No cooling fan = no heat???

[Motorhead350]

My cars heat is not working, nor is the cooling fan.

I replaced the fan a few months ago with a new autozone one. Last time I had an issue with the fan, the A/C would not work. No cooling fan meant no A/C or air. Right now the car will not blow any air, like the blower motor is not working.

The car is running cool on the road too. Driving in town the temp will be in the middle in operating temperature. On the highway it will drop and comes very close to C.

I noticed the fan was not working when it was cold, was not working when it was up to operating temperature. I changed the 50 fuse and that changed nothing. Also unplugged the fan, blew it and plugged it back in. Did not turn on.

The fan is under lifetime warranty and I can get another, but I want to know from you guys if I should check something else before I take the fan out because BABY IT'S COLD OUTSIDE.

Last time I had an issue with the engine temperature it was because the radiator fan was not working and the car was blowing cold air, but I could not really control the fan speed... fan speed of the climate control.

Is the fan the issue or should I check something else first? I am in a bit of a panic, it looks like I have to drive to FL sooner than I thought.

Any info appreciated. Laugh away.


BTW yesterday I got stuck on some ice. I had the engine reved up pretty high while the car was stationary, but it did not overheat once. I was stuck for 30 minutes. I guess I blew up the cooling fan motor, but even then, after I got the car free, the heat still worked.

[Vortech347]

Sounds like your T-stat is stuck open. Which is why its running so cold. If the engine doesn't get up to temp the fan will never turn on.

You don't have heat likely because you are low on coolant and need to burp the system with the coolant cross over. If its even 1/2 gallon low the heater won't work worth a damn.


Change T-stat, refill and burp coolant. Done.

[Motorhead350]

Sounds like your T-stat is stuck open. Which is why its running so cold. If the engine doesn't get up to temp the fan will never turn on.

You don't have heat likely because you are low on coolant and need to burp the system with the coolant cross over. If its even 1/2 gallon low the heater won't work worth a damn.


Change T-stat, refill and burp coolant. Done.

EDIT: I found this...

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=45597

My question is what hose to follow? The one that runs to the top driver side or the bottom?

Also, is this located on the radiator? I thought it was on the cars engine?

I have never changed one of these before.

[Vortech347]

EDIT: I found this...

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=45597

My question is what hose to follow? The one that runs to the top driver side or the bottom?

Also, is this located on the radiator? I thought it was on the cars engine?

I have never changed one of these before.


This surprises me as many times as you've had your car apart.

The T-stat is located inside a metal housing about the size of an apple. It has a few of the radiator hoses running to it. You need to open it up. TAKE NOTE OF WHICH WAY THE T-STAT IS INSTALLED. And install the new one in the same location/direction.

You will make a huge mess with coolant and will need more to top off the system and also correctly fill it to the top of the cross over.

It looks like this

http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/2710/imgp0546bs7.jpg

[Motorhead350]

Thank you soooo much for the detail!

This is near the bottom on the drivers side correct?

[Vortech347]

Thank you soooo much for the detail!

This is near the bottom on the drivers side correct?

Yup.

10 character limit

[Motorhead350]

Time to get messy.

Thank you so much.

[tbone]

When the EATC circuit board failed on my car, I had no heat. I thought it was the tstat at first. Just FYI.

[Vortech347]

When the EATC circuit board failed on my car, I had no heat. I thought it was the tstat at first. Just FYI.

The EATC wouldn't cause the car itself to run cold.

[Motorhead350]

Screw getting these spring clamps back on!!!!

[tbone]

The EATC wouldn't cause the car itself to run cold.

You misunderstand my meaning. No heat would come out because the eatc would not change settings. I ruled out the tstat after 5 minutes.

[Motorhead350]

How about I fix the car and we can settle this?

[tbone]

You've had 6 hours. Time's up.

[Motorhead350]

You've had 6 hours. Time's up.

I got pissed off at the clamps so I decided to walk away before I kicked in the grille.

[Vortech347]

You've had 6 hours. Time's up.

True, this shouldn't take more than about 30-45 minutes including putting the car up on stands. :D


I got pissed off at the clamps so I decided to walk away before I kicked in the grille.

A good set of channel lock type pliers work awesome for the clamps.

[Motorhead350]

True, this shouldn't take more than about 30-45 minutes including putting the car up on stands. :D



A good set of channel lock type pliers work awesome for the clamps.

There is snow on the ground and I have no garage. My tools are fine, but something is up with those clamps. They do not even wanna retract back far enough to even get on the hose!

I will WALK BACK to the Autozone and get some worm clamps when I wake up.

[Vortech347]

There is snow on the ground and I have no garage. My tools are fine, but something is up with those clamps. They do not even wanna retract back far enough to even get on the hose!

I will WALK BACK to the Autozone and get some worm clamps when I wake up.

I hope you're catching the coolant and not letting it drain out everywhere. The Ford clamps work fine.

[wickedmerc]

After all that cursing and bleeding knuckles, if your blower still doesn't work, try tapping on the BCM.
After spending an obscene amount of $$ on my HVAC this past year, my blower stopped working a few weeks ago. I was flipping out! Searched through here and found the BCM can go out. As suggested, I tapped it a few times with the handle of a screwdriver and blower came back on. I've since ordered a new unit which I will install when mine goes out again.
Good luck!

[J-MAN]

Please keep us updated as to your progress. :eek:

[RF Overlord]

Dom, I agree with you about those clamps...I hate working with them, although I believe there is a special tool that make it easier than using grabbers or Channellocks.

Also, I found this little tidbit in the factory service manual:

6. Note: Do not reuse hose clamps. Instead, use appropriately sized worm-style clamps in place of the constant tension clamps.

When you get it apart, be sure to note not only which way the thermostat goes, but where the o-ring goes. For the record, the t-stat goes in first with the spring-part facing INTO the housing, then the o-ring goes on top of the t-stat flange...IOW, it goes in after the t-stat is inserted into the housing.

[martyo]

Dom, I agree with you about those clamps...I hate working with them, although I believe there is a special tool that make it easier than using grabbers or Channellocks.


When you get it apart, be sure to note not only which way the thermostat goes, but where the o-ring goes. For the record, the t-stat goes in first with the spring-part facing INTO the housing, then the o-ring goes on top of the t-stat flange...IOW, it goes in after the t-stat is inserted into the housing.

I concur with the 'lord.

If you lived closer I would lend you the tool that handles the factory clamps in a jiff.

[VMARAUDER]

I concur with the 'lord.

If you lived closer I would lend you the tool that handles the factory clamps in a jiff.
It's nice because the tool locks the clamp open and then they release easily...I have been thinking of buying one
Had one relaese and hit my finger, really hurts

[Motorhead350]

Guys, after changing the thermostat, the car still does not blow air, nor does the cooling fan work.

I will take it for a test drive to see if the car gets to operating temperature. All hoses are back on with the worm clamps. No leaks. Still, the main issue has not been fixed.

Drag...

[Vortech347]

Guys, after changing the thermostat, the car still does not blow air, nor does the cooling fan work.

I will take it for a test drive to see if the car gets to operating temperature. All hoses are back on with the worm clamps. No leaks. Still, the main issue has not been fixed.

Drag...

Then swap the BCM and you will have heat again. Make sure the system is fully topped off. It usually takes a drive cycle and cool off. Then refill.

[tbone]

I beat the crap out of my hands last year when I changed all the hoses, clamps, water pump and tstat. Changing out the heater core hoses especially sucks.

[Motorhead350]

What is the BCM?

Cooling fan has been changed and now works.. still no heat or air flow inside car.

Test drive later to see if thermostat works.

[VMARAUDER]

unplug the fan connector and check for 12 vdc
if 12 vdc is present you have a bad blower motor
the blower motor resistor could also be bad but not if you have the 12 vdc

[Motorhead350]

What is 12vdc?

[RR|Suki]

What is 12vdc?

12 volts, direct current

[Motorhead350]

I do not have the device to determine if there is a current.

[VMARAUDER]

Hey man, you need one and they are easy to use...I never could use a test lite effectively.

You can pick up a decent volt/ohm meter for about $14.99 at sears, radio shack best buy ace hardware

[Motorhead350]

I might have to.

Thanks Vince.

[martyo]

I might have to.

Thanks Vince.

Or you can get a super cheap one at HF and just know that it is not the most accurate VOM on the planet….

[Joe Walsh]

Or you can get a super cheap one at HF and just know that it is not the most accurate VOM on the planet….

As much as I make fun of Horrible Fright and Tools, they constantly send me coupons for a FREE Multimeter.
I must have 4 or 5 of those things laying around in handy spots!
They may not be the most accurate....but when I drop one or step on one...I just shrug and laugh.....more coupons will be on the way soon!

[Motorhead350]

I will check fuses and relays later.

[vegasmarauder]

If the fan does not work in any of the modes (the bottom row of buttons on the EATC) 99.9999999% of the time its the BCM (Blower Control Module) Its in the heater car on the engine side right behind the right (passenger) side valve (or cam) cover. Its a pain to get out working around the heater hoses and the cam cover (especially outside). Take it easy because I got one the owner tried to do it himself and broke off the top portion of the case above the hole. It was a big PITA to repair that. If you take your time and realize it will be difficult, it can be done in about an hour.

Fastblkmerc (I think) can rebuild them and fix the solder joints inside which is the reason why they fail and why they work(sometimes) when you tap on them. Every MM, MGM and TC with EATC will ose the BCM some day.

When I change timing chains and tensioners I usually get a new BCM becuase it is so easy to do with the cam cover off and they cost about $50 from Ford.

The flucuating temp needle is almost always a result of low coolant or an air bubble in the system by the way. You have two different problems I think. Thermostats that stick closed will cause an overheat, thermostats that stick open will result in a very low engine temp. In cold weather, the needle will barely move and stay low.

[Motorhead350]

I think you have the golden ticket. I replaced this twice already. Now that I know what you guys have been talking about since yesterday, I would bet this is the issue. When I had this replaced last time I was getting the same problem. Never thought of that. My mind has been in outter space lately.


If the fan does not work in any of the modes (the bottom row of buttons on the EATC) 99.9999999% of the time its the BCM (Blower Control Module) Its in the heater car on the engine side right behind the right (passenger) side valve (or cam) cover. Its a pain to get out working around the heater hoses and the cam cover (especially outside). Take it easy because I got one the owner tried to do it himself and broke off the top portion of the case above the hole. It was a big PITA to repair that. If you take your time and realize it will be difficult, it can be done in about an hour.

Fastblkmerc (I think) can rebuild them and fix the solder joints inside which is the reason why they fail and why they work(sometimes) when you tap on them. Every MM, MGM and TC with EATC will ose the BCM some day.

When I change timing chains and tensioners I usually get a new BCM becuase it is so easy to do with the cam cover off and they cost about $50 from Ford.

The flucuating temp needle is almost always a result of low coolant or an air bubble in the system by the way. You have two different problems I think. Thermostats that stick closed will cause an overheat, thermostats that stick open will result in a very low engine temp. In cold weather, the needle will barely move and stay low.

[VMARAUDER]

[QUOTE=vegasmarauder;1356567]If the fan does not work in any of the modes (the bottom row of buttons on the EATC) 99.9999999% of the time its the BCM (Blower Control Module)

Blower control module = blower motor resistor???? Actually I don't think there is a resistor on that board...never really looked at that close. Only de-soldered and re-soldered the bad solder. So I think BCM is the appropriate term

[Motorhead350]

Vince, junkyard before the meet tomorrow?

[RF Overlord]

Blower control module = blower motor resistor???? Actually I don't think there is a resistor on that board...never really looked at that close. Only de-soldered and re-soldered the bad solder. So I think BCM is the appropriate termThey perform a similar function, but in very different ways.

The blower motor resistor, as used in the manual HVAC control, is literally nothing more than a combination of resistors that are put inline to reduce the voltage. It's about the simplest circuit possible.

The BSCM (Blower Speed Control Module) used in the EATC system is an electronic circuit that uses PWM (pulse-width modulation) to control the motor speed by turning the motor on and off rapidly using a large transistor. It's the same sort of system used in high-quality model train sets to produce more realistic motion.

[fastblackmerc]

I think you have the golden ticket. I replaced this twice already. Now that I know what you guys have been talking about since yesterday, I would bet this is the issue. When I had this replaced last time I was getting the same problem. Never thought of that. My mind has been in outter space lately.

Dom, send me one that you get from the recycle yard or any that you have and I'll repair it.

[VMARAUDER]

Vince, junkyard before the meet tomorrow?
Hey Dom, I just saw this.
I unfortunately will not be out today, unexpected out of town guest put a damper in week end.
I would never show up un announced, my wife never turns anyone away. I would have sent them packing and quick.

[Motorhead350]

Ok Vince.

Thanks Jim. I might pick up a few. You can fix them and sell them.

[fastblackmerc]

Ok Vince.

Thanks Jim. I might pick up a few. You can fix them and sell them.

If you can 2 or 3 I'll do your repair for free.

BTW... I don't sell them... I sell the repair. I just ask that you send me your old one once it's swapped out.

[Motorhead350]

If you can 2 or 3 I'll do your repair for free.

BTW... I don't sell them... I sell the repair. I just ask that you send me your old one once it's swapped out.

Done.

BTW you guys were right, my issue is the BCM.

I hit mine a few times with a pair of vice-crips and the fan kicked back on.

I grabbed a few from the yard today. I will send a few your way.

[vegasmarauder]

By the way, a Ford replacement part will also fail too because it is soldered the same as the original. The only way to elimnate the problem for good is a redone one from Fastblackmerc.

By the way Fastblackmerc I see them from time to time in pickapart yards. I think they sell for about $5-10. I'll pull them when I see them and send them your way. I have 2 bad ones already in boxes just waiting for a few more to send your way.

[fastblackmerc]

By the way, a Ford replacement part will also fail too because it is soldered the same as the original. The only way to elimnate the problem for good is a redone one from Fastblackmerc.

By the way Fastblackmerc I see them from time to time in pickapart yards. I think they sell for about $5-10. I'll pull them when I see them and send them your way. I have 2 bad ones already in boxes just waiting for a few more to send your way.

Thanks! I appreciate that as do members that need the fix. I do the repair using good old fashioned lead solder :eek: so the possibliity of another failure is greatly reduced.

[Motorhead350]

The car has been fixed people.

The radiator fan needed to be changed, the BCM was hit and started working again (I will replace it today, I picked up a few yesterday) and not to mention I needed to burp the system again due to overheating.

What a miserable week last week. It's all good now!

Thank you everyone. You have all been great.

[wickedmerc]

Glad those folks told you about the BCM and you got it working again.

(Psst...I told you that 3 days ago. But did you listen?? Noooooooo! :P)

[Vortech347]

By the way, a Ford replacement part will also fail too because it is soldered the same as the original. The only way to elimnate the problem for good is a redone one from Fastblackmerc.

By the way Fastblackmerc I see them from time to time in pickapart yards. I think they sell for about $5-10. I'll pull them when I see them and send them your way. I have 2 bad ones already in boxes just waiting for a few more to send your way.


When I changed my BCM on this car I was given a revised part number. The original one wasn't listed. With a part like that being common on all panther cars Its likely they are fixed. FBM have you fixed any failed ones from 08+?

[Motorhead350]

Glad those folks told you about the BCM and you got it working again.

(Psst...I told you that 3 days ago. But did you listen?? Noooooooo! :P)

I think I asked you what BCM stood for because I didn't know what you were talking about. When I knew, I went out the next day. So if you feel like I owe you thanks... thanks. I listened... when I knew what you were talking about. ;)

[fastblackmerc]

When I changed my BCM on this car I was given a revised part number. The original one wasn't listed. With a part like that being common on all panther cars Its likely they are fixed. FBM have you fixed any failed ones from 08+?

I highly doubt Ford fixed the problem with a revised part since they still have to make the part RoHS compliant which means using solder with no lead which leads to a brittle bond that will crack over time. I repair them with lead solder which is more flexible. I can almost guaranty that yours will fail over time. Just like EATC's and LCM's.... it's not if it will fail, but when will it fail.

To answer your question..... I have no idea if I've repaired an '08+ as I don't keep track of part numbers.

[wickedmerc]

I think I asked you what BCM stood for because I didn't know what you were talking about. When I knew, I went out the next day. So if you feel like I owe you thanks... thanks. I listened... when I knew what you were talking about. ;)

I was just breaking your shoes man. I didn't know what BCM meant either until mine failed on me. Glad you're back in business.