major flaw IMHO, can you name it?

[rayjay]

Sailsman, very good info. Did the study take into account what mixture or lack thereof of drugs/alcohol the threat had in their system at the time they were struck by the projectile? I'm not being nit picky here. Someone who is shot with a .22 RNL out of a snubbie may go down like a ton of bricks when sober and keep charging like a rhino when high on PCP and shot with the same loading. You are correct though on the .380 test. I would need to re read it, but IIRC it was done on ballistic gelatin. For myself I vary my loadings for the time of year. What works on a 85* day won't cut it on a
-15* night here in the dead of winter, through multiple layers of clothing. I know folks that carry home rolled hot loads of 230grn FMJ 45ACP just for the winter months, just for that reason. FWIW, I believe the 40S&W to be probably the best all around answer. It has the size, speed, weight and shoot ability. Numerous bullet configurations to choose from and can be had relative cheap to practice with. I prefer 9mm for practice due to cost and I find its hust a hoot to shoot. :coolman: 147grn 9mm is a good round, but finding it factory made at supersonic speeds isn't that easy. I have some "infamous" 9mm loaded to that I carry when I choose a 9. With that said my next major purchase will be a Kimber Ageis in 9mm. :cloud9:

[sailsmen]

As respects 9mm it is a very easy caliber to shoot. There is the legend it was developed to wound, taking more resources from the enemy and to terrorize the civilian population.
I cleaned a relatives Mauser he got while stationed in France during WWII. It was disturbing to look at how well machined and designed a 70 year old weapon was. It was difficult to reassemble due to the tite maching.
It could have been passed off as a modern state of the art competition pistol.

[rayjay]

The only thing with 9mm is you want to be careful about what you buy. If you see ammo marked "NATO" 9mm that stuff is loaded hotter and intended for subguns. I wouldn't want to use it for practice in say a KelTec. I've shot in CZ75s and BHPs without an issue, but small plastic guns, :nono: not a good idea.

[glassman99]

I like the Glock 19 (9m). I have mine loaded with 15 rounds of +P+ loads and they have plenty of stopping power. Also the Keltec P3AT .380 with Buffalo Bore +P SOLID ammo makes a very good "small" alternative. I just picked up a brand new S&W stainless 642 38 revolver for $299 after the rebate.

[sailsmen]

To answer why?????
I know 4 people who have been murdered and 14 women who have been *****, including home invasion and torture. None of the vicims were engaged in criminal activity and only one victim knew their attacker.

The one thing the victims had in common they were unarmed. The one thing the criminals had in common they were armed.

A gun is the great equalizer. A poor man with a 357 Mag is equal to a rich man with a 357 Mag. A 90lb woman with a 357 Mag is equal to a 220lb man with a 357 Mag.

When guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns.

[rayjay]

We have very few burglaries in my neck of the woods. The reason you ask? Virtually every homeowner is also a gun owner. I am currrently doing a once over cleaning/inspection on a Remington Model 11 shotgun for my neighbor. She is 79 years young and also owns a S&W K22. I don't believe Gramma as we call her is afraid to use either if she felt threatened. America is alive and well in the hinterlands.

[Egon Spengler]

We have very few burglaries in my neck of the woods. The reason you ask? Virtually every homeowner is also a gun owner. I am currrently doing a once over cleaning/inspection on a Remington Model 11 shotgun for my neighbor. She is 79 years young and also owns a S&W K22. I don't believe she is afraid to use either if she felt threatened. America is alive and well in the hinterlands.
Tough to burglarize with all that lake effect snow! That is good home protection for you as well huh? haha

[kernie]

To answer why?????
I know 4 people who have been murdered and 14 women who have been *****, including home invasion and torture. None of the vicims were engaged in criminal activity and only one victim knew their attacker.

The one thing the victims had in common they were unarmed. The one thing the criminals had in common they were armed.

A gun is the great equalizer. A poor man with a 357 Mag is equal to a rich man with a 357 Mag. A 90lb woman with a 357 Mag is equal to a 220lb man with a 357 Mag.

When guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns.


Wow, sorry for your situation. :eek:

[rayjay]

Tough to burglarize with all that lake effect snow! That is good home protection for you as well huh? haha
You'd be surprised at how dumb some people are. My favorites are the ones that not only leaves foot prints, but body parts at crimes scenes. :shake:

[Haggis]

You'd be surprised at how dumb some people are. My favorites are the ones that not only leaves foot prints, but body parts at crimes scenes. :shake:

'Dude we need to go back to the bank.'

'WHAT!! Are you crazy, we just robbed it.'

'But, I think I left my wallet.'

[thathotrodlincn]

You'd be surprised at how dumb some people are. My favorites are the ones that not only leaves foot prints, but body parts at crimes scenes. :shake:

How about the ones that leave cell phones?

[dgi]

That pocket holster has one major flaw IMHO, can you name it?

hole for trigger leaves possibility of keys, or whatever, creating opportunity for accidental discharge...

My EDC (every day carry) gun is my Walther PPK .380 (it'll get the job done at close range... lets face it, if im 25+ yards away, im either walking away from the problem, or running towards it...)

Waiting on a Springfield TRP 1911 and am gonna test different holsters for carrying that but i cant see carrying a full size 1911 in the summer wearing short sleeves and not-so-loose fitting clothing

My bedside/home defense gun is my Lone Star Arms Saiga 12 :coolman: (shotguns look better in court should it ever get that far)

[rayjay]

hole for trigger leaves possibility of keys, or whatever, creating opportunity for accidental discharge... Bingo (errant finger when stressed)

My EDC (every day carry) gun is my Walther PPK .380 (it'll get the job done at close range... lets face it, if im 25+ yards away, im either walking away from the problem, or running towards it...) Only a cop runs towards trouble.

Waiting on a Springfield TRP 1911 and am gonna test different holsters for carrying that but i cant see carrying a full size 1911 in the summer wearing short sleeves and not-so-loose fitting clothing Milts Sparks Summer 2 holster, :cool4:

My bedside/home defense gun is my Lone Star Arms Saiga 12 :coolman: (shotguns look better in court should it ever get that far) Not sure on the court part, but a shotgun makes good bed fellows.

Have to agree with some of the above.

[3pedal]

Currently I am carring the S&W Bodyguard. It is a nice little .380 pocket pistol. It has proven to be a great warm weather carry gun. I like that it has a thumb safety and locks open when empty. Operates a bit like a 1911, but small.

[Dragcity]

With all this snow and traveling out of town, my Colt .45 is with me... Yes, it is a bit uncomfortable to carry concealed. I have a nice shoulder holster, but don't often wear a sports coat. I wish NY would allow un-concealed carry.....

[En4cer71]

hole for trigger leaves possibility of keys, or whatever, creating opportunity for accidental discharge...

My EDC (every day carry) gun is my Walther PPK .380 (it'll get the job done at close range... lets face it, if im 25+ yards away, im either walking away from the problem, or running towards it...)

Waiting on a Springfield TRP 1911 and am gonna test different holsters for carrying that but i cant see carrying a full size 1911 in the summer wearing short sleeves and not-so-loose fitting clothing

My bedside/home defense gun is my Lone Star Arms Saiga 12 :coolman: (shotguns look better in court should it ever get that far)

I don't carry anything else in that pocket. With the size of the gun, gives a little extra to grip.

[rayjay]

I don't carry anything else in that pocket. With the size of the gun, gives a little extra to grip.

Please be careful, too many cases of people shooting the wrong person...