Chicago COP's at it again!!!

[Da Dark Jedi]

I'm not going to bash ALL LEO's but I just got back from the police office from saving my brother and my wife's car. My brother was arrested at a safety check point which happens every holiday. The offense is listed below.

1) Not wearing a seat belt.
2) Not having insurance.

The second part is probably our fault since the card was in the visor. They would not let him present it. You know put your hands out the window! Five minutes before they were to impound the car me and the wife pulled up to produce a copy which I had on hand. They released the car to us but said "The driver of a vehicle within the state of Illinois must have the card in their possesion and not in the visor". I know the state requires the Ins card to be in the vehicle at all times. Well I have to show up in court to have the Driving with out Ins thrown out because the Ins is in my name, my brother will have to eat the $25.00.

The Chicago police were going to impound a insured vehicle to try an generate income for the city.

BEWARE!!!

[fastblackmerc]

Really???

So in Chicago you have to drive with your insurance card in your hand?

[Roadwarrior]

You may have to tatoo the insurance card information on yourself while driving through Chicago.

[Spectragod]

Been at this crossroads before in my life, being LEO, I have seen people talk themselves into tickets/arrest & impounding vehicles. More than once, lots of different scenarios, race or sex makes no difference. They all have the same issue, they can't keep their mouths shut. Not trying to bash all drivers, just got in from impounding a Mercedes.:D

[Da Dark Jedi]

Really???

So in Chicago you have to drive with your insurance card in your hand?


Yes I think so. I got ticketed back in September for driving a rental car with out Ins. I showed up in court with the same papers I showed the cop with more papes from my Ins for proof. The state made a comment that I had more Ins for the car then what was needed, they dismiss the case.

When I ask the arresting officer why he would not let my brother (who is 50yrs old) reach in the visor his responce was "He should have had the card in his possesion". If we did not get there in time that would have cost us $125.00 to get the car out of impound. But it makes me think that if I drive anybodys car do I need Ins card in my pocket. What happens if I or someone else fails to return the card after?

My wife with her positive mind says it could be worst.

[Da Dark Jedi]

Been at this crossroads before in my life, being LEO, I have seen people talk themselves into tickets/arrest & impounding vehicles. More than once, lots of different scenarios, race or sex makes no difference. They all have the same issue, they can't keep their mouths shut. Not trying to bash all drivers, just got in from impounding a Mercedes.:D


Oh totally agree, but over a Ins card that was in the vehicle and the visor at that? There is a particular area the CBS news did a report on that a certain officer was writing parking tickets to out on town guest. It was so bad that the area residence would park their visitors car in garages. Yes this area was Hispanic and the cop was not. CBS news caught the LEO on tape.


Being raised in a cop family we learned as kids to keep our mouths shut, so I don't think my brother was mouthing off.

[Bigdogjim]

I'm not going to bash ALL LEO's but I just got back from the police office from saving my brother and my wife's car. My brother was arrested at a safety check point which happens every holiday. The offense is listed below.

1) Not wearing a seat belt.
2) Not having insurance.

Hard to explain why the seatbealt was not in use? Red flag for sure!

[Pat]

Normally state law trumps local rules, if in this case the officer was invoking such.

Illinois vehicle code 625 ILCS chapter 5, article 6 "insurance" states that a proper insurance card must be carried "within" the vehicle and is to be presented upon request to any uniformed or badged LEO. No words about possession.

This Officer seems to be incorrect in his understanding of the Illinois insurance law.

If you want to pursue this matter go to the headquarters of the department involved and talk, on the record, with a knowlegeable official from the office of primary responsibility.

http://www.ilga.gov/legislation/ilcs/ilcs4.asp?DocName=062500050HCh %2E+7+Art%2E+VI&ActID=1815&ChapterID=49&SeqStart=97300000&SeqEnd=98500000

[Da Dark Jedi]

Hard to explain why the seatbealt was not in use? Red flag for sure!


If you would have read the entire post, he knows he'll have to pay the $25.00seatbelt fine. Thats not considered a moving violation.

So explain how a car can get impounded with the Ins card in the car. Especially when it's in the drivers visor. The state of Illinois states that a vehicle being operated in and registered in Illinois must have a Ins card in vehicle at all times. The cops would not let him produce it nor would they take 10 second lower the DS visor to get it themselves. They were sure ready to inpound it for the violation and get the $125.00 fee. I got the car but the ticket for driving without Ins was already issued. I have to show up in court just to get it thrown out, since I'm the owner.

Point is I keep the last 4 years worth of Ins cards in our cars for this. It helps prove that Ins has always been on that car (Marauder too).

[guspech750]

Well I guess we can attack Chicago right after DC during the next revolution!!


---
- Sent from my iPhone
Eaton Swap + 4.10's = Wreeeeeeeeeedom!!

[PonyUP]

I always keep my insurance forms with my drivers license, that way I have it no matter what I drive as it covers me as the driver and all vehicles I operate within that class. I figure if I drive someone else's car and get in a wreck, my I durance should be at stake.
However I agree with OP, by law the car has to be insured and proof of insurance needs to be in the car, this is just a city moneygrabbing


Pony seal of Approval

[fastblackmerc]

Yes I think so. I got ticketed back in September for driving a rental car with out Ins. I showed up in court with the same papers I showed the cop with more papes from my Ins for proof. The state made a comment that I had more Ins for the car then what was needed, they dismiss the case.

When I ask the arresting officer why he would not let my brother (who is 50yrs old) reach in the visor his responce was "He should have had the card in his possesion". If we did not get there in time that would have cost us $125.00 to get the car out of impound. But it makes me think that if I drive anybodys car do I need Ins card in my pocket. What happens if I or someone else fails to return the card after?

My wife with her positive mind says it could be worst.

If the insurance card was in his pocket, would the officer have allowed him to retrieve it?

I'd rather have someone reach for the visor than their pocket.

[Shaijack]

When I start my own country there will be NO laws like that. Another reason to move to my country.

[ImpalaSlayer]

When I start my own country there will be NO laws like that. Another reason to move to my country.


im down, just let me know where LOL

thats ridiculous the card cant be in the visor. arrested for not wearing a seat belt and no proof of ins? are you kidding me?

[Da Dark Jedi]

Back in September I had my run in CPD multiple tickets, they just issued me the tickets and I was on my way. Everything was dismiss except the speeding one (well that one to, I was fined court cost, not posted on driving record). No the LEOs here are trying to generate revenue. The other night Walter Jacobson on Chicago CBS news warned people about parking their cars within city limits, bottom line more tickets.

I'm waiting for the speed cameras to go up in 2012, from 6am till 8pm M-F (on school days). These will be posted in school zones, park areas and a few busy streets. They say 60% of the city will be speed cameras. These are not to generate revenue, but keep the citizens & kids safe.

[ImpalaSlayer]

Back in September I had my run in CPD multiple tickets, they just issued me the tickets and I was on my way. Everything was dismiss except the speeding one (well that one to, I was fined court cost, not posted on driving record). No the LEOs here are trying to generate revenue. The other night Walter Jacobson on Chicago CBS news warned people about parking their cars within city limits, bottom line more tickets.

I'm waiting for the speed cameras to go up in 2012, from 6am till 8pm M-F (on school days). These will be posted in school zones, park areas and a few busy streets. They say 60% of the city will be speed cameras. These are not to generate revenue, but keep the citizens & kids safe.

lol if it wasnt to get money, put a cop by all the schools. more effective anyway

[Da Dark Jedi]

lol if it wasnt to get money, put a cop by all the schools. more effective anyway

Can't do that, the new mayor has cut back on the police budget (by millions/yr). Cops are being reassign here the ones with desk jobs are givin' street duty. We NEED MONEY, just like every other city. The news ABC in Chicago (Cheryl Burton) said a month ago the city depends on Chicago police getting revenue. CPD generates 65% income in various tickets and traffic violations.

Now it's the money machine and they (LEOs) let the courts figure it out. Does this happen in your city???

[Bigdogjim]

If you would have read the entire post, he knows he'll have to pay the $25.00seatbelt fine. Thats not considered a moving violation.

So explain how a car can get impounded with the Ins card in the car. Especially when it's in the drivers visor. The state of Illinois states that a vehicle being operated in and registered in Illinois must have a Ins card in vehicle at all times. The cops would not let him produce it nor would they take 10 second lower the DS visor to get it themselves. They were sure ready to inpound it for the violation and get the $125.00 fee. I got the car but the ticket for driving without Ins was already issued. I have to show up in court just to get it thrown out, since I'm the owner.

Point is I keep the last 4 years worth of Ins cards in our cars for this. It helps prove that Ins has always been on that car (Marauder too).
I realy did the entire post:)

All I was getting at that if the seatbelt was in use then all nothing woul have taken place( tickets,etc). I am :flamer:anyone in your post for
what happened.

And for the record it's not just the CPD that ticket happy it all over.

[Da Dark Jedi]

Understood. But as I pointed out the seatbelt here is a non moving violation. To impound a car for no ins with the Ins papers inside the car and up to date. We've had these safety inspections that will tell you to pull over and as you to produce a Ins card. They also allow the driver to reach up or over to the glove compartment to get the Ins card. In each case the Ins card was not on the driver but within reach. Since this was not his car why would he have it in his wallet or possesion (it's in the visor).

You're right to a point. If I go to Seattle, WA and jay-walk I get the violation & pay the fine. I jay-walk here in Chicago, nobody cares. Why get arrested for a non moving violation. So what ever area of the country I go to I should keep the Ins card on me (Even if the car is not mine), therefore when I reach for my wallet I run the risk of being shot (this has happen).

Ponyup keeps his ins card in his wallet (His license probably say ATL) in Illinois if he's driving a registered car for Illinois (plates) and gets pulled over (by a safety check point) his Ins is no good for that car, should he (or anyone be arrested) go to jail.

[burt ragio]

That's what happens if it's not a butter ball turkey on turkey day.

[PonyUP]

Understood. But as I pointed out the seatbelt here is a non moving violation. To impound a car for no ins with the Ins papers inside the car and up to date. We've had these safety inspections that will tell you to pull over and as you to produce a Ins card. They also allow the driver to reach up or over to the glove compartment to get the Ins card. In each case the Ins card was not on the driver but within reach. Since this was not his car why would he have it in his wallet or possesion (it's in the visor).

You're right to a point. If I go to Seattle, WA and jay-walk I get the violation & pay the fine. I jay-walk here in Chicago, nobody cares. Why get arrested for a non moving violation. So what ever area of the country I go to I should keep the Ins card on me (Even if the car is not mine), therefore when I reach for my wallet I run the risk of being shot (this has happen).

Ponyup keeps his ins card in his wallet (His license probably say ATL) in Illinois if he's driving a registered car for Illinois (plates) and gets pulled over (by a safety check point) his Ins is no good for that car, should he (or anyone be arrested) go to jail.

Actually as long as the car is legally registered to the state with which it resides, my insurance does cover me on that car and all vehicles I operate regardless of state, however at that point the car would need to show proof that there is insurance on it as well much to your point of a safety check, I would be screwed, especially since in Chicago apparently I can't even pull it from the visor

The more I think about you situation, the more pissed I get, you get screwed


Pony seal of Approval

[Pops]

I am not buying the ins cert in the sun visor story. Seems odd that you showed up with a copy! Either the cert. was not in the car or he did not know it was in the car. Something is wrong with this story. If it was in the car they would allow you to get it! The seatbelt was what caused the stop so he was breaking the law period! That would cause all the other events. No sympathy here!!!!!

[Da Dark Jedi]

I am not buying the ins cert in the sun visor story. Seems odd that you showed up with a copy! Either the cert. was not in the car or he did not know it was in the car. Something is wrong with this story. If it was in the car they would allow you to get it! The seatbelt was what caused the stop so he was breaking the law period! That would cause all the other events. No sympathy here!!!!!


I have a copy as I pointed out that back in September I was cited for driving a rental car with out insurance. I showed the officer the rental agreement which had the price $15.50/day on it and he said it was no good. I called my Ins to get a copy directly from them which they sent along with a letter that staes that I was Insured by them with now lapse in coverage. Thats how I had the extra card.

Second here in Chicago when they set up a safety check point they randomly pull over vehicles, no matter what. So you're saying that the vehicle should be impounded even with Ins?? Two years ago I walk by three cops that pulled over some kids in their car to get to mine. I ask the female officer could I back down the street to get out (she witness me get in my car) she gave me the OK, I did. Thirty seconds later the same cops pulled me over and ask where was I going. When I told them "to the store" I was handcuffed, had a light shined in my face and was told that nobody goes the store at this time of night (9:30pm).

Since you know how we operate here in the city. You probably side with former police captin Berge, who tortured people inlock up to get their confession. Which has been overturned and the city is paying lawsuits over. I mention earlier that 3 different news station here (Fox 32, CBS 2 & ABC 7) have just did reports on our cops. But you don't "buy it" because where you live they (LEO's) may not operate that way. Go and try to get a book called "Cop Shop" it tells about one station @ 51 & Wentworth thats known for police mis-conduct. One of my uncles took alot of heat because he ordered a police chase to end. A 20yr old female with a male driving was shot by a female officer over a love triangle. The girl had a phone up to her ear. Or how 6 years ago a city police officer and his family was chase on the highway by Harvey, Il police with gun fire on the road.

I'm more upset because they were going to impound my car with Ins card in it, and once they do that it's $125.00 and no access to anything in said vehicle. My brother knows he'll pay the $25.00, it's just the method they use to generate additional revenue. I did forget to mention that back in September when I got pulled over the cop said my contract with Enterprise that states that Ins was on the rental car was also no good was because the wifes name was on it, not mine. I didn't go to jail nor was the car impounded.

[sailsmen]

Interesting in that what SpectraGod said in many cases is what I have experienced,http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=24754&highlight=speeding+9mm.
There is the occa jerk just like every where, however if the Dept has a policy of being jerks it is a big problem.

[justbob]

This is one more reason why I refuse to enter the city anymore!

This post is rated E for everyone.

[sailsmen]

In most states it is the owner that must maintain the insurance and it is also illegal to operate a vehicle that does not have insurance. Policy and the law determine wether driving with out PROOF of INSURANCE is a ticket or impounding the vehicle.
The driver is responsible for compiling with the law, as in providing proof of registration and insurance. IF I am the driver but not the owner and the plate is expired do I get a pass becasue the owner has the new tag at home?

In our area we have a corrupt and disfunctional Police Dept. Thousands were being arressted for simple municipal violations while people are being slaughtered in the streets, 15 shot on Bourbon St in one nite.

The policy was changed to issue a summons in lieu of arrest, this keeps the Police on the street.

[Da Dark Jedi]

Interesting in that what SpectraGod said in many cases is what I have experienced,http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=24754&highlight=speeding+9mm.
There is the occa jerk just like every where, however if the Dept has a policy of being jerks it is a big problem.

Exactly, I just stated what goes on here. I have too many family members that are CPD working and retired. I also have family and friens I grew up with thats Fire Chiefs and I hear their accounts. I'm not saying that all people are dis-honest, just recounting a current event that just happen. Back in the beginning of Windy City Marauders two of our members were and still is with the department on Revenue. They both mention how when big events would come to town they would be re-deployer to minority occupied areas to put boot on cars and was ordered to stay away from the loop, near north and west areas. Yes the taxpayers here are paying BIG LAWSUITS because of this.

Heck 5 yers ago a detective was caught on tape beating a female bartender because she would not serve him more drinks and his partner sat and watched. The detective claims it was SELF DEFENSE. The camera was posted above the bar and showed him coming around, his partner just sat there and watch.

[guspech750]

Just move away. Far away from Communist Chicago.


---
- Sent from my iPhone
Eaton Swap + 4.10's = Wreeeeeeeeeedom!!

[Da Dark Jedi]

Just move away. Far away from Communist Chicago.


---
- Sent from my iPhone
Eaton Swap + 4.10's = Wreeeeeeeeeedom!!


You're right... The wifes and alot of my family has left. The ones the work for the city just is waiting to retire so they can move out. But you know the law here, if your CPD or CFD you MUST RESIDE in Chicago. It's difficult to give up your home land (for me).

The wife did ask the officer why he would not let my brother get the Ins card from the visor his response "And risk getting shot, you got your car ". The question was ask why could you not get it then? the response "It's not my job". I did find out that earlier (4 hrs) across town a female office was hit several times in the face and had to kill the assailent. Maybe the LEO was in fear?

[sailsmen]

A Police Dept is a direct reflection of the Community. Corrupt Community = Corrupt Police Dept.

[Pops]

All I have to add to this is follow the law!

[rayjay]

I am not buying the ins cert in the sun visor story. Seems odd that you showed up with a copy! Either the cert. was not in the car or he did not know it was in the car. Something is wrong with this story. If it was in the car they would allow you to get it! The seatbelt was what caused the stop so he was breaking the law period! That would cause all the other events. No sympathy here!!!!!

I agree with Pops. I never in 34 years denied someone, on a routine stop, to look for their paperwork. I know for a fact that governments are using LEOs as revenue generators, but this seems really extreem. How did you know to bring the other card to the check point? :confused:

[Da Dark Jedi]

I agree with Pops. I never in 34 years denied someone, on a routine stop, to look for their paperwork. I know for a fact that governments are using LEOs as revenue generators, but this seems really extreem. How did you know to bring the other card to the check point? :confused:

I didn't bring it to the check point. I brought it to the station, thats where he called from. I explain why I had an extra card in a previous post. I'm not impling that ALL LEOs are this way, I still find it strange.

[knine]

24 years experience, 8 1/2 in traffic, I've never seen someone not allowed to produce an insurance card. What I have seen is a lot of people with attitudes and they think they can tell the police how to do their job, that never ends good for that person.

To clarify a lot of mistakes: A seatbelt ticket is no longer $25.00, the owner does not have to show in court becasue they were not written the ticket (the ticketed person does), and the maximum impound fee in illinois is 500.00, so if Chicago is not trying to raise revenue by towing cars by only charging 125.00, and finally, the street officer could care less about raising revenue.

Reassignments from "desk" duty was done by the Mayor to reduce staffing shortages (I know because it was in the Tribune, on WLS and they interviewed the Mayor on the radio), not to raise revenue. I can tell you that persons reassigned from their picked or preferred jobs aren't in the "team spirit" and are not producers.

Finally, "random" checks where they "pick out whoever they want" are no longer allowed by law. They have to be posted with warning signs (portable) of a roadside saftey check ahead and / or seatblet check ahead signs. Bottom line, not only should people obey the law and show concern for their own safety and wear seatbelts (especially when going into a safety check) but they should keep their attitudes in check. This story reeks of one-sided, NON WITNESSED opinions, implausable "facts" and I offer no sympathy either. Continue ranting about hating cops and the next time you (or your brother) needs police services (i.e., accident report, theft report, etc), don't call them since you hate them so much -or- take some time to calm down ("I just got back from......")before immediately bashing before you sort thru the b.s. Can't tell you the number of times related people say "not my kid/brother/sister/etc" when the evidence is right in front of them.

"BEWARE!!" Really? Beware of uninformed and half baked opinions maybe. Seriously, you really show your jaundiced opinion in that post.

[rayjay]

I didn't bring it to the check point. I brought it to the station, thats where he called from. I explain why I had an extra card in a previous post. I'm not impling that ALL LEOs are this way, I still find it strange.

He was brought in to the station for being uninsured and driving w/out a seatbelt? Thats highly unusual. Even though I wasn't a road warrior most of my career, I still worked the road everyday. In my agency I would have been on my Member's behind for bringing someone to the station for seemingly minor VTL offenses. What you are descibing is a in custody arrest. Is that SOP in Chicago for VTL violations?

[4drcbra]

being a leo, there is always 2 sides to a story. Ya know kinda like we "give out" dui's.

[Da Dark Jedi]

24 years experience, 8 1/2 in traffic, I've never seen someone not allowed to produce an insurance card. What I have seen is a lot of people with attitudes and they think they can tell the police how to do their job, that never ends good for that person.

To clarify a lot of mistakes: A seatbelt ticket is no longer $25.00, the owner does not have to show in court becasue they were not written the ticket (the ticketed person does), and the maximum impound fee in illinois is 500.00, so if Chicago is not trying to raise revenue by towing cars by only charging 125.00, and finally, the street officer could care less about raising revenue.

Reassignments from "desk" duty was done by the Mayor to reduce staffing shortages (I know because it was in the Tribune, on WLS and they interviewed the Mayor on the radio), not to raise revenue. I can tell you that persons reassigned from their picked or preferred jobs aren't in the "team spirit" and are not producers.

Finally, "random" checks where they "pick out whoever they want" are no longer allowed by law. They have to be posted with warning signs (portable) of a roadside saftey check ahead and / or seatblet check ahead signs. Bottom line, not only should people obey the law and show concern for their own safety and wear seatbelts (especially when going into a safety check) but they should keep their attitudes in check. This story reeks of one-sided, NON WITNESSED opinions, implausable "facts" and I offer no sympathy either. Continue ranting about hating cops and the next time you (or your brother) needs police services (i.e., accident report, theft report, etc), don't call them since you hate them so much -or- take some time to calm down ("I just got back from......")before immediately bashing before you sort thru the b.s. Can't tell you the number of times related people say "not my kid/brother/sister/etc" when the evidence is right in front of them.

"BEWARE!!" Really? Beware of uninformed and half baked opinions maybe. Seriously, you really show your jaundiced opinion in that post.


OK... I called the police station and ask them about what you just mention. They're response was that CPD DOES NOT HAVE TO POST ROADSIDE CHECK POINT SIGNS and they CAN PULL CARS RANDOMLY! And since you are not a police officer for Chicago you don't know Chicago procedure and to mind your own business". This was from the desk Sargent.

Second who was ranting about hating police. Nowhere was there a rant of such.

I know I'm lying about this. I just got of the phone with them!

Now I have all board members who are LEOs saying I'm wrong! So Knine should I tell them that you do know CPD procedures and you are from Chicago?

[TAKEDOWN]

Well I guess we can attack Chicago right after DC during the next revolution!!


---
- Sent from my iPhone
Eaton Swap + 4.10's = Wreeeeeeeeeedom!!



YES! Let's burn this city down!!!

[Da Dark Jedi]

I'm still waiting for Knine to respond. I called the station where everything took place, when he posted his comment. I posted the response I got from the desk Sargent himself. Maybe other LEOs here can post how I did not call or the response I got was wrong, because they are LEOs just not on CPD.

For any of you that believes what Knine has posted about it's the LAW about roadside safety check points has to have signs posted before said check point. PLEASE call any district station here in Chicago and ask them. For those in Chicago dail 311 ask for non emergency police.

Therefore you can get pulled by roadside check points here, even to make sure that you do have Ins or you have a valid DL. You're not breaking any laws and neither is CPD, thats why it exists here in Chicago. Remember I said it was a roadside safety check point that he ran into. But its nice to know every LEO knows Chicago police procedure.

[rayjay]

Ya know kinda like we "give out" dui's.

For free? :D :neener:

Jedi, I was involved with managing many check points. Where I worked in NYS we did not have to post signs, but it was obvious we there and what we were doing. Heck we even handed out prizes for wearing your belt.... :rolleyes:

[71cyclone]

City Officer Turned Dept of Corrections ?? [ Or is it VICE- VERSA ] There is a difference !

[CBT]

Can't do that, the new mayor has cut back on the police budget (by millions/yr). Cops are being reassign here the ones with desk jobs are givin' street duty. We NEED MONEY, just like every other city. The news ABC in Chicago (Cheryl Burton) said a month ago the city depends on Chicago police getting revenue. CPD generates 65% income in various tickets and traffic violations.

Now it's the money machine and they (LEOs) let the courts figure it out. Does this happen in your city???

Nope. Cop pulls ME over, HE gets off with a warning. That's how the CBT rolls.

[Pops]

Nope. Cop pulls ME over, HE gets off with a warning. That's how the CBT rolls.

:hmmm::wflag::loco::whistle::u p::trophy1:

[Da Dark Jedi]

For free? :D :neener:

Jedi, I was involved with managing many check points. Where I worked in NYS we did not have to post signs, :rolleyes:


Well Knine says differently, read his post. So I called the district that it happen in and posted their response. At 5:30am, I did ask how it went down and it was not obvious. Even if I post it, there are those that will say its a lie. Rayjay I'm not questioning what goes down in other cities but when I say what happens in mine, I'm wrong. Here they wear their black uniforms or some in light blues and the marked cars are out of sight, you stop at a light or stop sign they walk up shine the light tell you to pull over, randomly. I have seen some with lights flashing and all. It's just whose district your in on how they conduct it.

My point is why impound the car when Insurance is there. People say why do I have a extra card, because it happen to me, thats why.

[CBT]

Well Knine says differently, read his post. So I called the district that it happen in and posted their response. At 5:30am, I did ask how it went down and it was not obvious. Even if I post it, there are those that will say its a lie. Rayjay I'm not questioning what goes down in other cities but when I say what happens in mine, I'm wrong. Here they wear their black uniforms or some in light blues and the marked cars are out of sight, you stop at a light or stop sign they walk up shine the light tell you to pull over, randomly. I have seen some with lights flashing and all. It's just whose district your in on how they conduct it.

My point is why impound the car when Insurance is there. People say why do I have a extra card, because it happen to me, thats why.

If someone runs up to my car at an intersection and shines a flashlight in my face and yells pull over, I'm not sure how I'd react.

[rayjay]

If someone runs up to my car at an intersection and shines a flashlight in my face and yells pull over, I'm not sure how I'd react.

Uhm, they better have a uniform I recognize on or it will go bad in a hurry.

[Da Dark Jedi]

Rayjay I just called him and ask how it went down. To keep it short he said... "coming around the turn on Ewing Av right before the stop sign, he sees a person bending over talking to somwone in a car, not a blue & white. He sees a tall figure on the northbound side (both dress in dark clothes). He comes to the stop sign and the person to his right turns to him and has a flash light shining in the car. Thats when he notice the badge, the figure in the NB lane comes over and hits the hood with his fist and tells him to pull over. No lights or signs to say anything". Now all this is happening at 5:30am Thursday and he was the only car out there. When he pulled over he did as instructed, got out the car. He produced his DL, thats when he states they ask for Ins, he said in the visor. The lowered the first one and said no Ins. Thats when they handcuffed him and off to jail. The wifes Q45 has a double visor the first is a vanity type and the second visor was where the card was. He did mention that they had a woman also on the other side. The cars that was there was dark CV.

[MOTOWN]

24 years experience, 8 1/2 in traffic, I've never seen someone not allowed to produce an insurance card. What I have seen is a lot of people with attitudes and they think they can tell the police how to do their job, that never ends good for that person.

To clarify a lot of mistakes: A seatbelt ticket is no longer $25.00, the owner does not have to show in court becasue they were not written the ticket (the ticketed person does), and the maximum impound fee in illinois is 500.00, so if Chicago is not trying to raise revenue by towing cars by only charging 125.00, and finally, the street officer could care less about raising revenue.

Reassignments from "desk" duty was done by the Mayor to reduce staffing shortages (I know because it was in the Tribune, on WLS and they interviewed the Mayor on the radio), not to raise revenue. I can tell you that persons reassigned from their picked or preferred jobs aren't in the "team spirit" and are not producers.

Finally, "random" checks where they "pick out whoever they want" are no longer allowed by law. They have to be posted with warning signs (portable) of a roadside saftey check ahead and / or seatblet check ahead signs. Bottom line, not only should people obey the law and show concern for their own safety and wear seatbelts (especially when going into a safety check) but they should keep their attitudes in check. This story reeks of one-sided, NON WITNESSED opinions, implausable "facts" and I offer no sympathy either. Continue ranting about hating cops and the next time you (or your brother) needs police services (i.e., accident report, theft report, etc), don't call them since you hate them so much -or- take some time to calm down ("I just got back from......")before immediately bashing before you sort thru the b.s. Can't tell you the number of times related people say "not my kid/brother/sister/etc" when the evidence is right in front of them.

"BEWARE!!" Really? Beware of uninformed and half baked opinions maybe. Seriously, you really show your jaundiced opinion in that post.

Very well said bro! i agree 100,000%:bows:

[rayjay]

Rayjay I just called him and ask how it went down. To keep it short he said... "coming around the turn on Ewing Av right before the stop sign, he sees a person bending over talking to somwone in a car, not a blue & white. He sees a tall figure on the northbound side (both dress in dark clothes). He comes to the stop sign and the person to his right turns to him and has a flash light shining in the car. Thats when he notice the badge, the figure in the NB lane comes over and hits the hood with his fist and tells him to pull over. No lights or signs to say anything". Now all this is happening at 5:30am Thursday and he was the only car out there. When he pulled over he did as instructed, got out the car. He produced his DL, thats when he states they ask for Ins, he said in the visor. The lowered the first one and said no Ins. Thats when they handcuffed him and off to jail. The wifes Q45 has a double visor the first is a vanity type and the second visor was where the card was. He did mention that they had a woman also on the other side. The cars that was there was dark CV.


Jedi, my cop radar tells me there is something he is not telling you. VTL pinches for violation grade driving infractions are not supposed to be incustody arrests by case law, at least not in NYS. Maybe IL is different. At one time driving without insurance in NYS was a misdemeanor.
Its your kin, I believe I'd get to the bottom of the truth since you are involved with the insurance and it may land somehow in your lap. I hate to see you get wazzued by the insurance co if you had nothing to do with the complaint.
That said, late night/very early morning encounters with people have a tendency to go bad in a hurry, so I was always more on guard, my 6th sense on high and a little less nice for that reason. You learn to operate this way as a good percentage of the motoring public is not generally up doing good deeds for others at 0530hrs. Some of the worse things I ever dealt with happened near that time. :(

It is extreemly difficult to critique what someone did, being three states removed. Urban vs rural area, well sort of rural :rolleyes: Is getting stopped a hassle, yes. Are there good/honest police men and women out there, of course, the vast majority. Do they get pissed off from time to time and do something wrong, yes. However, its miniscule compared to the vast majority of LEOs out there.

I don't know, maybe they were looking for someone that looked like your family member, maybe they had just come from a horrible scene where a poor child was the victim. and Finally there are bad apples in every profession.

I wasn't there and won't pass judgement on another Member. I absolutely hated being stuck with IA... :censor:

[knine]

I'm still waiting for Knine to respond.......Sorry, I have a life, but here ya' go:



Now I have all board members who are LEOs saying I'm wrong! So Knine should I tell them that you do know CPD procedures and you are from Chicago?

No smart@ ss, tell them I know Illinois case law and know how to access their public website.

In People v. Bartley the Illinois Supreme Court addressed the constitutionality of roadblock stops to stop DUI drivers. People v. Bartley (1985). In Bartley, the court held that a temporary roadblock to check driver's licenses and to identify DUI offenders did not violate the fourth amendment (that's the one about unreasonable search and seizure and expectation to privacy) because the State had a compelling interest (that means the State has to have a method for determining the constitutionality of a statute when restricting a right of an individual, such as roadblocks) in reducing alcohol-related accidents which outweighed the minimal intrusion on motorists. The court set out certain factors to be considered in determining the constitutionality of the intrusion caused by such roadblocks (that means these things have to be in place for it to be legal), including (means at least ALL, not just one or two):

(1) the presence of procedural guidelines (Policy and procedures);
(2) the absence of discretion in individual field officers (meaning they CANNOT PULL CARS AT RANDOM);
(3) some indication to the public of the official nature of the operation (signs or other public notification. Chicago PD also advertises their roadside safety checks on their public site, check this one out it currently has THREE, maybe the one your brother got stopped at?: https://portal.chicagopolice.org/portal/page/portal/ClearPath/News/Press%20Releases (https://portal.chicagopolice.org/portal/page/portal/ClearPath/News/Press%20Releases) ); and
(4) selection of the site by supervisory personnel (bosses like me that have to know this shat).


This decision was handed down from a challenge where a subject (Bartley) was flagged into a check for seatbelt check. He was not wearing a seatbelt and was subsequently cited. Further investigation revealed he was driving under the influence resulting in his arrest. Bartley challenged the arrest all the way to the Illinois Supreme Court where the above limitations were set forth. As long as Chicago and Cook county are in the State of Illinois, this court decision applies. Similar states have had similar rulings thru different challenges. In case your brother wants to do any traveling, here is a link to all 50 states and the District of Columbia (that's Washington D.C.), their decisions and whether they allow checkpoints: http://www.iihs.org/laws/checkpoints.html (http://www.iihs.org/laws/checkpoints.html) .
...and here's a list of states that require seatbelts: http://www.ghsa.org/html/stateinfo/laws/seatbelt_laws.html Any Illinois roadside safety checks must be publicly posted and drivers advised. I have personally participated, scheduled and supervised such.


If you wish to pursue this, rather than call a station and get into a pissing match with an uninformed desk Sergeant*, I would suggest you either contact their legal department and ask what their policy says in reference to Bartley Roadside safety checks is, contact the Traffic Division and ask same or just tell your brother to put the damn thing on.


I'd love to argue Illinois case law with you, but explaining it in laymans terms (that's the general public and at an eighth grade level) makes my head hurt so I'll just say: You're welcome and apology accepted. E.


P.S., tell your brother to drive with the insurance card in his teeth so the cops will see it.... *and Sergeant isn't spelled Sargent.

For future reference, here's what some of those signs look like below. I'm guessing he blew by the last one and didn't notice. Police get it all the time: "what sign?".

[Bigdogjim]

Spot on! :up:

This whole mess because a driver was not paying attention to check point signs and was not using a seat belt?

I posted before that is if the seat belt was in use the Police would have waved the vehicle on.

In New Jersey and Pa. I go through these check point (Safety stops) a lot and never had an issue.

[Da Dark Jedi]

Knine, thanks for the info. I did look up the site that you linked to and there was no mention of dist 004 for a check point, for that day (Nov 25 @5:30am). He admitted that he wasn't wearing a seatbelt ($25.00). The second citition would be driving without Ins which again like I said was in the car. So all the issues that you're making a case for has been said. Now what's in the books and what happen is different. The wife & I had to drive to the station with proof of Ins to get her car, as I stated was in the visor. There was no other citition issued but those two. If the Sergeant at the desk is not informed does it not make what happened wrong? Can people in Chicago who do get stop at a safety check point use non posting of signs as a defense in court?

Once again I'm not arguing the seatbelt, just the driving without Ins with it in the vehicle. When I got the card out of the car I give it to the arresting officer his response was "you got the car back so whats the difference". The extra copy the wife had in the station, so no smoke and mirrors or con game. So if it weren't a check point he was told to pull over which he did. These guys were in dark grey shirts with black sweaters, no marked cars (white with blue strip) just CVs. I seen the arresting officers in these clothes. You're right his word against a cops word @5:30am on Thanksgiving day, no witness, police right all the time.


https://portal.chicagopolice.org/portal/page/portal/ClearPath/News/Press%20Releases

Not listed for district 004 for that date and time.

[knine]

No public notice, albiet press release or signs, and they said it was a "checkpoint", then he has an valid issue that needs addressed. What you describe is nothing better than a roving gang of thugs and there are avenues for addressing that type of behavior thru the department. Me thinks he should make an inquiry into such.

If, however, it was just a couple of cars, no-one outside the cars directing people over to a predetermined site, a.k.a. "wolfpacking", then he's S.O.L.

1-855-lawshow on WLS 890am right now is a good place to get answers, or go to www.thelawshow.com (http://www.thelawshow.com)

[CBT]

.......Sorry, I have a life, but here ya' go:



No smart@ ss, tell them I know Illinois case law and know how to access their public website.

In People v. Bartley the Illinois Supreme Court addressed the constitutionality of roadblock stops to stop DUI drivers. People v. Bartley (1985). In Bartley, the court held that a temporary roadblock to check driver's licenses and to identify DUI offenders did not violate the fourth amendment (that's the one about unreasonable search and seizure and expectation to privacy) because the State had a compelling interest (that means the State has to have a method for determining the constitutionality of a statute when restricting a right of an individual, such as roadblocks) in reducing alcohol-related accidents which outweighed the minimal intrusion on motorists. The court set out certain factors to be considered in determining the constitutionality of the intrusion caused by such roadblocks (that means these things have to be in place for it to be legal), including (means at least ALL, not just one or two):

(1) the presence of procedural guidelines (Policy and procedures);
(2) the absence of discretion in individual field officers (meaning they CANNOT PULL CARS AT RANDOM);
(3) some indication to the public of the official nature of the operation (signs or other public notification. Chicago PD also advertises their roadside safety checks on their public site, check this one out it currently has THREE, maybe the one your brother got stopped at?: https://portal.chicagopolice.org/portal/page/portal/ClearPath/News/Press%20Releases (https://portal.chicagopolice.org/portal/page/portal/ClearPath/News/Press%20Releases) ); and
(4) selection of the site by supervisory personnel (bosses like me that have to know this shat).


This decision was handed down from a challenge where a subject (Bartley) was flagged into a check for seatbelt check. He was not wearing a seatbelt and was subsequently cited. Further investigation revealed he was driving under the influence resulting in his arrest. Bartley challenged the arrest all the way to the Illinois Supreme Court where the above limitations were set forth. As long as Chicago and Cook county are in the State of Illinois, this court decision applies. Similar states have had similar rulings thru different challenges. In case your brother wants to do any traveling, here is a link to all 50 states and the District of Columbia (that's Washington D.C.), their decisions and whether they allow checkpoints: http://www.iihs.org/laws/checkpoints.html (http://www.iihs.org/laws/checkpoints.html) .
...and here's a list of states that require seatbelts: http://www.ghsa.org/html/stateinfo/laws/seatbelt_laws.html Any Illinois roadside safety checks must be publicly posted and drivers advised. I have personally participated, scheduled and supervised such.


If you wish to pursue this, rather than call a station and get into a pissing match with an uninformed desk Sergeant*, I would suggest you either contact their legal department and ask what their policy says in reference to Bartley Roadside safety checks is, contact the Traffic Division and ask same or just tell your brother to put the damn thing on.


I'd love to argue Illinois case law with you, but explaining it in laymans terms (that's the general public and at an eighth grade level) makes my head hurt so I'll just say: You're welcome and apology accepted. E.


P.S., tell your brother to drive with the insurance card in his teeth so the cops will see it.... *and Sergeant isn't spelled Sargent.

For future reference, here's what some of those signs look like below. I'm guessing he blew by the last one and didn't notice. Police get it all the time: "what sign?".

Post of the year award !! :trophy1:



Jedi retorts with:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2YgZX9Thm0

[knine]

Post of the year award !! :trophy1:



Jedi retorts with:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2YgZX9Thm0
Thanks, I think I blew my cerebellum writing that. With my elbows on the desk, I definitely scratched my weenus (it's not dirty, look it up, geeze). Just don't ask me for an opinion on Chew vs. Gates.

Please remember to visit: www.knine.net (http://www.knine.net)


:lol: at Jedi retort. Love it !! Hmmmm, theme music ???

[1 Bad Merc]

That's funny -the last 3 checks I went through in different Cook County,Illinois suburbs -the police just blocked the road off and waived people over -I think it was every 3rd car. Never saw a roadblock sign or safety check sign ever posted. Their was traffic cones set up and a couple of officers with flares flagging people over. They also had a portable RV command center and a short bus where they were processing people and taking them to jail. Had two tow trucks sitting their ready to go too.

99% of the public does not know this law exists and figures the police officers are always right and would not be doing anything illegal. Because of this they dont hire lawyers to fight it. They just pay the $25 ticket and go on there way.

[Da Dark Jedi]

Just got in from 71 & Cottege Gr. police station ask the same question as I did with the 10300 S. Luella police station. Their response was "Yes it's the law but not every district does post signs, it's up to them". Then I was ask "are you from Chicago" yes, "then you know how it's played". So 10300 S. Luella states that "they don't have to", and this is where it took place. The station at 71 S. Cottage Gr. said "yes it's the law but it depends on the district". I was also warned that "if you try and fight it in court you'll lose and pay for the courts time" this statement was from the 71 & Cottage Gr. station. Both persons were desk Sergeants.

This is what I mean by CPD, what may be in the law books does not mean that it's applied on the streets.

[Da Dark Jedi]

That's funny -the last 3 checks I went through in different Cook County,Illinois suburbs -the police just blocked the road off and waived people over -I think it was every 3rd car. Never saw a roadblock sign or safety check sign ever posted. Their was traffic cones set up and a couple of officers with flares flagging people over. They also had a portable RV command center and a short bus where they were processing people and taking them to jail. Had two tow trucks sitting their ready to go too.

99% of the public does not know this law exists and figures the police officers are always right and would not be doing anything illegal. Because of this they dont hire lawyers to fight it. They just pay the $25 ticket and go on there way.


Interesting that you brought this up (Thanks) but the $25.00 fee doesn't apply for Chicago. It may work for other counties in Illinois, but not in Chicago. I ask what was the fine, they think $100 - $125 when I showed them the link that Knine supplied, they almost laugh me out the station, "don't beleive that internet s***". Below is the link I printed from.

http://www.ghsa.org/html/stateinfo/laws/seatbelt_laws.html

It was suggested that "if I won't fair, move to the burbs".

Hey 1BadMerc, you mean to say that you blew by a posted safety check point sign. Don't they post where you live? "Never saw a roadblock sign or safety check sign ever posted". Just kidding guy.

[CBT]

I would fight it, who do they think they are enforcing the law? Crazy surprise safety checks surprising people, wtf?!

[guspech750]

I'd say drive your car through the stations front door. At least then you will have broken a real law.


---
- Sent from my iPhone
Eaton Swap + 4.10's = Wreeeeeeeeeedom!!

[TAKEDOWN]

^^^... YES and burn the city down, while declaring Marshall law!

[guspech750]

^^^... YES and burn the city down, while declaring Marshall law!

Now your talking!! And run naked screaming daddy!! While eating cup cakes and drinking unfiltered urinal water!!


---
- Sent from my iPhone
Eaton Swap + 4.10's = Wreeeeeeeeeedom!!

[TAKEDOWN]

Leon, just don't use your MARAUDER when doing this... Thank you!

[Da Dark Jedi]

Before I went to the station I started it up. Haven't driven it since last we met, back in September.

[1 Bad Merc]

Hey -the police love me- I always bring them the good Marconi Italian Bread!!!!!

[rayjay]

Note to self, do not move to Illinois, especially Chicago.

[TAKEDOWN]

You mean *****cago!