What now?

[Vostok]

So for those of you that saw/were following my thread regarding the dealership dropping a garage door on my roof, it took 3 weeks and then some but they finally made it right. They did replace the whole roof and painted it and it blended just fine.

That thread can be found here:

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=69462

Anyway, the problem I brought it in for originally is still at hand...

They determined that I had low compression on cylinders 7 and 8 and then further determined that it was because the exhaust valves are bent and that the cylinder head and gaskets among some other things would need to be replaced.

My warranty company was contacted and they sent out an inspector who took some pictures and whatnot (so they can try to dodge the repair obviously)

My warranty company is trying to say that a "foreign substance" entered the engine and caused this to happen because there were a number of marks and scratches on the inside of the cylinder parts. The "foreign substance" however was never located and was deemed to have supposedly exited through an exhaust port.

Long story short they are trying to say that this is not covered under my warranty because of the "foreign substance". BUT I have thoroughly read through my contract and I don't really see anything that supports their claim. I have "wear and tear" coverage on all of those parts in my defense.

Another inspector is being sent from a different company (they are free lance inspectors) to reevaluate this situation.

The dealer is going to stick me with a bill of nearly $5000 though if I cannot get my warranty company to foot the bill for this.

I'd just like your guys thoughts and opinions on this, what do I do next? Is some of this BS? What else can I be doing to make this go my way?

:( :alone:

[MM2004]

Hmmm...

Shooting from the hip here but tell them to locate this 'foreign object' and prove to you, their customer/client, that it is not a part of the engine that created this damage.

You have wear and tear coverage and anything could have happened to cause the scarring of the cylinders and bending of valves.

Ask the wrench working on your MM for his opinion in confidence on what he feels could have created the damage.

Whatever happens, I wish you luck and would recommend you be as polite and professional as you possibly can.

Keep us posted.

;)

Mike.

[Lignum]

Sometimes a threatening letter from an attorney is all you need.

[MOTOWN]

i agree with mm2004, find proof of what realy caused the problem! from what your describing sounds like the very reason the rear cooling mod was invented.

[RacerX]

Is there actual evidence of bent rods or is it loose valve seats which is a problem on some of the 4v dohc engines???

[Michael]

If the object was big enough to bend a valve it won't get past the first catalitic converter.

[PonyUP]

Since they are the ones fighting the warranty, the burden of proof is on them. Though I'm not sure what recourse you'll have. If you sue, you may win, but it also may cost you close to what the reparis will cost, unless you are allowed in your state to include court costs.

[Vostok]

Is there actual evidence of bent rods or is it loose valve seats which is a problem on some of the 4v dohc engines???

I'm not sure about this one. Their exact wording was "bent exhaust valves"

[Vostok]

If the object was big enough to bend a valve it won't get past the first catalitic converter.

Is there some way I can prove this to them?

[RacerX]

They would have to scope it and rotate the crank. Only way. I bet it's valve seats coming loose. Known issue.

[carfixer]

The valves are most likely burnt. Click this link to see http://ww2.justanswer.com/uploads/kennyz1963/2010-02-26_123130_tsb06-05-13.pdf

[MMBLUE]

The valves are most likely burnt. Click this link to see http://ww2.justanswer.com/uploads/kennyz1963/2010-02-26_123130_tsb06-05-13.pdf


WOW. Just read that carfixer, and that sounds what happened to my car. I chased idle issues and forever. Enventually I change the engine last week and have been happy ever since.

It sounds like all you would need to do is change out driverside head. As for the claim. sic the lawyers after them.

[Vostok]

Sometimes a threatening letter from an attorney is all you need.

As the situation currently stands it looks like it's going to head in that direction as it might be well worth it considering what the dealer could possibly hit me with.

I take it your a lawyer of sorts?

How should I ask a lawyer to word this letter in regards to my specific situation?

[Chevyguy]

Known issue with the design of the heads, find the TSB's quoted below and bash the warranty company


Originally Posted by massacre
+65,000 about the cooling mod.

Every 4V modular motor that I have torn down, the driver's side head was a lot darker in color than the passenger side head, indicating to me that the driver's side head runs hotter than the passenger side head.
It's just my preference to run it, a lot of people think that it doesn't do squat.
To each his own....

Edit:

I'm pretty sure that write-up that was posted was actually written years ago by Jerry Wroblowski (of "J-mod" fame).
Can anyone confirm? I am 99% sure on this.

Either way, it is good info on these motors and how the cooling system works.
According to this the rear cooling mod is more specific to the 03-04 head design. Any V8 can benefit from rear cooling crossover but in most cases this is a high performance option

Quote:
FORD KNOWLEDGEBASE OASIS 4.6 DOHC:
TSB'S MISC

Known Problems:

1.Coolant Flow (cylinder head) - 2003-2004 DOHC heads have a flawed casting and coolant flow design on the first revision of the head that causes coolant to dead end in the back of the driver side head and causes the 7 & 8 cylinders to run hotter than the others. This results in a ticking sound that occurs when the valve guides and/or seats warp due to running too hot and the ticking itself is the sound of the valves not seating correctly and tapping because of it. The problem is more prominent on the Cobra and Mach 1 due to their high performance nature and tendency to be driven hard.

This problem was also found on the 1999-2001 4.6L DOHC Mustang Cobras.

2.Dieseling Noise - Many times a dieseling noise is found to be from a loose timing gear retaining bolt. Easy fix just remove the cam cover and retighten the bolts to in/lb specs. Make sure the bolt is coated with a mild amount of teflon, but not threadlocker.

3.Oil Filter Suggestion - It is recommended that you use Motorcraft oil filters. They have a drain back valve that keeps oil from draining back to the pan when the engine is off. Most aftermarket filters do not. This prevents knocking on start up and eventual damage from it.

4.Oil Suggestion - Use only 5w20 weight oil if that's what it call's for. The tolerances are very tight in the valvetrain and any heavier of an oil can eventually cause valvetrain problems because the hydraulic components stay pumped up and never bleed down like they should when the engine is running

5.Timing Chain Tensioner - Ford Motor Company has told its dealers that 2000 through 2003 model year Ford Crown Victoria and Mercury Grand Marquis vehicles may exhibit a grinding noise from the engine timing chain area. This noise, according to Ford, may be caused by excessive wear of the timing chain tensioner arms. The tensioner arm has an aluminum base with a nylon surface. The condition can also be detected by fine nylon and or aluminum particles present in the engine oil.

Bad timing chain tensioners have been reported on other 4.6L vehicles as well.

________________

[Joe Walsh]

If the object was big enough to bend a valve it won't get past the first catalitic converter.

A BIG +1


Is there some way I can prove this to them?

You could drop the exhaust pipes behind the exhaust manifolds and visually check the first set of "pre-cats" on the driver's side to see if anything is caught on the catalytic converter's matrix.
The "foreign matter" would have to be really small to get past that matrix.

[ImpalaSlayer]

this is why i dont bother with warranties, its always BS

[Vostok]

Known issue with the design of the heads, find the TSB's quoted below and bash the warranty company

Thank you for this. If it comes to it, this is going to be the basis of my case. I already have it planned out for the most part. I'm somewhat convinced that they just used the "foreign debris" and picture of 2 little scratches they found as a BS excuse and i'm not letting them get away with it. :bs:

[1 Bad Merc]

Of course the dealership is not going to support your damaged head claim to the warranty inspector. They do not want to cover your repairs to the engine as they already have the cost of the crush damage to pay for. They are not going to argue with the insurance guy in your support because your car has already cost them alot of money and they juist want you gone. So any support from them is going to be none existent when the insurance guy shows up. Get an independant inspector and talk to a lawyer asap.

I would also seriously consider getting my car the hell out of that dealership and to a new one asap. No way would I let them work on my car...especially after what happened. These guys are just going to try and make their money back on you! Just my .02.

[F8LBITEva]

I swear A/M warranty companies arent worth a ****! Good luck man