Financial Collapse???

[sailsmen]

Don't worry, although the USA has guarranteed to buy an unlimited amount of EUORS for dollars the ECB has promissed to pay us back in EUROS!

'Beware a rerun of the Great Panic of 2008': Head of World Bank warns Europe is heading for 'danger zone' as world markets suffer bleakest day of the year so far

•Robert Zoellick: 'Far from clear leaders ready for impending catastrophe'
•Raft of dismal news from around world wreaked havoc on market
•Manufacturing output crashed in Britain, jobless up in Europe and U.S.
•Fast-emerging economies such as Brazil and China running out of steam

By Hugo Duncan

PUBLISHED: 10:49 EST, 1 June 2012 | UPDATED: 17:52 EST, 1 June 2012

Warning: Robert Zoellick said Europe is heading to the 'danger zone'

The head of the World Bank yesterday warned that financial markets face a rerun of the Great Panic of 2008.

On the bleakest day for the global economy this year, Robert Zoellick said crisis-torn Europe was heading for the ‘danger zone’.



Time Bomb? Banks Pressured to Buy Government Debt

Published: Thursday, 31 May 2012 | 2:42 PM ET
By: Jeff Cox
CNBC.com Senior Writer
US and European regulators are essentially forcing banks to buy up their own government's debt—a move that could end up making the debt crisis even worse, a Citigroup analysis says.

Regulators are allowing banks to escape counting their country's debt against capital requirements and loosening other rules to create a steady market for government bonds, the study says.

While that helps governments issue more and more debt, the strategy could ultimately explode if the governments are unable to make the bond payments, leaving the banks with billions of toxic debt, says Citigroup strategist Hans Lorenzen.

"Captive bank demand can buy time and can help keep domestic yields low," Lorenzen wrote in an analysis for clients. "However, the distortions that build up over time can sow the seeds of an even bigger crisis, if the time bought isn't used very prudently."

"Specifically," Lorenzen adds, "having banks loaded up with domestic sovereign debt will only increase the domestic fallout if the sovereign ultimately reneges on its obligations."

The banks, though, are caught in a "great repression" trap from which they cannot escape.

[Shaijack]

Buy guns and ammo.

[PonyUP]

This may help Sailsmen

http://wwwdotcom.com/



Pony seal of Approval

[sailsmen]

Almost as good as
http://youtu.be/ls2lC7DQFMI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-l-AxZIdq4E&feature=related

[kernie]

This may help Sailsmen

http://wwwdotcom.com/



Pony seal of Approval


Ha! Post of the year! The message is right on, you could spend forever posting\thinking gloomy stuff then wake up 20 years later and you are still there, comfy and well fed.

Enjoy your time peeps! Off to a fastball tourney.

:beer::beer:

[fastblackmerc]

The sky is falling!

The sky is falling!

Says Chicken Little.

[burt ragio]

Amazing how countries could borrow to the point of no return. Can no one keep a check book in balance. Even more amazing how banks would continue to lend. This financial crisis has already effected the world market. Save your pennies the repercussions will soon trickle in. The Mac Donalds effect in reverse.

[Ozark Marauder]

If you still have those silver dollars your Grandpa gave you every now and then, you would be surprised how much those are worth. I was......

OZ

[sailsmen]

How can a Society support people working for 38 years and not working for 40 years?

AVERAGE RETIREMENT AGES IN EUROPE Sourced by Eurostat from 2007 in a 2009 paper
Country Average retirement age State pension age
France 59.4 60
Greece 60 65 (m) 60 (w)
Italy 60.4 65 (m) 60 (w)
Germany 62 65
Spain 62.1 65
Portugal 62.6 65
UK 62.6 65 (m) 60 (w)
Netherlands 63.9 65
Ireland 64.1 66
Norway 64.4 62

Read more: http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/pensions/article-1696682/Rising-retirement-ages-in-Europe-compared.html#ixzz1weLlEDA3

[sailsmen]

In 2009 the money supply in the USA was increased 110%, 11 times greater than ever before.
The Fed Reserve "loaned" to Fed Chartered Banks, i.e. National banks, at no terms large sums of money. The Banks in turn bought USA Gov't Debt with this money, in effect financing our Gov't spending.
The interest that the Gov't pays the Banks on this Debt is the only real money. This is what the income tax payer gets to pay.
The Fed Reserve also pumped up the stock market by printing money, i.e. Quantitative Easing.
What does all this mean? The value of a currency is it's percieved value. What the people who have the currency think it is worth.
The USA is in an unknown area as respects the Debt/Money Supply etc. The egg heads don't know where the collapsing point is for there is no historical reference.
What does this mean? We will not know the collpase has happened until after it has happened.;)

[tbone]

The message is right on, you could spend forever posting\thinking gloomy stuff then wake up 20 years later and you are still there, comfy and well fed.



Really? That's what the Greeks thought.

And the Romans.

And stockbrokers in 1929...............

[BODYMAN]

To sit & read all the (as I say) Oh crap news regarding The world economy & the financial state of America & Europe as well as others, Just amazes me considering the writing has been on the wall for more then a decade, I used to rant & rave & warned my family & friends of the impending doom back in the late 90's Funny thing is back then Many friends would sluff me off & laugh call me crazy or make the statement This is America Dude. Yea one of the youngest nations in the world, not to mention the debt burden we will never be able to reconcile. The only thing I get joy out of in this whole mess is telling friends I told ya so. You think these rich politicians weren't taking note of upcoming problems? Nah they just bought all these small islands, Large Estates with large bunkers underground & all 50acres fenced & barbed just for the heck of it?

[sailsmen]

Ross Perrot with his graphs and white boards made everyone aware.:)

What's bizzare is the fixes are simple and painless, but we have already passed the point of a few minor tweaks and the snowball is getting bigger.

I have worked for businesses that had growth every year. It was easy for the owners. In several cases I told them what the future held and why, how we could make some adjustments now.

None said I was wrong or disagreed and none made adjustments until they were forced to resulting in unnecessary suffering for them and their employees.

To think that keeping spending levels current, after increasing by over 29% since 2009 and doubling since 2001, is not even a viable concept is quite disturbing. Who amoung us could not make and spend the same amount of money for 7 years if their financial solvency depended on it?

[FX1]

Keep spreading the word sailsmen i wish more people would buy it. I mean listen and relize whats happening in the world. But most of it is right infront of them and easy to learn and research. Keep up the good work. And remember the ones that wont listen are the ones that say "Never talk politics in a bar" Or on this Site" Why is something thats affecting mankind something we should'nt talk about?

[kernie]

Really? That's what the Greeks thought.

And the Romans.

And stockbrokers in 1929...............


You are forgetting the Cuban missle crisis, the energy crisis in the 70's, black monday 1989, Y2K, 9\11, W :eek:, banking housing crisis, the mayan calendar ending us all soon...

This too shall pass, with or without pain, put away the ammo, who ya gonna shoot anyway? LOL.

:beer:

[tbone]

Go ahead and bury your head in the sand. That's the democratic way. This isn't going away if we continue with the policies of the current "leaders". The Soviet Union ceased to exist due to bankruptcy. The USA is not immune to it and is heading towards it with ever increasing speed.

[kernie]

Go ahead and bury your head in the sand. That's the democratic way. This isn't going away if we continue with the policies of the current "leaders". The Soviet Union ceased to exist due to bankruptcy. The USA is not immune to it and is heading towards it with ever increasing speed.


And the other way is constant fear-mongering.

Be cool. Enjoy the day.

:beer:

[tbone]

Conservatives just state the facts. I know they can be inconvenient because emotions rule liberals way of thinking.

How can this not bother someone who understands that there is a limit on the national credit card?

http://www.usdebtclock.org/

http://www.usdebtclock.org/world-debt-clock.html

[MrBluGruv]

You are forgetting the Cuban missle crisis, the energy crisis in the 70's, black monday 1989, Y2K, 9\11, W :eek:, banking housing crisis, the mayan calendar ending us all soon...

This too shall pass, with or without pain, put away the ammo, who ya gonna shoot anyway? LOL.

:beer:

lol, as much as I'm not thrilled about the way this particular economic crisis is looking, there is just too much truth to this to ignore.

Maybe THIS is the reason life expectancy isn't as great as it should be; people fret themselves into an early grave. :P

[tbone]

News Alert: Cuban missile crisis, energy crisis, Y2K, 9/11, Bush and the Mayan calendar have absolutely nothing to do with our probable financial collapse. Really, is this the best argument you can muster?

[tbone]

I have an idea. Why don't you guys go out and get all the credit cards you possibly can and rack them up to the maximum possible. Then buy a brand new car or two and a huge house. Finally, quit your job and report back on how your life is going in a couple months.:flamer:

That's how our government operates.

[sailsmen]

What some do not understand is when the USA collapses financially, CANADA will collpase with us, the despots of the World will rise up. Only this time they will have Nucs.
The only question is will the financial collapse happen so soon that they have not yet aquired an effective delivery system? (This is one reason to relect so aas to accelerate the financial collapse.)

Either way WW will ensue.

All of this is because greedy politicians do not want to cede power back to the people.

Tens of millions will die needlessly.

[PonyUP]

I hate to say it, but I agree with Kernie. Every so often throughout history we face this, and will overcome

All the talk of nuclear holocaust and a post apocalyptic world is ridiculous

Are things bad? Sure. But they aren't bad for everyone. Life is cyclical as is this. We will overcome it like anything else. In other words chicken little, the sky isn't falling

And for all those idiots out there that think a simple change of President will fix it, I got news for you it won't. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.

The only way to effect change is an honest discussion of ideas from those who truly want the change. We can't even do that on this frickin board, so what makes you think Washington can

While all of you are stock piling guns, ammo and food, I'll be out living my life. If the collapse happens and nukes run wild, it's not a world I'll be alive for, but I will have enjoyed my life while I was hear, and refuse to live in fear


Pony seal of Approval

[sailsmen]

Unfortunately real life experience has taught me to be prepared. Pony, had you spent 15 minutes down here after Katrina you would have a different mindset.
Going thru a check point consisting of teen agers with shotguns to get in the subdivision.
Having to approach a Humvee with a manned M60 to get permission to pass while military helicopters fly overhead.
Covering your relative while he wades in chest deep water to retrieve computers to make payroll for the disabled.
Literally giving a man the shirt off your back and your water supply because his desperation is greater than yours.
Guarding your van with a pistol in each hand and one between the legs while the armed group you are with checks their homes.
Seeing the signs and hearing the sounds of anarchy all around you.
When resources are stretched there is a fine line between civilization and anarchy.
For the deniers, listen to Brian Williams interview 5 years latter, particularly the 7 minute mark, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=asYWzCHNQKs
My grandmother, my 2 uncles, aunt and 3 cousins got out in the CNN caravan. One of my uncles who is a decorated Vietnam Vet was at the family business on Bourbon St. He saw a gold van pull up and 3 guys in wheel chairs get out. They started looting Bourbon st. That is when he decided to leave.

A place I have frequented many a time. It is prime realestate on the corner of St. Charles Ave and Carrolton Ave;
Uptown businesses rebound from Katrina's chaos
By Richard A. Webster Staff Writer “City Business”
2005-10-01 5:54 PM CST

NEW ORLEANS - After 32 chaotic days of desolation and darkness, clashes with armed gangs of looters and long hours spent repairing damage from the bruising blows of Hurricane Katrina, Art Depodesta reopened his restaurant at Cooter Brown’s on Thursday evening.
Paul Cosma, owner of the neighboring Uptown Auto Specialists, said despite New Orleans "ghost town" status business at Cooter Brown’s has been brisk.
"All the SWAT guys and cops from out of town are coming in," Cosma said. "Last night 30 of them came by in an hour. But who knows what’s going to happen in the long run. It’s the whole uncertainty of everything. None of us know what's going to happen."
Depodesta said all he can do is get his place up and running and hope for the best.
"The colleges are a big part of our business so without them it will definitely hurt," Depodesta said. "This was going to be a record year for us … but if we can hold out until after the first of the year business will pick up again."
Depodesta pays $30,000 a year for insurance and $5,500 a month in utilities, but he said it is the rising price of gas that has him most worried.
"Everything comes in by truck and if they have to pay more for gas the delivery prices go up which means I could have to jack the price of a burger up to $10 and if that happens no one gets paid," Depodesta said.
The structural damage to the Cooter Brown’s building was limited though the roof peeled off directly above Depodesta’s newly renovated second floor apartment. He and Cosma patched it up only to have Hurricane Rita undo all of their work.
The real damage occurred inside the restaurant’s freezers, Cosma said.
"Can you imagine $20,000 worth of oysters, roasts, pastramis, hams, burgers, chickens and every kind of food you have at a restaurant like that? Can you imagine freezers full of this kind of food gone bad? It was pretty rude."
Depodesta and Cosma sprayed the freezers with bleach using a pump sprayer, then pressure washed them. After all of that work, two of the freezers blew up when the electricity returned.
Due to the loss of his freezers and a limited staff, Cosma said Depodesta will offer a limited menu.
"He'll be doing a limited menu only because many of his workers don't even have a place to live so he can’t bring his whole crew in,” Cosma said. "I loaned him my truck so he can make food runs out to his suppliers in Harahan."
It has been hard work repairing and rebuilding his business but nothing compared to what took place in the aftermath of Katrina, said Depodesta.
Protecting the store
The trouble started almost immediately after Katrina passed, even before the first levee broke.
After the heaviest winds died to a breeze, Depodesta and Cosma drove to the St. Charles Tavern on St. Charles Avenue - armed with guns to defend themselves.
"Paul had his Sig and I had my .45," Depodesta said. "We're all strapped up and the guys in the Tavern are handing us beers through the window. They had their weapons out, too."
And that’s when Depodesta said he saw them — stolen cars tearing up and down St. Charles Avenue packed with masked men pointing guns at innocent people stumbling down sidewalks in search of information.
"Besides the flooding the biggest problem we had were these idiots after the storm," Depodesta said. "They were like animals. The cops are trying to rescue people and these idiots are going around shooting people. There aren’t enough cops to begin with and they don’t get paid anything anyway so they couldn’t help. The one thing I learned was don’t count on anyone but yourself. And never go to a shelter."
Depodesta and Cosma returned to their businesses and prepared for the worst. It wasn't long before gangs of thugs appeared on Carrollton Avenue.
"They started coming down the street and when they got close I let loose with a 12 gauge and they went running," Depodesta said. "One guy came back in a truck with a gun but we had the drop on him. I had a buddy here with an HK and I had my 12 gauge. When the guy in the truck saw that he decided he didn’t want to play anymore. Let’s just put it that way."
Things proceeded to get weirder, Depodesta said.
"They stole a damn forklift, drove it down to Rite Aid and lifted open the gates. Me and Paul went down there and cut all of the wires out of it. The last thing I want is a guy driving around here with a forklift."
A few days after the storm, Cosma grabbed a pair of bolt cutters from a suspected looter.
"First the kid said it was his uncle’s, then he said he was going to come back and shoot us," Depodesta said. "I said, 'Go ahead man. It’s like martial law. In fact there is no law so come on back here because I know damn well I’m a better shot than you and have better weapons.' I made it through the storm and had no flooding and then I got to watch some animals tear apart the place I built? I don’t think so."
When the military arrived four days after Katrina made landfall, Depodesta said they attempted to confiscate his weapons.
"I made it clear that wasn’t going to happen and they left me alone."
Return to normal?
Cosma re-opened Uptown Auto Specialists on Monday. There was a lot of debris to be cleaned up but no structural damage.
With the hundreds of broken down and waterlogged vehicles scattered around New Orleans, it would appear that auto repair shops are primed for a banner season, but Cosma said that may not be the case.
"It could be a total bust this time," he said. "All these cars have been sitting around in this (stuff) for so long. Typically when we have a storm cars are maybe two days in the water and you get them drug in and we take them apart immediately. But these cars have been sitting in the water or been wet for a month. A lot more cars are going to be totaled than in previous times."
Cosma, however, said his most pressing concern is providing financially for the 10 people he employs.
"As an employer you’re responsible for all of your employees so how would you feel as an employer if you couldn't provide to your employees what you promised when you hired them? I feel like (crap). I’m responsible for 10 people and there's only so much I can do.
"We're coming back and we'll see what happens but if there's no business I'll have to let them go. But I don't foresee that happening and I don't want to do that to happen because it's hard to get good employees. The toughest thing is I've been in business for over 20 years and I don't know what's going to happen."

Copyright © 2005, New Orleans Publishing Group. All Rights Reserved. 111 Veterans Blvd., Suite 1440 Metairie, LA 70005
Phone: 504.834.9292 Fax: 504.832.3550 Email: mail@nopg.com Terms

[sailsmen]

And to top it all off post Katrina I am in an apt living in Lafayette. Doing some work on a Saturday nite when the 12 year old next door knocks to tell me his apt is on fire.

The young man fell asleep, fortunately the dog woke him. He called 911, knocked on my door.



I was busy so I did not answer rite away.



I opened the door and he had the phone in one hand and the dog collar in the other.



He said "Mr. Billy there is a fire". I said did you call 911 he said yes I said anyone in the apt he said no I said where is the fire he said greas fire. I went and got my fire extinguisher that I had just pruchased the nite before. I went in low seeing the smoke near the ceiling.



I aimed at the burner and it went out. I went back out got some air and went back in and the burner reignited it. I hit the burner again but it was still hot. I could no see which knob so I wnet back out got some air and got the flash lite. Went back in and it reignited. I hit it with the fire exting and then turned all the fuses off.



I then jumped in a hot steam shower to cough up the poison. I went to Walgreens to get saline to wash out my nose and eyes. I then drank plenty of water and ice tea to flush it out.



I then went to Hooters to eat a bunch of hot spicy food! The guys were all watching the football game so I sat away from the big screen and showed all the girls the fire pics! I had lots of attention!

[PonyUP]

No doubt things were horrific after Katrina, which was a natural disaster. We saw the best and the worst in people, and the city struggled on.

What we are talking about here is the same thing that happened under Bush, Clinton, Bush Sr, Reagan, Carter and Nixon. Gov spending out of control. Whether its
Watergate
The oil embargo
S and L
Iran Contra
Kuwait
9/11
Or Wall street

My point is every decade has to deal with the stupidity of our leaders and there is always a crisis. We can hide in our caves and ration water, or we can live each day as if it were our last.

I choose the latter. I didn't see everyone crying when Bush put us in two wars costing trillions of dollars and bankrupting the country, but I see everyone jumping on the current Pres for HIS erratic spending, and justifiably so

But what I am real sick of is being called a moron cause I have some Dem beliefs. What I am real tired of is taking two asses throwing shots at a bus and blaming the Pres

What I can't stand is that if I have some emotion I'm called a liberal like its a dirty word

But lastly what I just can't frickin stomach, is that every time one of these ****ing threads is started, if someone chimes in with a democratic point of view they get ganged up on like they stole someones lunch money.

I love my country like everyone else on this bored, and I get tired of being belittled because I have some democrat leanings.

The day that we can have on honest discussion on this board that respectful and earnest will be the first day an honest political discussion takes place on this board.

I'm sick and ****ing tired of being called a libtard, a socialist, or even being compared to Hitler.

If everyone wants to hate the Pres so be it, but never forget the mess we are in is over 30 years in the making. During those 30 years we have had Republicans and Democrats in charge. I can't stand being thought of as evil because I believe Regan caused most of the current mess eith his spend spend spend mantra (buy the way look at it Reagan was more Dem than anything else) And I hate that I'm outcasted because I don't believe Obama is the anti Christ. He is a man, trying to do things he thinks is best for the country, but like all politicians, he gets caught in the machine.

I'll say what everyone is afraid to admit, he's not liked cause he's a Democrat, he's hated cause he is black.

While that may not define everyone on this board, it certainly defines what's going on in this country.

I've never seen a President treated with as little respect. From cackling at his state of the union to a Gov chastising him on a runway, to being compared to Hitler. The man gets zero respect.

When I agree with him or not, he is the President and I would address him as so and give home the respect the office demands.

To bad the everyday citizen can't do the same. I will truly wonder, should Romney win this election, will all of you have the same critical eye. I think probably not.

That's really all I have to say about politics on this board and while I've said before, I mean it this time, I'm done posting in these threads.

I encourage all of you to open your hearts and minds and accept multiple points of view, as long as you pigeon hole yourself into one way of thinking, you will always get what you always got


Pony seal of Approval

[duhtroll]

SHOOT THE LAWYERS!

MORE SKIN ON HBO!

LUTHER HENRY PUTTGRASS SIGNING OFF AND HEADING FOR THE TUB!

(from Bloom County c.1985)


Also, IIRC...

Ranting old guy: "Guns don't kill people. People kill guns. From outlaws.

Why those anti gun nuts why I oughta OOOOOOOOOOO!!! SELF DEFENSE!!

Anyways, its all there in the letter."

Milo: "Verbatim."

[sailsmen]

Your statement that he is hated becasue he is black makes no sense. His likeability is and has been very high. Huff Post 9-24-11, A recent Associated Press-GfK poll showed that nearly 8 in 10 people considered Obama a likable person, and slightly more than half said he understands the problems of ordinary people.
His policies are devisive and extreme left wing, (Liberals opinions - Meyers/Schoen/Caddell - post #9 http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?p=1186450&highlight=schoen#post1186450). The President has Publically stated he believes in Social Justice thru Income Redistribution. Most people in the USA do not believe in that.
You forget the way Pres Bush was treated. Code Pink, where are they. No modern President has ever publically disrespected the Supreme Court.
Your statement about Pres Bush Bankrupting is just factually wrong.

I am not going to look my children in the eye and say sorry you must die becasue daddy didn't take reasonble preparations that our own Gov't recommends, http://www.ready.gov/build-a-kit, we take becasue he was busy living everyday like it was his last.

8 Year Annual Average Clinton vs Bush
Measurement 60 Year Post WW II Annual Average President Clinton President Bush
8 Years Annual Average Unemployment 5.60% 5.21% 5.26%
8 Years Annual Average Annual Deficit as a Percent of our Economy -1.70% -0.08% -2.00%
8 Years Annual Average Public Debt as a Percent of our Economy 40.80% 44.90% 36.10%
8 Years Annual Average Annual Tax Collections N/A $1.55 Trillion $2.14 Trillion
8 Years Annual Average Spending as a Percent of our economy 19.90% 19.80% 19.60%

3 Year Annual Average Clinton vs Bush vs Obama
Measurement 60 Year Post WW II Annual Average President Clinton President Bush President Obama
3 Years Annual Average Unemployment 5.60% 6.20% 5.50% 9.30%
3 Years Annual Average Annual Deficit as a Percent of our Economy -1.70% -3.00% -1.20% -9.90%
3 Years Annual Average Public Debt as a Percent of our Economy 40.80% 49.20% 33.90% 62.60%
3 Years Annual Average Annual Tax Collections N/A $1.25 Trillion $1.88 Trillion $2.15 Trillion
3 Years Annual Average Spending as a Percent of our economy 19.90% 21.00% 19.00% 24.70%

Note: All Data is from the Government BLS and OMB

[MrBluGruv]

No doubt things were horrific after Katrina, which was a natural disaster. We saw the best and the worst in people, and the city struggled on.

What we are talking about here is the same thing that happened under Bush, Clinton, Bush Sr, Reagan, Carter and Nixon. Gov spending out of control. Whether its
Watergate
The oil embargo
S and L
Iran Contra
Kuwait
9/11
Or Wall street

My point is every decade has to deal with the stupidity of our leaders and there is always a crisis. We can hide in our caves and ration water, or we can live each day as if it were our last.

I choose the latter. I didn't see everyone crying when Bush put us in two wars costing trillions of dollars and bankrupting the country, but I see everyone jumping on the current Pres for HIS erratic spending, and justifiably so

But what I am real sick of is being called a moron cause I have some Dem beliefs. What I am real tired of is taking two asses throwing shots at a bus and blaming the Pres

What I can't stand is that if I have some emotion I'm called a liberal like its a dirty word

But lastly what I just can't frickin stomach, is that every time one of these ****ing threads is started, if someone chimes in with a democratic point of view they get ganged up on like they stole someones lunch money.

I love my country like everyone else on this bored, and I get tired of being belittled because I have some democrat leanings.

The day that we can have on honest discussion on this board that respectful and earnest will be the first day an honest political discussion takes place on this board.

I'm sick and ****ing tired of being called a libtard, a socialist, or even being compared to Hitler.

If everyone wants to hate the Pres so be it, but never forget the mess we are in is over 30 years in the making. During those 30 years we have had Republicans and Democrats in charge. I can't stand being thought of as evil because I believe Regan caused most of the current mess eith his spend spend spend mantra (buy the way look at it Reagan was more Dem than anything else) And I hate that I'm outcasted because I don't believe Obama is the anti Christ. He is a man, trying to do things he thinks is best for the country, but like all politicians, he gets caught in the machine.

I'll say what everyone is afraid to admit, he's not liked cause he's a Democrat, he's hated cause he is black.

While that may not define everyone on this board, it certainly defines what's going on in this country.

I've never seen a President treated with as little respect. From cackling at his state of the union to a Gov chastising him on a runway, to being compared to Hitler. The man gets zero respect.

When I agree with him or not, he is the President and I would address him as so and give home the respect the office demands.

To bad the everyday citizen can't do the same. I will truly wonder, should Romney win this election, will all of you have the same critical eye. I think probably not.

That's really all I have to say about politics on this board and while I've said before, I mean it this time, I'm done posting in these threads.

I encourage all of you to open your hearts and minds and accept multiple points of view, as long as you pigeon hole yourself into one way of thinking, you will always get what you always got


Pony seal of Approval



I can dig just about everything you said,

except that the main reason that the people that hate Obama hate him because he is black.

I just don't buy it. There are undoubtedly people that actually do hate him because of his skin color, as there are radicals for every point of view, but I think that is FAR from the norm.

[PonyUP]

While you're pulling all your Internet stats, pull up how much the Iraq war for the last ten years has cost, you won't find an accurate figure because no one knows
While your pulling all your Internet stats, how much have we handed over to Halliburton in the form of government contracts, and how much have they stolen outside of those contracts.
While your doing your Internet research on how likeable President Obama is, pull the poll that shows him as one of the most popular President, because there is no accurate poll that shows that.

You can pull all the Internet articles you want that support your argument, I can do the same. Note I didn't say he was polled as an unpopular President, I said he was the most disrespected. I didn't say he was the most hated President, but that many hated him because he was black (no accurate poll for this as most won't admit it)
The first financial collapse happened under Bush. It wasn't his fault, it was all of Congress and Wall Street. Everyone saw fit on this board to defend Bush and rightfully so. So now that things have somewhat improved with a drop from the highs of unemployment and the rebound of wall street from a 6000pt Dow to now over 12000, my question Is why do the same people that defended Bush, now Blame Obama?
Before you go to google.com, I want your opinion.
The fact is in October 2008, under Bush we were at Rock bottom. Again not Bushs fault, he just happened to have the chair. Things have been on a slow incline since, but we still see fit on this board to continue with the "I Hate Obama" mantra blaming him for things he has nothing to do with.
So answer the question that never got answered in the other thread, how is Obama responsible for two asshokes throwing shots at a bus.

Don't copy and paste, don't quote from some skewed article on the Internet, and don't tell me welfare is responsible. I want to know how Obama is responsible for every bad thing inthis country(as that is how he is blamed on this board, for Christsake even in the joke of the day thread we paste the guy) because that is the OVERWHELMING view on this board, but I didn't see those same critical fingers pointed at Bush, who was hardly any better if at all.

If you haven't figured it out yet, I'm not bitter because those on this board have a differing opinion than I, that's healthy and good. I'm bitter because my opinion is not respected on this board because I have some democratic believes.

What I'm asking is of all the regulars that start and participate in these threads, is respect what other people believe, and respect the President.

You don't have to like the President, but damnit, we should respect him. That doesn't happen here, not does it happen in the real world.

You guys can all be scared of the sky falling, and spend the rest of your lives wondering "what if", I choose to live life as it is, plan for my future, and try to do what I believe is right. I choose to be happy and not scared,

This will pass like everything else in this country


Pony seal of Approval

[PonyUP]

I can dig just about everything you said,

except that the main reason that the people that hate Obama hate him because he is black.

I just don't buy it. There are undoubtedly people that actually do hate him because of his skin color, as there are radicals for every point of view, but I think that is FAR from the norm.

I don't know that it is so far from the norm, it's just that many that do hate him because he is black won't admit. These are the same people that reply with "I have black friends"
Not all hate him because of this, but he is definitely the most disrespected President, and a lot of it has to do with that.
Not everyone, but those that do are fueling the fire. It's the most ridiculous argument that usually rings the loudest, it's why the birther movement had such legs.


Pony seal of Approval

[sailsmen]

Because Obama is PRESIDENT and the Buck stops with him.
The financial stats I posted are directly from the Office of Managment and Budget and Bureau of Labor Statistics, both are under the WH.
Here is the problem the Public Debt, thats the money we have actually borrowed from others, has gone from 42% of GDP to over 70+% of GDP. Over 60% and it hurts our economy. Whenever Fed spending exceeds 19.9% of GDP for 2 or more years unemployment goes up a min of 50% and stays there regardless of wether the economy gorws or shrinks. Pres Obama has Budgeted 22.2+% thru 2017. 2/3 of that increased Debt occurred when Pres Obama had the WH, House and Senate.
We are told TARP has made money and the war spending is down. So what did we get for this Debt we cannot pay back? Answer Social Justice via INCOME REDISTRIBUTION.
I accept that when a President is elected he can spend it on what he can convince Congress to spend it on. What I cannot accept is a President that implements income redistribution to the point of collapse.

[MrBluGruv]

I don't know that it is so far from the norm, it's just that many that do hate him because he is black won't admit. These are the same people that reply with "I have black friends"
Not all hate him because of this, but he is definitely the most disrespected President, and a lot of it has to do with that.
Not everyone, but those that do are fueling the fire. It's the most ridiculous argument that usually rings the loudest, it's why the birther movement had such legs.


Pony seal of Approval


I think the disrespect comes more from that fact that we live in what I like to call "The Era of the Pundit."

Everyone thinks they know everything about everything, and if there is anything that doesn't appear to work the way they think it should, they feel that they could fix it, they just don't actually follow through.


Kind of a perfect storm of lack of trust, over-inflated ego, and a misappropriation of pride (a topic I could talk about for ages).

[PonyUP]

The President submits a budget that is approved by congress. Unemployment has been a slow recovery and Obama and congress could do much much more, it's still a lower unemployment rate and has improved most months since January 2009.
With due respect, you didn't answer the two questions I posted,

1) where was this same uproar when we had the same or worse numbers in the same categories under Bush

2) how is Obama responsible for two people throwing shots at a bus

Don't give me the buck stops here stuff, with that theory ever President has been responsible for every crime.

I'm not saying I Obama has been the cure all for this country, I certainly haven't agreed with his every action, but he is not the evil blame all.

I've said it many times before and I'll say it again, the President yields very little power and deserves very little credit or blame for the course of the country. He can be, and often is outdone by congress.

So you can post about social redistribution and can pull up articles to support that fact. I don't agree with redistribution, but guess what, that has been going on for decades.

Things have always been skewed and favored for the wealthiest in this country. For centuries people have tried to get the same piece of the pie. Those that have power and money will keep it, those that don't will want it.

If we want to prevent this, it starts with congress. And for all the people that say vote the democrats out and everything will be fine, let me know when you get out of fantasy camp.

It took two parties to create this problem, it will take two to fix it. Who is President when that happens will actually matter very little


Pony seal of Approval

[tbone]

I hate to say it, but I agree with Kernie.

Pony seal of Approval

:lol:

Wow.....

[tbone]

I said it before and I'll say it again. It's real simple:

The Soviet Union (United Soviet Socialist Republics) went bankrupt and no longer exists. What makes you guys think the USA is immune to the same fate if we follow the same suicidal socialistic path as them?

[1 Bad Merc]

The President submits a budget that is approved by congress. Unemployment has been a slow recovery and Obama and congress could do much much more, it's still a lower unemployment rate and has improved most months since January 2009.
With due respect, you didn't answer the two questions I posted,

1) where was this same uproar when we had the same or worse numbers in the same categories under Bush

2) how is Obama responsible for two people throwing shots at a bus

Don't give me the buck stops here stuff, with that theory ever President has been responsible for every crime.

I'm not saying I Obama has been the cure all for this country, I certainly haven't agreed with his every action, but he is not the evil blame all.

I've said it many times before and I'll say it again, the President yields very little power and deserves very little credit or blame for the course of the country. He can be, and often is outdone by congress.

So you can post about social redistribution and can pull up articles to support that fact. I don't agree with redistribution, but guess what, that has been going on for decades.

Things have always been skewed and favored for the wealthiest in this country. For centuries people have tried to get the same piece of the pie. Those that have power and money will keep it, those that don't will want it.

If we want to prevent this, it starts with congress. And for all the people that say vote the democrats out and everything will be fine, let me know when you get out of fantasy camp.

It took two parties to create this problem, it will take two to fix it. Who is President when that happens will actually matter very little


Pony seal of Approval

Their was an uproar over Bush's failed economic policies that's why Obama (The Nation's first Black president) was elected! I totally agree with your veiwpoint that Congress is the bigger problem.

By the time a politician gets to Washington they have been bought and paid for many times over. It does not matter if the elected official is a Democrat or Republican as they have already sold themselves to the highest bidder.

Our only hope is to clean sweep all the current politicians out and start over. We need to elect stricter campaign money reforms and eliminate the current lobbying system. We need to make our reps subject to our current ss, medicare and no extra retirement benefits for serving the people. We as a people need to get p/o at the current joke of a system and demand change.

Only then will the people's reps have a chance to do the peoples work.

[tbone]

The only method that ever removes entire government systems is revolution or bankruptcy.

[PonyUP]

:lol:

Wow.....

Lol, yeah I was surprised to, by the way bud, I'll be in Chicago in mid July for about 10 days, hope to see ya bro


Pony seal of Approval

[kernie]

Lol, yeah I was surprised to, by the way bud, I'll be in Chicago in mid July for about 10 days, hope to see ya bro


Pony seal of Approval



We both know that you agree with me much more than you are willing to admit around here, lol.

:beer:

[tbone]

Lol, yeah I was surprised to, by the way bud, I'll be in Chicago in mid July for about 10 days, hope to see ya bro


Pony seal of Approval

Party time! Excellent! :banana:

I'll look forward to it.

[tbone]

We both know that you agree with me much more than you are willing to admit around here, lol.

:beer:

One of maybe 3 people. Congrats!:beer:

[kernie]

One of maybe 3 people. Congrats!:beer:



Well if being part of the majority is important to you that means you will be voting for Obama soon.

;)

[tbone]

Well if being part of the majority is important to you that means you will be voting for Obama soon.

;)


Riiiiight.

Ronald McDonald would be a better Prez than that community rabble rouser.

[Baaad GN]

YEP, Hope and Change has made Pony a happy man!:-)

[sailsmen]

By Stephen Dinan
-
The Washington Times
Tuesday, June 5, 2012

The federal government is staring at a disastrous fiscal picture with debt approaching 200 percent of GDP within two decades if Congress doesn't change course on spending and taxes, according to the latest analysis by the Congressional Budget Office released Tuesday.
CBO said it's the worst picture since a brief period during World War II when spending ballooned to fund the military campaign.
"In the past few years, the federal government has been recording the largest budget deficits since 1945, both in dollar terms and as a share of the economy. Consequently, the amount of federal debt held by the public has surged," CBO said in a long-term budget outlook that paints a shockingly dark picture of government finances.
CBO's analysts said the downturn and Congress's response to it have been devastating for the government. Federal debt as a percentage of Gross Domestic Product — a standard measure of a government's debt burden — stood at 40 percent at the end of 2008. But it will top 70 percent by the end of this year, and is only headed higher unless Congress changes. It could double by the middle of the next decade and will have topped 200 percent of GDP — twice the size of the projected U.S. economy — by 2037.
At that level, fiscal catastrophes are more likely, and the government's ability to respond becomes far more constrained.
Ironically CBO said the deep deficits and debt don't have to happen. If Congress would step out of the way and allow current law — including ever-deeper spending cuts and potentially devastating tax increases — to go into effect, debt would begin to shrink almost immediately as a percentage of the economy, as measured by Gross Domestic Product.
But President Obama and lawmakers on Capitol Hill have been reluctant to let the law take its course. Instead, the GOP has fought to permanently extend lower tax rates, and Democrats have defended existing spending and in many instances called for new spending.
That's left the country bumping along with deficits of $1 trillion or more each of the last three years. Yet with the economy still weak, lawmakers remain paralyzed as they try to figure out how to act over the long term without harming the economy now.
CBO said that may not be possible.
"On the one hand, cutting spending or increasing taxes slowly would lead to a greater accumulation of government debt and might raise doubts about whether longer-term deficit reduction would ultimately take effect," CBO said. "On the other hand, abruptly implementing spending cuts or tax increases would give families, businesses, and state and local governments little time to plan and adjust, and would require more sacrifices sooner from current older workers and retirees for the benefit of younger workers and future generations."
© Copyright 2012 The Washington Times, LLC

Total Gov't spending is $58,100 per private sector Worker or ~44% of GDP. The phony argument that it was this high during WWII does not apply. For there is no significant spending that makes up the Debt forecasts that will terminate at the conclusion of an event such as the end of WWII did.