"States Pass Bills Mandating Drug Testing for Welfare Recipients" What took so long?

[guspech750]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ac/20110216/us_ac/7874532_states_pass_bills_mand ating_drug_testing_for_welfare _recipients


But welfare dirtbags need to have their tubes and nuts cut and welded shut forever. If you can't afford yourself. How and why should we pay for your future welfare recipient.



Sent from my iPhone
Go White Sox

Have a nice day :)

[Mike]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ac/20110216/us_ac/7874532_states_pass_bills_mand ating_drug_testing_for_welfare _recipients


But welfare dirtbags need to have their tubes and nuts cut and welded shut forever. If you can't afford yourself. How and why should we pay for your future welfare recipient.



Sent from my iPhone
Go White Sox

Have a nice day :)

Bout' time :beer: But I'm sure they need to do more than that, like a background check, etc.......but unfortunately that'll just cost us taxpayers more money!!!

[PonyUP]

Well it's a step, I submit the following steps should also be taken
1) receipiants are required to provide proof that they have been searching for a job (a copy of the application signed by a representative of the company with a matching business card
2) If you are on welfare, it becomes illiegal to get pregnant, if you do you have two choices
a) visit planned parenthood and begin the plan to no longer be a parent
b) forced adoption
Welfare should be difficult to obtain and there should be some significant effort involved, that way we can make sure it actually goes to the people that truly need it and truly deserve it.

[SC Cheesehead]

"...proposed a bill that would require recipients of government assistance checks and food stamps to pass a drug test...even though critics say it would stigmatize welfare recipients."

Hey critics, here's what I think of your concerns:

Tough http://www.bloodydecks.com/forums/images/smilies/_diarrhea_.gif

[kernie]

Well it's a step, I submit the following steps should also be taken
1) receipiants are required to provide proof that they have been searching for a job (a copy of the application signed by a representative of the company with a matching business card
2) If you are on welfare, it becomes illiegal to get pregnant, if you do you have two choices
a) visit planned parenthood and begin the plan to no longer be a parent
b) forced adoption
Welfare should be difficult to obtain and there should be some significant effort involved, that way we can make sure it actually goes to the people that truly need it and truly deserve it.



Forced adoption?

Oh ya, your a liberal...lol.

:shake:

[Baaad GN]

I love the comments but I think the only state actually getting tough is MO. This will never fly in IL as to many people on the nipple and the Dem,s want those vote.
Chicago is now controlled by the Mex's who push to have all Illegals come here and they also love the free bene's. So were a lost cause!

[Shaijack]

Go for it, I can only wish that would happen.

[PonyUP]

Forced adoption?

Oh ya, your a liberal...lol.

:shake:

:lol: Well I have some liberal beliefs as well as some conservative ones. But I do feel that all the things we talk about wanting to get done are impossible to get done without a very tough line on welfare.

[Kodimar]

You can't force someone to give up their child. However you can stop issuing them checks.

**ninja edit

I guess you can if there is severe neglect.

[MrBluGruv]

"...even though critics say it would stigmatize welfare recipients."


Lmfao, I must have missed the part where it was ever cool to be on welfare.

Seriously, is it REALLY a genuine concern that welfare recipients feel a little hurt that they are drawing?

I think most people that really REALLY need it know themselves better than to be ashamed of themselves if they are in true need, and if nothing else a little shame can be a great motivator to get on your own two feet if they don't need it that badly.

Geez, when did shame become some unspeakable evil in this country?

[justmelanie]

I agree that something needs to be done, but you can't force someone to give up a child or to terminate a pregnancy or "get fixed". Maybe hand out condoms while they are in line for the drug test? No matter what they do the taxpayers are going to be footing the bill, but what else is new? If they fail the drug test, do they just get cut off, or are we all going to pay for their "drug treatment" programs as well? just sayin'

[kernie]

Well it's a step, I submit the following steps should also be taken
1) receipiants are required to provide proof that they have been searching for a job (a copy of the application signed by a representative of the company with a matching business card
2) If you are on welfare, it becomes illiegal to get pregnant, if you do you have two choices
a) visit planned parenthood and begin the plan to no longer be a parent
b) forced adoption
Welfare should be difficult to obtain and there should be some significant effort involved, that way we can make sure it actually goes to the people that truly need it and truly deserve it.


:lol: Well I have some liberal beliefs as well as some conservative ones. But I do feel that all the things we talk about wanting to get done are impossible to get done without a very tough line on welfare.

I'm quite sure liberals would never come up with an idea such as forced adopion, so i'm gonna say your not a liberal.

Ya know i don't even think i could hang this one on the crazed 5%er right wing nutbars, so...

What are you?

[TooManyFords]

My solution to Welfare is to pony up 1 years worth of benefits and cut them a 1-time check. Once paid they can never sign up again. Period. After 1 year, federal and state welfare ends.

Same for Indians.

[Leadfoot281]

I'm quite sure liberals would never come up with an idea such as forced adopion, so i'm gonna say your not a liberal.

Ya know i don't even think i could hang this one on the crazed 5%er right wing nutbars, so...

What are you?

Agreed. Politically, I'm to the far right of that well known centrist Rush Limbaugh but, seriously, forced adoptions?! Good grief. That sounds like a crazed liberal thing to me. Forced sterilizations is also really off the wall too, especially for some something temporary like gov/state assistance.

Back on topic, drug testing is a great idea. It ought to be expanded to anyone receiving state/federal money....for anything. Yep, everyone from the President right on down to the local dog catcher. Test 'em all!

[FordNut]

"...proposed a bill that would require recipients of government assistance checks and food stamps to pass a drug test...even though critics say it would stigmatize welfare recipients."

Hey critics, here's what I think of your concerns:

Tough http://www.bloodydecks.com/forums/images/smilies/_diarrhea_.gif

Stigmatize the heck out of it if it will influence the deadbeats to get a job.

[CBT]

My solution to Welfare is to pony up 1 years worth of benefits and cut them a 1-time check. Once paid they can never sign up again. Period. After 1 year, federal and state welfare ends.

Same for Indians.

What did the Indians do?

[de minimus]

What did the Indians do?

They had the nerve to occupy land that others wanted.

[CBT]

They had the nerve to occupy land that others wanted.

Why those sneaky mofo's!!!

[PonyUP]

I'm quite sure liberals would never come up with an idea such as forced adopion, so i'm gonna say your not a liberal.

Ya know i don't even think i could hang this one on the crazed 5%er right wing nutbars, so...

What are you?

I am an independent thinker, I refuse to adhere my thinking to one particular line. Now forced adoption is obviously way out there and it will never happen. But I stated an extreme response to a legitimate problem. There are people out there just squeezing out kids because the more kids they have, the higher the welfare check.

What I am proposing is that if someone is irresponsible enough to continue to get pregnant when they can't afford to be, they obviously lack proper decision making ability.

Oh I know contraception isn't 100% effective, but I'm trying to put attention to the problem.

I believe (And I am not stating this as fact) that for every one person that truly needs and deserves welfare, there are 4 more that are milking the system.

Until you get the ones milking it off the proverbial teet, you will solve zero problems in this country.

So stop feeling sorry for the mom on welfare about to squeeze out her fifth kid, that kids life has the greatest chance of failure being born into that situation. At least up for adoption, they have a stronger fighting chance.

You need a license to fish, a license to hunt, a license to carry a gun, and a license to drive, but all you need to get pregnant is an average of two minutes. Does that not seem screwed up to you?

[duhtroll]

After 1 year, Indians end???

Holy crap!

THEN where the hell will I get tech support??!


My solution to Welfare is to pony up 1 years worth of benefits and cut them a 1-time check. Once paid they can never sign up again. Period. After 1 year, federal and state welfare ends.

Same for Indians.

[LIGHTNIN1]

Ban the Less Fortunate from owning cell phones, buying cigarettes and owning pets they can't afford. In these parts it irritates me seeing people at red lights or intersections with signs wanting handouts smoking cigarettes, with a dog on the leash, talking on a cell phone, close to a liquor store.

[kernie]

I heard a stat yesterday, the richest 450 individuals in the USA have more money than the bottom 100,000,000 individuals.

Let me repeat that, cause i'm sure no one will hear me,

The top 450 individuals in the USA have more money than the bottom 100,000,000 individuals.

So when i hear stuff like Wisconsin talking about ending the milk program for developmentally handicapped children or hey, lets drug test the welfare rolls {oh ya, that will save tons of money,:shake:}. Then, here, i hear the upper-middleclass {i think folks reading this as a group, fit that category} scream insane stuff like drug screening, forced adoption or, lets not allow them to have cellphone or let them have a pet,:mad2:.

And while i'm at it can we put to rest this trickle down crapola, the only thing trickling down is urine as the super-rich piss on the masses.

There, i feel better now.

[ROCOB]

I heard a stat yesterday, the richest 450 individuals in the USA have more money than the bottom 100,000,000 individuals.

Let me repeat that, cause i'm sure no one will hear me,

The top 450 individuals in the USA have more money than the bottom 100,000,000 individuals.

So when i hear stuff like Wisconsin talking about ending the milk program for developmentally handicapped children or hey, lets drug test the welfare rolls {oh ya, that will save tons of money,:shake:}. Then, here, i hear the upper-middleclass {i think folks reading this as a group, fit that category} scream insane stuff like drug screening, forced adoption or, lets not allow them to have cellphone or let them have a pet,:mad2:.

And while i'm at it can we put to rest this trickle down crapola, the only thing trickling down is urine as the super-rich piss on the masses.

There, i feel better now.


450 people have more wealth than 100,000,000. This statistic is alarming. The thing I find more alarming is the notion that someone in need of welfare does not have to earn it by complying with societal norms, ie. do not take drugs. I hope that I will never have to rely on the welfare system, but if I do, I strongly believe not taking drugs is a pretty fair trade for money given to me so I can make ends meet while I am trying to get back on my feet and make a way for myself and my family.

[SC Cheesehead]

I heard a stat yesterday, the richest 450 individuals in the USA have more money than the bottom 100,000,000 individuals.

Let me repeat that, cause i'm sure no one will hear me,

The top 450 individuals in the USA have more money than the bottom 100,000,000 individuals.

So when i hear stuff like Wisconsin talking about ending the milk program for developmentally handicapped children or hey, lets drug test the welfare rolls {oh ya, that will save tons of money,:shake:}. Then, here, i hear the upper-middleclass {i think folks reading this as a group, fit that category} scream insane stuff like drug screening, forced adoption or, lets not allow them to have cellphone or let them have a pet,:mad2:.

And while i'm at it can we put to rest this trickle down crapola, the only thing trickling down is urine as the super-rich piss on the masses.

There, i feel better now.

Kernie, at times you absolutely amaze me.

I'm assuming that the 450 individuals you're referring to could have only obtained their money by forcefully taking it from others; correct? There is no possible way they could have earned it through hard work, investment or risk-taking; right? They don't DESERVE to have all that money, do they? It's their DUTY to give it to others.

More socialistic pap.

There was a time in this nation when taking a handout was considered a last resort, not something to be proud of. Not so any more. Now, it's "I'm entitled to it, even if I did not earn it."

BTW, the hysterical drivel you're spouting about Wisconsin is not the issue at hand. The issue is trying to recapture fiscal responsibility before the whole damn system implodes. I fail to see how asking teachers or for that matter any public sector employee to pay a slightly larger share of costs which are burdening an already over stretched state budget is something bad or (GASP) E-V-I-L.

Oh, and as for "And while i'm at it can we put to rest this trickle down crapola, the only thing trickling down is urine as the super-rich piss on the masses." Been brushing up on Marx agian, have we? :rolleyes:

[Dragcity]

Oh Canada..........

[CBT]

You need a license to fish, a license to hunt, a license to carry a gun, and a license to drive, but all you need to get pregnant is an average of two minutes. Does that not seem screwed up to you?

Yes, that does seem screwed up to me. A woman deserves more than two minutes.

[duhtroll]

The issue in Wisconsin has nothing to do with the budget.

1 - Gov. Walker had the money he needed before he handed it out to businesses.

2 - The teachers' union has already agreed to the monetary concessions he wants.

The issue is that Walker is not satisfied with that. He wants to remove collective bargaining from the public sector unions. Well, the unions that didn't vote for him, anyway.

If he takes away the right to bargain, watch what happens to Wisconsin schools. Do you think any teachers there are going to be enthusiastic about going back to a profession where they get no respect at all?

The issue in Wisconsin is PURELY political.

So much for the GOP reaching out to the people.

EDIT: I will add a source that sums up the whole argument pretty well. The left says Walker inherited a huge surplus, which is not true. The right says the left are just whining and making things up. Here is the most succinct description using real sources that I have found so far:

http://www.alternet.org/newsandviews/article/480125/correction:_it's_a_ginned-up_%22crisis,%22_but_scott_wal ker_isn't_entirely_to_blame_fo r_wisconsin's_budget_gap/



BTW, the hysterical drivel you're spouting about Wisconsin is not the issue at hand. The issue is trying to recapture fiscal responsibility before the whole damn system implodes. I fail to see how asking teachers or for that matter any public sector employee to pay a slightly larger share of costs which are burdening an already over stretched state budget is something bad or (GASP) E-V-I-L.

[SGT_MERC]

I've been reading some of the signs the protesters are holding up in Wisconsin. Alot of them say "this is for the childrens future." That is a load of crap. If the teachers were so worried about the childrens future, they would realize how bad the problem is and make the necessary adjustments to help the situation. They would rather put 1600 teachers on the streets, how is that helping with educating the children. All they are worried about is money. Yeah, people can say the teachers are worried about their own future, but if they don't get their heads out of their butts and work with the system, they won't have a future to worry about, the system will collapse. I've worked for union shops and non-union shops. The companies actions almost always dictate whether you need a union. I've seen greed on the company's part cause a union to move in. I have also seen greed on the unions part cause a company to fail. I've seen it happen and it will keep happening. It's just a money and greed driven cycle. Everyone has their opinion and that is my 2 cents worth.

[SC Cheesehead]

This article puts Wisconsin issue into perspective:

...All of the people at the bargaining table are salaried by taxpayers anyway, so it's a big negotiation with someone else's money. But don't call it "negotiation" -- call it "divvying up the loot."

This whole exercise in protesting isn't civil disobedience -- it's just another transaction, one in which the have-yours labor leaders are trying to reassert their authority over taxpayer resources by arguing that it's inhumane to ask government workers to pay more into their own health care and pensions, and that collective bargaining means only one side gets a bargain.

Read more at the Washington Examiner: http://washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/beltway-confidential/2011/02/wisconsin-reveals-class-war-between-haves-and-have-yours##ixzz1EhJbiI3H

[duhtroll]

I am sorry, but you are flat-out wrong on this one.

Any budget "problem" caused by anything involving the teachers' union has already been solved.

I point you to the previous article, and this one:

http://www.alternet.org/newsandviews/article/480123/governor_walker's_own_statemen t_proves_that_his_assault_on_p ublic_employees_has_nothing_to _do_with_wisconsin's_budget_sh ortfall/#paragraph3

"Divvying up the loot" indeed. :rolleyes:


This article puts Wisconsin issue into perspective:

...All of the people at the bargaining table are salaried by taxpayers anyway, so it's a big negotiation with someone else's money. But don't call it "negotiation" -- call it "divvying up the loot."

This whole exercise in protesting isn't civil disobedience -- it's just another transaction, one in which the have-yours labor leaders are trying to reassert their authority over taxpayer resources by arguing that it's inhumane to ask government workers to pay more into their own health care and pensions, and that collective bargaining means only one side gets a bargain.

Read more at the Washington Examiner: http://washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/beltway-confidential/2011/02/wisconsin-reveals-class-war-between-haves-and-have-yours##ixzz1EhJbiI3H

[PonyUP]

I heard a stat yesterday, the richest 450 individuals in the USA have more money than the bottom 100,000,000 individuals.

Let me repeat that, cause i'm sure no one will hear me,

The top 450 individuals in the USA have more money than the bottom 100,000,000 individuals.

So when i hear stuff like Wisconsin talking about ending the milk program for developmentally handicapped children or hey, lets drug test the welfare rolls {oh ya, that will save tons of money,:shake:}. Then, here, i hear the upper-middleclass {i think folks reading this as a group, fit that category} scream insane stuff like drug screening, forced adoption or, lets not allow them to have cellphone or let them have a pet,:mad2:.

And while i'm at it can we put to rest this trickle down crapola, the only thing trickling down is urine as the super-rich piss on the masses.

There, i feel better now.

Kernie, I agree with you that trickle down economics, or "voodoo economics" does not work as the money rarely trickles down very far. However, I would also say the money wasted on people that are milking a government system that is very easy to defraud actually hurt that lower $100,000. The middle class is what makes this economy move, their spending has the greatest impact on the economy, and their costs constraints are the greatest detractors.

You honestly do not find it irresponsible for someone collecting a government check to continue to collect those funds without looking for a job? Or trading foodstamps for cash so they can buy drugs? Or waisting the money they do get on cigarettes and booze? Or taking on a pet that they cannot and will not be able to properly care for? Or continuing to have children to collect a larger check, and yet not diverted those additional funds for the benefit of the additional children?

While there are very honest people that are in need of welfare and are responsible with the funds, there are many more that are taking advantage, and at the end of the day the greatest effect of that is on the middle class.

This country was built on the backs of the middle class, and what both parties are forgetting and have always forgotten is that the more things that help the middle class, the better it is for the country.

Handouts without rules, is never the answer and as Casey said, there is no such thing as a free lunch. It's time that welfare stop being a free lunch to freeloaders and abusers and actually be provided for the people it was intended for. A way to make ends meet, while searching for a new job.

[SC Cheesehead]

^^^^^ Well stated, bubba! ^^^^^

[Bluerauder]

The top 450 individuals in the USA have more money than the bottom 100,000,000 individuals.

You really didn't need to repeat it .... we can read just fine. :rolleyes:

I think that you are just pizzed off that you didn't make the list. :P

Truth is that these ultra-rich folks do alot of good with their money. Bill Gates and Warren Buffet contribute very heavily to charity work to reduce some of the burden on the tax base. I'm sure the Stephen Jobs, Branson and others do as well.

In addition, they pay very heavy taxes (nearly 50%) on all that money for the privilege of being supper rich. And, they employ a heck of alot of people. Why does that bother you?

Would you rather redistribute all that money to the 100,000,000 who are in the 10-15% tax bracket? Who is gonna make up the shortfall? Let's just stick it to the middle class again and bump up their rate to 40% -- h3LL they really don't "deserve" their money either.

Sometimes your thought process just boggles my mind, Kernie. :confused:

[kernie]

450 people have more wealth than 100,000,000. This statistic is alarming. The thing I find more alarming is the notion that someone in need of welfare does not have to earn it by complying with societal norms, ie. do not take drugs. I hope that I will never have to rely on the welfare system, but if I do, I strongly believe not taking drugs is a pretty fair trade for money given to me so I can make ends meet while I am trying to get back on my feet and make a way for myself and my family.

[QUOTE=PonyUP;1013495]
You honestly do not find it irresponsible for someone collecting a government check to continue to collect those funds without looking for a job? Or trading foodstamps for cash so they can buy drugs? Or waisting the money they do get on cigarettes and booze? Or taking on a pet that they cannot and will not be able to properly care for? Or continuing to have children to collect a larger check, and yet not diverted those additional funds for the benefit of the additional children?

I'm not speaking for the minority who abuse the system.

[kernie]

Kernie, at times you absolutely amaze me.

I'm assuming that the 450 individuals you're referring to could have only obtained their money by forcefully taking it from others; correct? There is no possible way they could have earned it through hard work, investment or risk-taking; right? They don't DESERVE to have all that money, do they? It's their DUTY to give it to others.

More socialistic pap.

There was a time in this nation when taking a handout was considered a last resort, not something to be proud of. Not so any more. Now, it's "I'm entitled to it, even if I did not earn it."

BTW, the hysterical drivel you're spouting about Wisconsin is not the issue at hand. The issue is trying to recapture fiscal responsibility before the whole damn system implodes. I fail to see how asking teachers or for that matter any public sector employee to pay a slightly larger share of costs which are burdening an already over stretched state budget is something bad or (GASP) E-V-I-L.

Oh, and as for "And while i'm at it can we put to rest this trickle down crapola, the only thing trickling down is urine as the super-rich piss on the masses." Been brushing up on Marx agian, have we? :rolleyes:

I'm a commie, really?


Oh Canada..........

And a Canadian, OMG!

[PonyUP]

I would argue it's the majority abusing the system, the minority who actually need it and try to pull themselves up, are the victims of that abuse.

[kernie]

I would argue it's the majority abusing the system, the minority who actually need it and try to pull themselves up, are the victims of that abuse.

Oh i don't believe that at all. The vast majority, at least around here, are unskilled single moms with several kids, an abuse rate certainly under 10%.

I would think that's the case most anywhere.

[SC Cheesehead]

Oh i don't believe that at all. The vast majority, at least around here, are unskilled single moms with several kids, an abuse rate certainly under 10%.

I would think that's the case most anywhere.

You really need to get out more, your view from that ivory tower you're in is a bit clouded. :rolleyes:

[Dragcity]

Every morning I go to work, there are the same two freeloaders sitting on daddys front porch, smoking their cigarettes and likely laughing at me. Neither of these two flea bags has worked in over two years. They are ten years younger than I.

See, MY hard work pays for their lazy asses to watch me work.. If that is not effed up, what is?

Fact is the US Gov't enables folks to rape the system. These two creeps do absolutely NOTHING to benefit society, their families or themselves. Waste products completely.

So, go f u c k youself anyone who thinks this system works.

I paid over $30,000 in taxes last year.. My Brother in law is a cardiologist. He paid over $180,000 in taxes last year.

Yes, those making more do indeed pay more. Actually more than their fair share.

My dead beat neighbors really should have no right to my money..... They do nothing for it..

Over and OUT. !

[Dragcity]

Oh, and Kernie, I used to hang around St. Catherines in my youth. There is good reason there are a ton of single mums up there. We have a word for gals like that.

[dakslim]

We now have a couple of generations of people on welfare. If you grow up knowing that you don't have to work for a living why not reap the benefits. To many recipients it's now an "entitlement".

Several years ago I was laid off from Sikorsky in Bridgeport, Ct. and applied for food stamps and unemployment. I found another job in less than a month, never recieved unemployment and turned in the food stamps that my wife and I hadn't used. Returning the food stamps was a job in and of itself, btw.

I have worked all my life starting about 12 and my parents worked all of their lives. In my opinion no one should receive welfare unless they do some kind of work for it, whether it be picking up litter, anyhthing and I don't feel mandatory drug testing is asking too much. If they could test for alcohol and nicotine in the system too I'd say do it.

[PonyUP]

Oh i don't believe that at all. The vast majority, at least around here, are unskilled single moms with several kids, an abuse rate certainly under 10%.

I would think that's the case most anywhere.

Must be nice to live in that Canadian Utopian society, believe me the roles are reversed here in the lower 48. The majority are abusing the system greatly impacting and limiting the funds to those who actually need it and are responsible with it.

[kernie]

Oh, and Kernie, I used to hang around St. Catherines in my youth. There is good reason there are a ton of single mums up there. We have a word for gals like that.

Jeesh, what's your problem?

[PonyUP]

We now have a couple of generations of people on welfare. If you grow up knowing that you don't have to work for a living why not reap the benefits. To many recipients it's now an "entitlement".

Several years ago I was laid off from Sikorsky in Bridgeport, Ct. and applied for food stamps and unemployment. I found another job in less than a month, never recieved unemployment and turned in the food stamps that my wife and I hadn't used. Returning the food stamps was a job in and of itself, btw.

I have worked all my life starting about 12 and my parents worked all of their lives. In my opinion no one should receive welfare unless they do some kind of work for it, whether it be picking up litter, anyhthing and I don't feel mandatory drug testing is asking too much. If they could test for alcohol and nicotine in the system too I'd say do it.

Thats an excellent point, why is it too much to ask them to prove that they are entirely drug free and have to do a little work to get the check. Wanna help the environment? Great, let's send you to a garbage dump and get recyclibles that weren't divided. Again, I say you have to provide proof that you have actively been looking for a job before you get your check.

We want to put regulations everywhere else (Education, Oil Companies, Wall Street) why is it wrong to put regulations and rules on welfare?

Right now, pretty much all you have to do is ask for a check, and they will send it to you if you are out of work? Why is rules so bad?

[CBT]

The problem is generational now. Who wants to get an education and work for a living when you can just vote for the politicians who support social programs like your parents and grandparents before you did? More than 50% of the population is hooked like junkies on government freebies, and most politicians have no problem acting as pushers feeding that addiction.
Stick a microphone in front of a politician and they will promise you whatever you want to hear. Yes, you have the right to pursue happiness, but it’s not the government’s responsibility to provide it. You have the right to equal protection under the law, which means the same laws apply to any American citizen regardless of their social status and ethnicity. It does not mean the government is responsible for your physical well being or your economic stability. Believe it or not that’s left up to the individual. Be responsible for your self and stop mooching from the government is what I would say if elected. Yes, some people hit hard times, that is a fact, and we all know someone who has been down and out, but I think assistance should be based on what you do to better your situation while you are down and out.

[MM2004]

Well put Case.

I have an unwritten rule...

If you don't help yourself, then why should I help you?

Mike.

[CBT]

Well put Case.

I have an unwritten rule...

If you don't help yourself, then why should I help you?

Mike.
Kids and critters, they can't help thier situation. That's why I only donate to kids charities or animal shelters. If an adult who has never tried to better themselves is asking for handouts, I have no sympathy. I gave a "homeless" guy a 5 dollar bill the other day when me and Jr. and Amy walked out of Buffalo Wild Wings. He was polite, and his pitch was believable. I could have said "Oh you're hungry? Take my carryout bags, enjoy." Or, since they were selling cookies 20 feet away, I could have bought him a box a Girl Scout cookies. He didn't smell like booze, he wasn't shaking for a fix, and when I handed him the 5 out of my wallet, it left me with a 1. I even showed him, I said "Look, now you have more than me." This guy got choked up and tried to give it back, but I didn't take it. Now for all I know he went and spent it on a half-pint of Mad Dog 20/20 and a "gummer" from some skank at the park, but I don't care. What someone does with what I give them is thier business. BUT, to this guys credit, he actually WAS working. It takes time and energy and humility to walk around all day asking for help. At least he wasn't sitting in free housing staring at his mailbox waiting for my tax dollars to arrive.

[Dragcity]

No, He took your fiver and got his booze, THEN went home to wait for his check, whilst watching the new 52 inch LED television and Blu Ray.

[Kodimar]

I have worked all my life starting about 12 and my parents worked all of their lives. In my opinion no one should receive welfare unless they do some kind of work for it, whether it be picking up litter, anyhthing and I don't feel mandatory drug testing is asking too much. If they could test for alcohol and nicotine in the system too I'd say do it.

I've often wondered that as well? Why do we have people on welfare but are paying people to be janitors at government buildings or for mowing lawns. Make these people work even if its only a few hours a day. They might just learn something...

[CBT]

No, He took your fiver and got his booze, THEN went home to wait for his check, whilst watching the new 52 inch LED television and Blu Ray.
lol, that could be, but i'll never know.

[Mr. Man]

Where are all these jobs you guys think these welfare people are giving the finger to? The fact is that there aren't enough jobs presently to go around. So the answer is to gather all the people over 18 who make less than the minimum poverty level and big a dig hole and shoot them. This will save us all that welfare money, cut crime and solve the drug issue and reduce school class sizes. With all the money we save we could pay of the National debt, give everyone a tax break and have enough money left for everyone to take a nice vacation.:D

[kernie]

Where are all these jobs you guys think these welfare people are giving the finger to? The fact is that there aren't enough jobs presently to go around. So the answer is to gather all the people over 18 who make less than the minimum poverty level and big a dig hole and shoot them. This will save us all that welfare money, cut crime and solve the drug issue and reduce school class sizes. With all the money we save we could pay of the National debt, give everyone a tax break and have enough money left for everyone to take a nice vacation.:D

Ha! Perfect!...Wait, whats the minimum poverty level set at?

:beer:

[MrBluGruv]

What I want to know is what if the welfare system was reformed into a sort of "fair wage" work program? Take a BUNCH of jobs that are the famous "jobs no one wants to do" and charter them through the state or federal welfare system, so when people apply for welfare, they get payed to do actual work. It's money well-spent at that point really, cause the people that wouldn't otherwise have a job now have work, they are EARNING the money they get, and the tax money that's payed into this "welfare" system pays to basically make sure our cities and society are a clean and nice place to live, and even pays to make improvements to society. If these programs that this work gets put towards are public projects that people vote on, it's like directly choosing what you do with your income deductions for welfare while actually providing a positive environment for those that don't have work at the moment.

Yes, I'm sure people won't be happy because it isn't prestigious work, but it'll show you in a heartbeat who's in it to make due and who's in it to mooch from the system. Plus, there will ALWAYS be work to do, ALWAYS job opportunities to make income until one can find more serious work.

The only people that can't take part in this program would be the genuinely disabled, and honestly, especially if these people were hard-working people before they became disabled, I think a little help from society wouldn't hurt.

THAT is a kind of social welfare I can stand behind.

[CBT]

Where are all these jobs you guys think these welfare people are giving the finger to? The fact is that there aren't enough jobs presently to go around. So the answer is to gather all the people over 18 who make less than the minimum poverty level and big a dig hole and shoot them. This will save us all that welfare money, cut crime and solve the drug issue and reduce school class sizes. With all the money we save we could pay of the National debt, give everyone a tax break and have enough money left for everyone to take a nice vacation.:D
The No Hablas are doing them, where've you been since 1986? I'm sorry, that was rude. I meant the leaf blowers are doing them.

[SC Cheesehead]

The No Hablas are doing them, where've you been since 1986? I'm sorry, that was rude. I meant the leaf blowers are doing them.


¿Mi fuelle de la hoja se ha quedado sin gas, debo regresar a casa yo?

[LIGHTNIN1]

I know several of the people this thread is about. No they are not homeless.All them live about as good as I do.Neighbors down the street live with 82 yr. old grandma in her house. Her daughter has never worked and draws a government check. Her son 35 years old lives there and has never held a job and draws a check. All able bodied. The sons excuse is that sweat causes him to break out into a rash.They go to the casino, buy lottery tickets, smoke, drink, live. I could go on with others I know but they are all the same. None want a job. The 82 yr. old woman listed above works, at a nursing home.

[Dragcity]

There are lots of jobs out there, just not the ones these folks are willing to do. I work, my wife works, my 17 year old Son works, and my 14 year old Daughter works. In the fall, I was working a second job to afford some car parts I wanted but felt bad buying.

See, the gov't pays people $405 per week here in NY to do nothing. Why should they go sweat it out at BK of McD's or Harbor Freight. And give up that comfy, broken in spot on the couch.?

Go ahead, get me started. Maybe folks should get up and go to college or a technical school to learn some skills so they can qualify for the kind of job they might want. Give-aways do NOT promote self betterment. The bastards across the steet from me BOAST about getting over 100 weeks of $403 checks. $80 grand for nothing. Great! I told the dude to stay off my property and to not talk to me or anyone in my family again. And here I tried to help him fix his car and find work for him. Then I get the old "why should I work, I got a raise last month, they moved me from $380 per week to $405 per week. I'd have to work 30 hours for that......"

Sheesh, I hate this whole thing. Makes me sick.

[MrBluGruv]

...the gov't pays people $405 per week here in NY to do nothing...

That is more than I could make working 40 hours a week in my student-worker position.

And people wonder why so many of us students get upset and disheartened trying to make it the "traditional" college route...

[SC Cheesehead]

That is more than I could make working 40 hours a week in my student-worker position.

And people wonder why so many of us students get upset and disheartened trying to make it the "traditional" college route...

Yeah, but that route WILL pay off in the long run; ask me how I know... ;)

[CBT]

¿Mi fuelle de la hoja se ha quedado sin gas, debo regresar a casa yo?

That's okay, I can handle my own sheetrock work, thanks for asking. :beer:

[guspech750]

About ten or eleven years ago. My wife and I where walking to Union Train Station near the Sears Tower. Well as we were walking past a McDonalds. A homeless P.O.S. Asked me for some money. I politely told him
no and since we were right in front of McDonalds I told him I would help him go fill out a job app at McDonalds. He said " F-you. I don't needs a F-ing "gob"!! F-you man". I told him to go Fk himself. And walked away. Another P.O.S. Wanted to sell me a news paper that's printed for the homeless to sell. I was about to give her the dollar but I noticed she was not going to hand me the paper. I asked for the paper and she told me no. So I told her to take a hike and kept my dollar. So to all homeless and welfare people. Drop dead!!

Sent from my iPhone
Go White Sox

[TAKEDOWN]

... or I love it when you offer them food and they have the audacity to ask for the money. I didn't know beggers could be choosers. Hmmmm.... I wonder what they want the money for instead!

[Mr. Man]

The No Hablas are doing them, where've you been since 1986? I'm sorry, that was rude. I meant the leaf blowers are doing them.
You big dummy you just made my point. They are working!!! If we shoot all the non-working welfare people and put them in the Big Hole, we could expedite the naturalization of the working, as you call them"No Hablas", make them citizens. They could have all the housing and transportation devices left behind by the people that now fill the Big Hole. It's win win. Jobs nobody wants are still getting done. The illegal alien problem is solved and taxes are lower allowing us to buy more stuff which in turn makes Bill Gates even richer and he in turn will donate more money to charitable causes like painting all DPB and DTR Marauders Black.:D

[SC Cheesehead]

You big dummy you just made my point. They are working!!! If we shoot all the non-working welfare people and put them in the Big Hole, we could expedite the naturalization of the working, as you call them"No Hablas", make them citizens. They could have all the housing and transportation devices left behind by the people that now fill the Big Hole. It's win win. Jobs nobody wants are still getting done. The illegal alien problem is solved and taxes are lower allowing us to buy more stuff which in turn makes Bill Gates even richer and he in turn will donate more money to charitable causes like painting all DPB and DTR Marauders Black.:D

Sounds to me like the law of unintended consequences... :shake:

[MrBluGruv]

Yeah, but that route WILL pay off in the long run; ask me how I know... ;)

That's what I'm banking on, literally.

There's still a part of me that wonders if I had invested the between $120k and $150k from my education just into myself and earned real money from the get-go, if it will have equaled out anyways...

[SC Cheesehead]

That's what I'm banking on, literally.

There's still a part of me that wonders if I had invested the between $120k and $150k from my education just into myself and earned real money from the get-go, if it will have equaled out anyways...

Tell that part to go away. ;)

Education makes you more marketable, and will increase earnings potential over your career.

"WASHINGTON (AP) — If you are a high school student thinking about college, consider this: Someone with a bachelor's degree earns nearly $1 million more over his or her lifetime than a high school graduate. A Census Bureau survey released Thursday shows a college graduate can expect to earn $2.1 million working full-time between ages 25 and 64, which demographers call a typical work-life period. A master's degree-holder is projected to earn $2.5 million, while someone with a professional degree, such as a doctor or lawyer, could make even more — $4.4 million.

In contrast, a high school graduate can expect to make $1.2 million during the working years, according to the bureau report that tracked the influence of education on lifetime earnings."

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/census/2002-07-18-degree-dollars.htm

Here's another good article to check out:
http://www.statefarm.com/learning/life_stages/learning_lifestages_college.as p

[FordNut]

Back to the topic, if I have to take a drug test as a condition of having a job to earn a check, the bums on the dole should have to take a drug test as a condition of getting a free check.

[CBT]

The illegal alien problem is solved and taxes are lower allowing us to buy more stuff which in turn makes Bill Gates even richer and he in turn will donate more money to charitable causes like painting all DPB and DTR Marauders Black.:D


Sounds to me like the law of unintended consequences... :shake:

Sounds like one of the levels in Dantes Inferno.

[SC Cheesehead]

Back to the topic, if I have to take a drug test as a condition of having a job to earn a check, the bums on the dole should have to take a drug test as a condition of getting a free check.

Absolutely!

What's the stigma in that? Unless, of course, the party in question has something to hide....

[LIGHTNIN1]

Back to the topic, if I have to take a drug test as a condition of having a job to earn a check, the bums on the dole should have to take a drug test as a condition of getting a free check.

Look at what you have to go through just to ride on an airplane.

[CBT]

Look at what you have to go through just to ride on an airplane.

Wait till the TSA unionizes.....

[duhtroll]

Yeah, all that spectacular job performance that the TSA is currently well-known for will go right out the window.


Wait till the TSA unionizes.....

[SC Cheesehead]

Yeah, all that spectacular job performance that the TSA is currently well-known for will go right out the window.

Yeah, and I was just getting to really appreciate it...;)

[duhtroll]

They better not change soon - I don't fly much and I want MY "enhanced pat down."

You have to pay extra for that around here.


Yeah, and I was just getting to really appreciate it...;)

[SC Cheesehead]

They better not change soon - I don't fly much and I want MY "enhanced pat down."

You have to pay extra for that around here.

Yeah, know what you mean, no more "happy endings"...
http://media.macon.com/smedia/2010/03/15/22/20100315-220019-pic-911219166.embedded.prod_affili ate.71.jpg (http://media.macon.com/smedia/2010/03/15/22/20100315-220019-pic-911219166.standalone.prod_affi liate.71.jpg)

;) ------> :D

[FordNut]

Look at what you have to go through just to ride on an airplane.

I have to go through worse than airport security every morning to get into the gates at work. And I have to go through the same process to get back out in the afternoon.

[SC Cheesehead]

I have to go through worse than airport security every morning to get into the gates at work. And I have to go through the same process to get back out in the afternoon.

Yeah, going in is one thing, but getting the same treatment on the way out just ain't right.

Oh well, I guess you could just call in sick, then go stand outside the place and protest... ;)

[FordNut]

Yeah, going in is one thing, but getting the same treatment on the way out just ain't right.

Oh well, I guess you could just call in sick, then go stand outside the place and protest... ;)

Only teachers can do that. In Wisconsin...

You can't get close enough to my workplace to picket.

[SGT_MERC]

Just wait till the TSA unions don't get their way on something. It will be just like Europe, they will paralyze the air traffic in this country, holding everyone hostage to their will and demands. This country is in for a rude awakening.

[vtwoodsman]

Wow! I've been reading all these comments about those that are on public assistance, or pan-handling in the streets!
So I'm going to tell you a little personal story about the time I was accepting "public assistance" back in late 70's. I'd just gotten out doing six Honorable years in the United States Armed Forces. I had good training in the field of telecommunications and electronics. So fresh out of the war I went looking for work, filled out a zillion applications, took all kinds of entrance tests, but to no avail. After months of looking I finally landed a job with benefits. The pay was low, but at least it had decent medical coverage for me and my family. After a year I got fired for challenging my employer on cheating me out of pay that I was due. (I took the bastards to court, and eventually won my case after two years of litigation.) Thereafter work was tough to come by and my military training didn't open any doors, thus I decided to enroll in college after passing entrance exams. The G.I. bill helped me pay for some of the college expenses, but I had a family to care for, so I worked at two part time jobs that were minimum pay, and had a work-study job at the college. I didn't have any work related benefits for the family. So I went to the WELFARE office and applied for medical assistance. After much scrutiny and paperwork my family qualified for medical assistance, and by default food stamps, and a child nutrition program. I thank God and the Taxpayers for that safety net, because not long afterwards my wife and child wound up in the hospital and got the necessary medical care critical to their well being. Eventually I finished college, graduated, and was recruited by a great company with awesome pay and benefits!
Everybody's circumstances are different for needing public assistance!
I got what I needed at the time and I'm thankful that such programs were in place.
NO SHAME! Just practical.
I have no issues with my tax dollars going out to help those in need. Yeah, some folks take advantage of the system, but they are the minority. As to pan handlers.
I ask them if they are hungry, and if they say yes I gladly buy them a meal, but I don't give cash.
It's amazing how folks so easily dump on those in need...easy targets!

[kernie]

Wow! I've been reading all these comments about those that are on public assistance, or pan-handling in the streets!
So I'm going to tell you a little personal story about the time I was accepting "public assistance" back in late 70's. I'd just gotten out doing six Honorable years in the United States Armed Forces. I had good training in the field of telecommunications and electronics. So fresh out of the war I went looking for work, filled out a zillion applications, took all kinds of entrance tests, but to no avail. After months of looking I finally landed a job with benefits. The pay was low, but at least it had decent medical coverage for me and my family. After a year I got fired for challenging my employer on cheating me out of pay that I was due. (I took the bastards to court, and eventually won my case after two years of litigation.) Thereafter work was tough to come by and my military training didn't open any doors, thus I decided to enroll in college after passing entrance exams. The G.I. bill helped me pay for some of the college expenses, but I had a family to care for, so I worked at two part time jobs that were minimum pay, and had a work-study job at the college. I didn't have any work related benefits for the family. So I went to the WELFARE office and applied for medical assistance. After much scrutiny and paperwork my family qualified for medical assistance, and by default food stamps, and a child nutrition program. I thank God and the Taxpayers for that safety net, because not long afterwards my wife and child wound up in the hospital and got the necessary medical care critical to their well being. Eventually I finished college, graduated, and was recruited by a great company with awesome pay and benefits!
Everybody's circumstances are different for needing public assistance!
I got what I needed at the time and I'm thankful that such programs were in place.
NO SHAME! Just practical.
I have no issues with my tax dollars going out to help those in need. Yeah, some folks take advantage of the system, but they are the minority. As to pan handlers.
I ask them if they are hungry, and if they say yes I gladly buy them a meal, but I don't give cash.
It's amazing how folks so easily dump on those in need...easy targets!

Bravo!!!!!!!

:beer:

[guspech750]

Not easy targets. Just tired of the lies, cheats, and the B.S. wasteful spending because of welfare. Tired of being asked for more money not just from homeless but also our *****TY government to pump more money in to useless programs and other *****TY countries that don't care. Yet I and millions of other have to keep footing the bill. I know there are those who truely need it. It's time to rid the system of all the useless oxygen wasting examples of crappy do I dare call them humans who don't want to work and others just laying around with their legs open pushing babies as often as we push poo to collect more money. Time to close it down just like any other crappy business that doesn't work and put in place a better system for those who truely need it. Not want it.


Sent from my iPhone
Go White Sox

[TAKEDOWN]

Back to the topic, if I have to take a drug test as a condition of having a job to earn a check, the bums on the dole should have to take a drug test as a condition of getting a free check.

^^^ Couldn't say it any better! ^^^

[Horsepower]

This is not good for alot of people.

[duhtroll]

The right to protest peacefully is guaranteed in this country.

I suppose, unless you disagree with the protesters. :shake:

[SC Cheesehead]

Only teachers can do that. In Wisconsin...

You can't get close enough to my workplace to picket.

Could you guys annex the Wisconsin Statehouse? ;)

[Dragcity]

VTwoodsman - THAT is EXACTLY what the programs are set up for. To help people help themselves. You utilized your resources perfectly and RESPONSIBLY. By the way, congratulation on winding up where you wanted to be.

I think anyone would be hard pressed to find a single one of us who is not happy to pay taxes for just such a thing.

[CBT]

VTwoodsman - THAT is EXACTLY what the programs are set up for. To help people help themselves. You utilized your resources perfectly and RESPONSIBLY. By the way, congratulation on winding up where you wanted to be.

I think anyone would be hard pressed to find a single one of us who is not happy to pay taxes for just such a thing.
Word, ditto, and well said.

[Kodimar]

I got off of active duty about 3 years ago and about a year ago I started drilling as a reservist. Since then I've been drug tested 3 times. If I have to submit to a drug test 3 times with in less than a year for $200 a month. I don't think it would hurt welfare recipients to do a random drug test quarterly.

Also I think most people are fine with a safety net for people. But when it's apparent that it is being abused by so many people I think it's a bit of a knee jerk reaction to just say get rid of it all!

I think it needs to be completely reformed so people who actually need help can get it and people who just don't want to get a job have to actually go out and get a job.

[Bluerauder]

I think anyone would be hard pressed to find a single one of us who is not happy to pay taxes for just such a thing.

+1 Agreed. :up:

Unfortunately, it is not hard to find examples of abuse and fraud. That's where the problems are. Mandatory drug testing to recieve benefits only addresses (one of) the symptoms but does not treat the "welfare" disease.

Two counties in Florida are known as the Welfare and Medicaid fraud centers of the USA. Those two counties are reponsible for a large portion of Medicare and Welfare fraud and abuse. What is the US doing to fix that?

Drug dealers in south Florida are switching over to Medicare fraud because it is less likely that they will be caught. If caught and convicted, it is treated as a white collar crime with time served on the detention farm. It pays MORE than dealing drugs.

[PonyUP]

Wow! I've been reading all these comments about those that are on public assistance, or pan-handling in the streets!
So I'm going to tell you a little personal story about the time I was accepting "public assistance" back in late 70's. I'd just gotten out doing six Honorable years in the United States Armed Forces. I had good training in the field of telecommunications and electronics. So fresh out of the war I went looking for work, filled out a zillion applications, took all kinds of entrance tests, but to no avail. After months of looking I finally landed a job with benefits. The pay was low, but at least it had decent medical coverage for me and my family. After a year I got fired for challenging my employer on cheating me out of pay that I was due. (I took the bastards to court, and eventually won my case after two years of litigation.) Thereafter work was tough to come by and my military training didn't open any doors, thus I decided to enroll in college after passing entrance exams. The G.I. bill helped me pay for some of the college expenses, but I had a family to care for, so I worked at two part time jobs that were minimum pay, and had a work-study job at the college. I didn't have any work related benefits for the family. So I went to the WELFARE office and applied for medical assistance. After much scrutiny and paperwork my family qualified for medical assistance, and by default food stamps, and a child nutrition program. I thank God and the Taxpayers for that safety net, because not long afterwards my wife and child wound up in the hospital and got the necessary medical care critical to their well being. Eventually I finished college, graduated, and was recruited by a great company with awesome pay and benefits!
Everybody's circumstances are different for needing public assistance!
I got what I needed at the time and I'm thankful that such programs were in place.
NO SHAME! Just practical.
I have no issues with my tax dollars going out to help those in need. Yeah,
some folks take advantage of the system, but they are the minority. As to pan handlers.
I ask them if they are hungry, and if they say yes I gladly buy them a meal, but I don't give cash.
It's amazing how folks so easily dump on those in need...easy targets!

You are an excellent example of someone who was responsible and was trying to pull themselves up and just needed a little help. You are someone that truly needed it and deserved it. I certainly don't want to eliminate welfare, just put some rules to it so that it is limited to those who truly need it and will use it to get a job and better their life to eventually get off of it.

[SC Cheesehead]

Sorry guys, just can't help posting up this one:

"Obama couldn't run a small business selling lubricants in an all-male prison."

[kernie]

Sorry guys, just can't help posting up this one:

"Obama couldn't run a small business selling lubricants in an all-male prison."

Maybe you could try a little harder...

Your president is a very smart person, that's a good thing! Really it is! I think he would\could do well in a buisness setting.

Now the guy before him, you know, the toy story cowboy...

YeeHaw!!!...lol.

Peace :beer:

[SC Cheesehead]

Maybe you could try a little harder...

Your president is a very smart person, that's a good thing! Really it is! I think he would\could do well in a buisness setting.

Now the guy before him, you know, the toy story cowboy...

YeeHaw!!!...lol.

Peace :beer:

BO = Community Organizer, not Businessman

Being "Very Smart" does not automatically equate to being a competent business person, as we're all so painfully aware of down here in the lower 48.

Oh, that's right, we don't run our government like a business, carry on!

[kernie]

BO = Community Organizer, not Businessman

Being "Very Smart" does not automatically equate to being a competent business person, as we're all so painfully aware of down here in the lower 48.

Oh, that's right, we don't run our government like a business, carry on!

You have been run over by big business, next target, unions.

But enough from me.

Peace, out, :beer:

[PonyUP]

Someones business acumen can be a very telling sign of their ability to run a country. We see it in Obama with no true real business experience and we certainly saw it in Bush who bankrupted every business he ever ran, or just straight up ran it in the ground

[LIGHTNIN1]

What business setting has he ever been a part that he has run successfully except maybe when he was a lawyer he might have been a part of suing businesses and trying to shut them down like in his present position. Everything has always been done for him.

[PonyUP]

What business setting has he ever been a part that he has run successfully except maybe when he was a lawyer he might have been a part of suing businesses and trying to shut them down like in his present position. Everything has always been done for him.

Which one are you referring to? Obama or W? Obama has never run anything, Bush ran three companies I believe, including nearly bankrupting the Texas Rangers

[LIGHTNIN1]

Which one are you referring to? Obama or W? Obama has never run anything, Bush ran three companies I believe, including nearly bankrupting the Texas Rangers
Obama was who I was referring to.I do not know W's history with the Rangers. Obama has had something going for him to be elected Pres but being elected is one thing, being able to properly run the country is another item, and I was against a lot that W did like passing another entitlement program.

[CBT]

Someones business acumen can be a very telling sign of their ability to run a country. We see it in Obama with no true real business experience and we certainly saw it in Bush who bankrupted every business he ever ran, or just straight up ran it in the ground

The sky is straight up, not the ground. FAIL !! :D

[Fosters]

Obama has had something going for him to be elected Pres

...as opposed to all other presidents? :confused:

[CBT]

...as opposed to all other presidents? :confused:
Yes, some became President by default.

[duhtroll]

Our elected leaders act like children, so they should be treated like them.

"No, you can't take Friday afternoon off to go play with strippers until you have fixed the damn energy bill."

"No, you have to go ask your constituents if it is OK for you to give tax breaks to millionaires."

"No, first you have to fund the highway system before you can get your shipment of blow from "down South."

"Mom, JB says all liberals are whiners!"

"Yeah, well Nancy says we are all crazy!"

"Both of you! Go to your districts!"

That sort of thing.

[SC Cheesehead]

Our elected leaders act like children, so they should be treated like them.

"No, you can't take Friday afternoon off to go play with strippers until you have fixed the damn energy bill."

"No, you have to go ask your constituents if it is OK for you to give tax breaks to millionaires."

"No, first you have to fund the highway system before you can get your shipment of blow from "down South."

"Mom, JB says all liberals are whiners!"

"Yeah, well Nancy says we are all crazy!"

"Both of you! Go to your districts!"

That sort of thing.

:rofl: ^^^^^^ True, that! ^^^^^

[SC Cheesehead]

You have been run over by big business, next target, unions.

But enough from me.

Peace, out, :beer:

Businesses generate wealth. Government can only consume or redistribute wealth.

[kernie]

Businesses generate wealth. Government can only consume or redistribute wealth.

OK, well i said i wouldn't but there really is nothing wrong with friendly debate and it's hard not to awnser and i've got a big mouth...awww, you started it so you know...

Big business does infiltrate and influence your government much more that other western governments with lobbyists and money.

An example is the banking industry, i remember our big 5 banks complaining and whinning that they were over-regulated and not allowed to do things Americans were allowed to do, i'm sure you are becoming familiar with our over-regulated banks, TD has been my bank for 40 years.

Big business is worried about it's own arse and that's it.

What else can i say?

Peace, :beer:

[SC Cheesehead]

OK, well i said i wouldn't but there really is nothing wrong with friendly debate and it's hard not to awnser and i've got a big mouth...awww, you started it so you know...

Big business does infiltrate and influence your government much more that other western governments with lobbyists and money.

An example is the banking industry, i remember our big 5 banks complaining and whinning that they were over-regulated and not allowed to do things Americans were allowed to do, i'm sure you are becoming familiar with our over-regulated banks, TD has been my bank for 40 years.

Big business is worried about it's own arse and that's it.

What else can i say?

Peace, :beer:

I won't refute that, but I stand by my previous statement.

Governments do not produce wealth, they only consume or re-distribute it. Business, in ANY country, will generate wealth. Without a strong business sector, a country will languish and eventually die.

Thus, it only makes sense to create an environment that will cause business to flourish. Notice, I didn't say to let business run unchecked, but the more regulation and restriction placed on businesses, the more difficult it is for them to operate.

A wise man once said, "Government's view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it."

if that doesn't describe PrezBO, I don't know what does.

[teamrope]

+1 Agreed. :up:

Unfortunately, it is not hard to find examples of abuse and fraud. That's where the problems are. Mandatory drug testing to recieve benefits only addresses (one of) the symptoms but does not treat the "welfare" disease.

Two counties in Florida are known as the Welfare and Medicaid fraud centers of the USA. Those two counties are reponsible for a large portion of Medicare and Welfare fraud and abuse. What is the US doing to fix that?

Drug dealers in south Florida are switching over to Medicare fraud because it is less likely that they will be caught. If caught and convicted, it is treated as a white collar crime with time served on the detention farm. It pays MORE than dealing drugs.

Drive by section 8 housing in Tacoma, WA..... Very nice duplexes with manicured yards and you would be hard pressed finding many of those folks driving a POS car. The POS is the exception, not the rule there.

[Fosters]

Yes, some became President by default.

Well, I guess if the guy has accomplished next to nothing, I guess you better lower the yardstick... So yeah, you're right, compared to all of those vice presidents that were in office when the sitting president died/was assasinated/resigned, I guess obama does have 1 thing going for him.

[kernie]

I won't refute that, but I stand by my previous statement.

Governments do not produce wealth, they only consume or re-distribute it. Business, in ANY country, will generate wealth. Without a strong business sector, a country will languish and eventually die.

Thus, it only makes sense to create an environment that will cause business to flourish. Notice, I didn't say to let business run unchecked, but the more regulation and restriction placed on businesses, the more difficult it is for them to operate.

A wise man once said, "Government's view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it."

if that doesn't describe PrezBO, I don't know what does.

Government should not be in business and business should not be in government.




There, now put some quotemarks on it, stick it in your signature and admit that you were schooled by a liberal socialist!

Ha Ha!

Peace, :beer:

[kernie]

Government should not be in business and business should not be in government.




There, now put some quotemarks on it, stick it in your signature and admit that you were schooled by a liberal socialist!

Ha Ha!

Peace, :beer:
While i'm feeling wise...

Religion has no business in government and government has no business in religion.

There, i'm done.

Peace, :beer:

[SC Cheesehead]

Government should not be in business and business should not be in government.




There, now put some quotemarks on it, stick it in your signature and admit that you were schooled by a liberal socialist!

Ha Ha!

Peace, :beer:


While i'm feeling wise...

Religion has no business in government and government has no business in religion.

There, i'm done.

Peace, :beer:

I agree with both of those sentiments, that said, maybe you're more of a right wing conservative than you realize! :D

[jerrym3]

I'm not a huge fan of big government intervention in business, but sometimes you need government regulation to protect the consumer.

Can you imagine what big business would be selling us if there weren't some guidelines to adhere to?

Unless, of course, big business has the consumer at heart and not profitability. :)

[SC Cheesehead]

I'm not a huge fan of big government intervention in business, but sometimes you need government regulation to protect the consumer.

Can you imagine what big business would be selling us if there weren't some guidelines to adhere to?

Unless, of course, big business has the consumer at heart and not profitability. :)


Agreed on some basic regulations to protect consumers, but the government has no business telling business how to conduct their affairs or determine "reasonable" profitabilty. Profit's not a dirty word, but unfortunately, it appears that our current adminstration views it that way.

[CWright]

While i'm feeling wise...

Religion has no business in government and government has no business in religion.

There, i'm done.

Peace, :beer:

I am a firm believer that our government shouldn't tell what we can and can't do with our faith. As far as our elected leaders are concerned and who deal with governing us I DO NOT have a problem with them praying to seek wisdom on how to govern and lead us. I welcome it. I hope that is done by atleast a few of them.

[SC Cheesehead]

I am a firm believer that our government shouldn't tell what we can and can't do with our faith. As far as our elected leaders are concerned and who deal with governing us I DO NOT have a problem with them praying to seek wisdom on how to govern and lead us. I welcome it. I hope that is done by atleast a few of them.

Can we get an AMEN to that, Chris! :up:

[CWright]

Can we get an AMEN to that, Chris! :up:


Amen my brotha! I LOVE THIS NATION! I LOVE who we are as a people. I know we have our ups and downs. I like to look at them as growing pains. Sometimes they are good and sometimes they are bad. Trials will bring maturity. The great thing is that if we make a mistake we can come back and fix it. That's got us where we are today. I know our better days are ahead and I along with everybody else will be glad when we get out of this valley we are in. But above all, 98% of us on this site are AMERICAN and I will not ever be ASHAMED!!!!!!! of that! That's why I am thankful that I can pray freely for who we are and what we stand for. If we pray and seek wisdom He will give it to us. I know we as Americans will persevere through this. Let's do it together!:2thumbs::flag:

[vtwoodsman]

No issues for drug testing to qualify for public assistance benefits. However I wouldn't disqualify anyone that is in a substance abuse treatment program and stayed clean, and nor would I disqualify those with diagnosed mental illness.

While on the topic of spending reductions of tax dollars, I'd like to start with the U.S. Congress "perks". No free haircuts, be subject to the same Federal Retirement plans as federal workers do, no junkett trips on taxpayer dollars, etc..etc.
And when deciding to fund "war" or "police" actions, each member of Congress must have a family member serving in the United States Armed Forces and ready to serve on the front lines of combat.

[SC Cheesehead]

No issues for drug testing to qualify for public assistance benefits. However I wouldn't disqualify anyone that is in a substance abuse treatment program and stayed clean, and nor would I disqualify those with diagnosed mental illness.

While on the topic of spending reductions of tax dollars, I'd like to start with the U.S. Congress "perks". No free haircuts, be subject to the same Federal Retirement plans as federal workers do, no junkett trips on taxpayer dollars, etc..etc.
And when deciding to fund "war" or "police" actions, each member of Congress must have a family member serving in the United States Armed Forces and ready to serve on the front lines of combat.

Better yet, subject the U.S. Congress to Social Security retirement funding just like us, and have them covered by the Obamanation Healthcare the rest of us are going to have to suffer with...

[vtwoodsman]

I concur. Plus I believe that all earned income should be subject to Social Security tax. 100% of my earned income is subject to the SS tax, so why not everyone else ?

[duhtroll]

Agree here. Let ALL state workers have the same health insurance, too. That should cut some major costs if we aren't paying for Cadillac plans for elected officials.

I never thought of Cadillac as a good car example. Let's call it a Marauder plan.

It would eliminate this whole union fight if every state worker, including elected officials, had the same health plan.




I concur. Plus I believe that all earned income should be subject to Social Security tax. 100% of my earned income is subject to the SS tax, so why not everyone else ?