Turbocharged Coyote/6R80 Swap, Build/Discussion Thread, Pics, info inside!

[lifespeed]

Thank you.

I believe, supplies and all was just under 2k, but i'd have to review my build sheet.

Of course that's with all labor completely free.

That makes it a $6K to $10K paint job. Very nice!

[96gt4.6]

Thanks! Lot of late nights, pizza and coffee......but it's a passion indeed!

Still planning on starting the turbo build, might push it back to January or so give/take. I went out and decided to sell my Silverado SS and get a '15 F150 3.5L EcoBoost Crew Cab.

At least i'm all Blue Oval powered now!

[lsutigers93]

Here's the video demonstrating my integration with the stock '06 CAN Network Vic cluster to the Coyote ecu . Full functionality!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8pKKDKYBjk

two Coyote's, same chassis. Crazy how close we live to each other:

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20151107_174855_zpszedqkwcm.jp g

THIS is what I'm interested in LOL...Coyote in an 06+ Vic...did you do this swap as well?

[96gt4.6]

THIS is what I'm interested in LOL...Coyote in an 06+ Vic...did you do this swap as well?

I did not. I was assisting in the swap integration/gauge functionality and some minor tuning work.

Essentially, both swaps are the same hardware wise. However, it was VERY cool to drive a Vic with a 5 speed manual!

[lsutigers93]

PMd you...

[96gt4.6]

^ Got ya replied to sir!

Lots of ice and winter weather here, drove the car most of last week until it got nasty out, miss the 'ole girl! I'm itching to start on the turbo setup! It's looking like after the holidays are out of the way, I'll get going on the build finally. I do miss the fabrication work that goes into the turbo hot side, I think I enjoy making those components the most. I'm not sure what it is about it. Of course, 1/2 way through the build if you ask me the same question, it's not the same answer....haha.

Happy Holidays to all!

[myrodr]

Thanks for the well wishes same to you and yours. looking forward to the turbo part of this . Thanks again for posting this build.

[96gt4.6]

Looks like HP is still a go for EEC-V support. Still no ETA but it's coming. That will open up a HUGE market for them, and a HUGE benefit for those running the older ECU's!

http://www.hptuners.com/forum/showthread.php?54012-EEC-V-Update&p=401222#post401222

[96gt4.6]

Planning stages currently under way over on the HPT forums. I will begin the pics/build info here, once it commences.

http://www.hptuners.com/forum/showthread.php?54799-Coyote-5-0L-Single-Turbo-Advice&p=407369#post407369

[hotford]

not worry anymore boys Ford just released a control pack that is also available for a 6R680 use at PRI this weekend

http://fordperformanceracingparts.com/pri/

[kennytent]

PA transmissions also released a stand alone controller, which is supposed to be released just after the first of the year.

[lifespeed]

not worry anymore boys Ford just released a control pack that is also available for a 6R680 use at PRI this weekend

http://fordperformanceracingparts.com/pri/

Nice! However, wouldn't a 6-speed auto in the context of a Marauder want to be paired with the Coyote engine and PCM as 96GT4.6 has demonstrated?

[Bad_S55]

Nice! However, wouldn't a 6-speed auto in the context of a Marauder want to be paired with the Coyote engine and PCM as 96GT4.6 has demonstrated?

Well it's a kit to control the 6R80 & a Coyote together. I don't know why anybody wouldn't want that combo.

[jwibbity]

Nice! However, wouldn't a 6-speed auto in the context of a Marauder want to be paired with the Coyote engine and PCM as 96GT4.6 has demonstrated?

Its a stand alone computer that controls the shifts of the 6r80 so it can be swapped behind other mod motors like our 4.6 and not have to deal with grabbing a compatible PCM from another vehicle.

I'm much more interested in the 6r80 versus having a 5.0. The 6r80 in stock form has help up behind ridiculously modified 5.0's so its becoming the preferred "auto swap".

Basically the stand alone is allowing older cars to communicate with the much newer transmission.

[lifespeed]

Its a stand alone computer that controls the shifts of the 6r80 so it can be swapped behind other mod motors like our 4.6 and not have to deal with grabbing a compatible PCM from another vehicle.

I'm much more interested in the 6r80 versus having a 5.0. The 6r80 in stock form has help up behind ridiculously modified 5.0's so its becoming the preferred "auto swap".

Basically the stand alone is allowing older cars to communicate with the much newer transmission.

Understood. But our cars are emissions-controlled, and a "legal" engine swap typically must keep the engine/transmission combination. Not to mention the Coyote is pretty desirable itself.

States that don't enforce emissions are becoming fewer every year.

[jwibbity]

Understood. But our cars are emissions-controlled, and a "legal" engine swap typically must keep the engine/transmission combination. Not to mention the Coyote is pretty desirable itself.

States that don't enforce emissions are becoming fewer every year.

I don't see it being an issue because you're not changing any emission related equipment. The controller will basically be the middle man between the 6r80 and the MM ECM/PCM.

[justbob]

As long as you don't have to turn off any CELs.. I can't pass emissions with the manual because we had to turn off 8 trans codes in the tune.

I spoke with the head guy for USEPA vehicular emissions and while an understanding nice guy he said that it still goes back to tampering even though I can get way better fuel economy with what I've done.

So **** it. I disabled every single item except cats now. I tried to play by the rules.


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[lifespeed]

I don't see it being an issue because you're not changing any emission related equipment. The controller will basically be the middle man between the 6r80 and the MM ECM/PCM.

That is not how The Man sees it. It sucks, but if you want a legal street car you have to play by the rules. I don't like it and don't agree, but I intend to drive my car on the street.

[jwibbity]

That is not how The Man sees it. It sucks, but if you want a legal street car you have to play by the rules. I don't like it and don't agree, but I intend to drive my car on the street.

S/C'd with a Mo's tune passes NC inspection with flying colors w/ EGR deleted. I'll go grab my inspection sheet to see which systems they test for...

obviously Cali is a little bit more strict with the mods

[Vortech347]

S/C'd with a Mo's tune passes NC inspection with flying colors w/ EGR deleted. I'll go grab my inspection sheet to see which systems they test for...

Depends on the state too. Here no EGR no-pass.

[jwibbity]

Cats-Pass
Air Injection-N/A
PCV-Pass
Unleaded Gas Restrictor-Pass
EGR-Pass
Thermostatic Air Control-N/A
Fuel Evap-Pass
O2 Sensors-Pass
Gas Cap-Pass

I dont see how swapping in the 6r will affect any of these systems, or maybe I'm missing something...:confused:

[jwibbity]

Depends on the state too. Here no EGR no-pass.

Do they check under the hood or just OBD-II??

I just posted my results from my last inspection ^^^^^^and I got a "pass" for EGR even though it's deleted, maybe Jeff & Marty worked some magic in there

[lifespeed]

I dont see how swapping in the 6r will affect any of these systems, or maybe I'm missing something...:confused:

The PCM transmission control won't work and would have to be disabled, which will be queried during most state inspections. Depending on the state, they won't tolerate too much to be disabled. Underhood checks are part of many inspections, certainly are in California.

[Lowndex]

Depends on the state too. Here no EGR no-pass.

Put the EGR on, load SCT tune "Emissions" and pass the test.

Then take off the EGR, load tune and get back to having fun.

[Marauderjack]

As long as you don't have to turn off any CELs.. I can't pass emissions with the manual because we had to turn off 8 trans codes in the tune.

I spoke with the head guy for USEPA vehicular emissions and while an understanding nice guy he said that it still goes back to tampering even though I can get way better fuel economy with what I've done.

So **** it. I disabled every single item except cats now. I tried to play by the rules.


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How do you get by now Bob??

SC abandoned inspections years ago.......lost money and accomplished nothing!!!:beer:

[justbob]

How do you get by now Bob??



SC abandoned inspections years ago.......lost money and accomplished nothing!!!:beer:


I have it registered at my summer home (that I let a Buddy on here buy and live at [emoji6]) farther west in the state where they don't deal with emissions. Yet. Even my insurance guy had no issues with it being under a different address.

It's been two years but I don't see it lasting forever. I'm afraid the day will eventually come when I will have to let her go to rid the headaches of owning a car that sees less mileage than any other in my city..


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[Marauderjack]

I have it registered at my summer home (that I let a Buddy on here buy and live at [emoji6]) farther west in the state where they don't deal with emissions. Yet. Even my insurance guy had no issues with it being under a different address.

It's been two years but I don't see it lasting forever. I'm afraid the day will eventually come when I will have to let her go to rid the headaches of owning a car that sees less mileage than any other in my city..


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DIBS!!!!!:beer::burnout::D

[Mike M]

I just insured mine as "collector" and no more emissions for me. It would have passed anyway but still.

[96gt4.6]

O.R. staffed, patient prepped for surgery.

Begin Phase 2.

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160103_140847_zpscgciqkn0.jp g

[Bad_S55]

WOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!

[2,4shofast]

Looking forward to updates!!!:beer:

[Drewstang]

Turbo install?

[96gt4.6]

Turbo install?

Yes sir!

The UPS truck should be making a few deliveries this week, fabrication of the hot side beginning this weekend.

Looking forward to my transition back into the boost life!

Can Ford Beat Chevy? We're going to find out! My old Vic trapped 122 through the 1/4 on a stock 2005 6.0L Silverado 2500 motor, 14psi/VP101 Race Gas, 10 degrees timing, at 4200 lbs race weight. This video was on a stock stall converter with no boost until about 40' out. MPH was good for low 11's if she could hook up on a boost launch.

I'm aiming for 11 anything on 9psi/pump 91 octane with the Marauder. Vic was 14psi/race fuel in the video below, with very conservative timing so I didn't hurt the motor being all stock. This should be interesting! From what I've seen, with the 4v Coyote via others, it appears to make more HP per lb of boost than the GEN 3 bowtie's did, which makes sense with the head flow data. Only time will tell! We shall see here shortly.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FPDvf1I07GQ

[Zack]

I went 11.60 with a vortech and 10psi.
I'm pretty sure you'll be in the 11's or better

[Drewstang]

What brand turbo and size?

[96gt4.6]

I went 11.60 with a vortech and 10psi.
I'm pretty sure you'll be in the 11's or better

I'd be perfectly ok with those results!


What brand turbo and size?

I went with the On3 78/76, this would be the same as my Malibu and Vic build.

[Drewstang]

Any oil seal / burning oil issues with either LS setup? I've seen some local on3 turbos leaking oil but they were the older design.

[96gt4.6]

Any oil seal / burning oil issues with either LS setup? I've seen some local on3 turbos leaking oil but they were the older design.

Luckily, I have not. My Vic was driven in completed form for about 10k miles and over a year and a half with no issues. The Malibu I owned for a much shorter period of about 4 months, but nothing to report there either.

Hopefully, my success with this particular turbo, will hold true onto this project as well.

[96gt4.6]

Random photos before teardown taken last weekend. Car has nearly 1k miles since the swap was completed, most of which was accumulated between September and October. Final inspection for other issues before proceeding with fabrication this evening:

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160103_104442_zpsmgzc1m8b.jp g

RH Side shorty header, fits very well. I had to heat and bend the flange inward about 2 inches to clear the Marauder frame. I'm a FIRM believer that when you swap a car, you do everything you can to maintain the OE frame and body/structure as best possible:

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160103_104426_zpskzveg752.jp g

LH side Mustang shorty. Only modification was slight flattening of one of the primary tubes by the steering shaft, maybe 1/16" at best:

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160103_104417_zpsxznbkif9.jp g

Trans cooler line adaptation and Marauder shift linkage adaptation:

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160103_104412_zpsilkhimoc.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160103_104349_zps91qrzrqm.jp g

Here's a money shot, the 6R80/Stock Marauder Cross Member and trans mount:

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160103_104338_zpsqwdlkylp.jp g

Easily converted return style fuel system using an '02 Grand Marquis hanger sender:

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160103_104509_zpscmcx6tpy.jp g

And here is where it begins. I should have a shot of this partially hung late this evening or early tomorrow morning. At this time, the system is going to be laid out exactly as the Crown Vic. RH side stays a factory shorty header, crossover under the bellhousing/trans area, into the back of a custom built manifold on the LH side, continuing down the LH cylinder head forward while connecting to the LH exhaust ports, turning up at the front of the head to the turbo flange. Down pipe will fit perfectly underneath the Master Cylinder and exit out right where the stock LH manifold did. From there I will Y it out to the Marauder's dual exhaust, albeit through dual tube style race mufflers over the stock Marauder mufflers. She'll finally have some real bite to that exhaust note.

More to come!

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160108_161600_zpsrrxgcfnn.jp g

[Joe Walsh]

Clean install!.....:bows:

Glad to see the OEM 'soda straw' mid pipes are being replaced!

[96gt4.6]

Clean install!.....:bows:

Glad to see the OEM 'soda straw' mid pipes are being replaced!

Thank you Joe!

I agree. Part of me would love to have seen if there was any improvement on the E/T and MPH by getting rid of the stock exhaust in favor of the proper diameter exhaust to match the Coyote Mustang, which was 2.5" if my measurements were correct on a stock Mustang.

The stock Mustang shorty headers exit to a 3" flange opening, so i've stepped it down from 3" to 2" with my fabricated connecting pipes, and not to mention the stock Marauder mufflers probably aren't the best flowing above the factory motor, which we are around 130 or so HP above at this time by the numbers.

One of the biggest issues going into the Turbo phase of this swap was keeping the same seamless driveability and engine controls. Obviously, changing the exhaust stream around presents issues with O2 sensors, especially when running 2 sensors on a combined system. Luckily, the Copperhead ECU is capable of allowing me to do exactly what I was wanting to, with no compromise to it's constant closed loop fuel control and wideband capabilities.

Eric @ HPT has been very helpful on that ordeal, as well as some others on my turbo design thread, located here:

http://www.hptuners.com/forum/showthread.php?54799-Coyote-5-0L-Single-Turbo-Advice/page2

Happily accepting the help when given, and part of the reason I enjoy sharing my builds so often, is the support the community provides.

[96gt4.6]

And here we go!

First up, I need the flange from this factory manifold. They have an exceptionally thick flange, perfect for building my custom header/log manifold for the turbo:

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160109_193813_zpsf8kz6to3.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160109_194618_zpsalofgr13.jp g

I enjoy doing fabrication. Here's what you start with on the hot side, minus down pipe and muffler/y pipe:
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160109_201016_zpstysl6ahh.jp g

I had to remove the ABS pump, it will be relocated to the open spot where the factory Air Box used to be after i'm finished with the hot and cold side tubing.

Here she is all mounted in her final home. Log manifold partially complete:

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160110_154211_zpsjm4qnr8c.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160110_154216_zpsldyzk0pv.jp g

Kind of a short work day today, next weekend will yield some major progress.

[Seneca]

And here we go!

First up, I need the flange from this factory manifold. They have an exceptionally thick flange, perfect for building my custom header/log manifold for the turbo:

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160109_193813_zpsf8kz6to3.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160109_194618_zpsalofgr13.jp g

I enjoy doing fabrication. Here's what you start with on the hot side, minus down pipe and muffler/y pipe:
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160109_201016_zpstysl6ahh.jp g

I had to remove the ABS pump, it will be relocated to the open spot where the factory Air Box used to be after i'm finished with the hot and cold side tubing.

Here she is all mounted in her final home. Log manifold partially complete:

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160110_154211_zpsjm4qnr8c.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160110_154216_zpsldyzk0pv.jp g

Kind of a short work day today, next weekend will yield some major progress. makes me feel really bad about my drawn out build...looking great! !

[Zack]

makes me feel really bad about my drawn out build...looking great! !

Yours is in a different league

[Zack]

Pics of the manifold plz

[96gt4.6]

makes me feel really bad about my drawn out build...looking great! !

Thank you sir! We all have our own methods, procedures and time line for completion. Some of the best words I've ever been told were that it's YOUR project, therefore the time it takes, and how it turns out, is entirely at your pace. Car loos killer, and when it's done, and i'm confident you'll be very pleased with the outcome!


Yours is in a different league

I agree, twins would be quite the under taking, most certainly a bit more to handle on install.


Pics of the manifold plz

I'll get some up when it's done and completed for everyone. I'm about 1/2 completed at the moment. It will have the same design as the Vic's manifold, here:

https://youtu.be/GA4_nimv50s

[96gt4.6]

It's STILL kind of odd to me to see these things doing such work on these boost numbers. Of course, I'm used to playing with the 'dark side' motors on boost which require a little more to produce the same results.

I could only HOPE my results are even close to many of the turbo setups that are cropping up now that these have been in production for a while.

Take it as you will, this video claims to be a stock motor, automatic, running E85 on 10psi. Single Turbo, on the 20" wheels:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5x1H_blqK0

Like I said from the beginning, honestly, 11 anything in this girl and i'm good!

[96gt4.6]

Zack, here's the kit I made for the Malibu. The Coyote will be very similar. The Log mani in the upper RH is what this car has, although, it's more of a work of art compared to this kit.....simply due to the space constraints!

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/1909635_10202573678758645_7625 936404426835903_n_zpsmoin6lyu. jpg

[2,4shofast]

I love seeing the progress on this build! Keep it coming:burnout:

[lifespeed]

What alloy are you using, 316 or 321?

[96gt4.6]

I love seeing the progress on this build! Keep it coming:burnout:

Thank you sir, I appreciate it and will certainly keep truckin' on!


What alloy are you using, 316 or 321?

Neither actually, I have always used 16 gauge mild steel, VHT painted and wrapped.

[96gt4.6]

Well I failed you guys on the promise. I had hoped to get up some very nice pics of the hot side by this morning, but fell short on my completion goals. The turbo header is complete, as well as the cross over pipe. Working on the down pipe/mid pipe and muffers/connections to the stock tips right now. I would snap a few pics, but I know how good the internet is at roasting especially when pics of unfinished products are involved ;).

Come this time next week, I should have some very good shots of the system, and be very close, if not, done with the hot side! It's moving along very well at this point.

[96gt4.6]

Getting closer. A little preview:

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160117_110737_zpsgc39f3qq.jp g

[guspech750]

Looking pretty darn nice.


Sent from The White House on taxpayers dimes.

[Turbov6Bryan]

Where are you going to mount the external wastegate?

If you plan to run low boost, try mounting the gate at an angle so it catches more air. If you just mount it at a 90 to your pipe, you might not get the low boost you need. 40 50 60 mm gate? Are you planning on dumping the gate into the down pipe so it's nice and quiet?

Really cool build man!

Can't wait for the down pipe, looks like there's a little room LOL

[Zack]

The down pipe is one of the easiest components to this, as it was to mine.
There is ample room under the brake booster to sneak a pipe down beneath the body and frame
I used a 3.5, I believe he is using a 3

[96gt4.6]

Where are you going to mount the external wastegate?

If you plan to run low boost, try mounting the gate at an angle so it catches more air. If you just mount it at a 90 to your pipe, you might not get the low boost you need. 40 50 60 mm gate? Are you planning on dumping the gate into the down pipe so it's nice and quiet?

Really cool build man!

Can't wait for the down pipe, looks like there's a little room LOL

Thanks Bryan!

I run a 38mm gate, mounted between the crossover and down pipe where they pass beside each other right underneath the driver side floor pan/firewall. So far, I've had good luck with this method with boost control and longevity, so we'll see how it works out on the 5.0L. I have been able to go as low as 2 psi, and as high as 16 psi on previous builds, granted they were Turbo Chevy LS small block setups.

As Zack stated, there really is a lot of room but the pics make it look deceptive. Here's the video of my Vic build, and you can see the layout of the system, which this system follows:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DHznW9ORGNM



The down pipe is one of the easiest components to this, as it was to mine.
There is ample room under the brake booster to sneak a pipe down beneath the body and frame
I used a 3.5, I believe he is using a 3

That is correct Zack, the DP is 3" diameter, and I completely agree, once you're onto the DP fabrication, it's all gravy from there.....building that turbo manifold was as usual the most time consuming part, but she clears everything nicely. I'm REALLY hoping to have it all painted/wrapped and ready for some photo action by Sunday, but we'll see how far I get.

[8UWITH6]

Do you plan on bringing the car to Kansas City in June when the Hot Rod Power Tour comes through?

[96gt4.6]

Do you plan on bringing the car to Kansas City in June when the Hot Rod Power Tour comes through?

That would be nice, unfortunately I don't think it will be a reality with all the other events I am (hopefully) able to make it to this year.

There are just too many variables at this time to be able to commit to anything. I'm not entirely sure what I will run up against during tuning, what mechanical failures may ensue, and ultimately what budget I have during the course of this race season.

However, I really would enjoy making it up to hang out with everyone up there, seems like a very cool group of guys!

[8UWITH6]

No worries. You are always welcome here if you make the trip. Do what you have to do. :)

[lifespeed]

I run a 38mm gate, mounted between the crossover and down pipe where they pass beside each other right underneath the driver side floor pan/firewall. So far, I've had good luck with this method with boost control and longevity, so we'll see how it works out on the 5.0L. I have been able to go as low as 2 psi, and as high as 16 psi on previous builds, granted they were Turbo Chevy LS small block setups.

Can the new PCM speak boost? Can you map a boost controller output using the PCM? It certainly is good to be able to control it electronically, and from the PCM itself (throttle position, RPM) rather than a simple max boost wastegate pneumatic control.

The setup I used years a go was a solenoid cycling between manifold pressure and atmosphere using a PWM output from the PCM (aftermarket Autronics unit) with the resulting controlled pressure applied against the wastegate diaphragm. Electronic control pneumatically actuated.

[96gt4.6]

Can the new PCM speak boost? Can you map a boost controller output using the PCM? It certainly is good to be able to control it electronically, and from the PCM itself (throttle position, RPM) rather than a simple max boost wastegate pneumatic control.

The setup I used years a go was a solenoid cycling between manifold pressure and atmosphere using a PWM output from the PCM (aftermarket Autronics unit) with the resulting controlled pressure applied against the wastegate diaphragm. Electronic control pneumatically actuated.

To my knowledge there isn't an output I could use on the ECU for this function. However, my wide band is gauge/controller will be capable of such functions. I will be most likely using the E Boost line of gauges for a controller/boost gauge.

However, initially I will be relying on the spring pressure of the waste gate for boost control. It's worked very well in the past for me.

Great idea though! And in all honesty, there may be an output on the ECU i'm not aware of, however MAP pressure is inferred on these ECU's so I don't believe it can read boost whatsoever.

[justbob]

To my knowledge there isn't an output I could use on the ECU for this function. However, my wide band is gauge/controller will be capable of such functions. I will be most likely using the E Boost line of gauges for a controller/boost gauge.



However, initially I will be relying on the spring pressure of the waste gate for boost control. It's worked very well in the past for me.



Great idea though! And in all honesty, there may be an output on the ECU i'm not aware of, however MAP pressure is inferred on these ECU's so I don't believe it can read boost whatsoever.


I rely on a 50MM Tial to blow off enough boost to atmosphere at anything above 5#s to keep me under 19#s. This works very well until around 6,000RPMS and the F-1 is simply building and building. I've risked it up 6,300 or so and backed out of it as it was tripping past 20#s on 93 pump.

With the 110 gas I replace the spring with a solid piece of pipe and good god it comes on fast! 26#s at only 6,000 RPM, then the clutch slips. No idea of its full potential?


Sent from my iThrone using Tapatalk

[lifespeed]

To my knowledge there isn't an output I could use on the ECU for this function. However, my wide band is gauge/controller will be capable of such functions. I will be most likely using the E Boost line of gauges for a controller/boost gauge.

However, initially I will be relying on the spring pressure of the waste gate for boost control. It's worked very well in the past for me.

Great idea though! And in all honesty, there may be an output on the ECU i'm not aware of, however MAP pressure is inferred on these ECU's so I don't believe it can read boost whatsoever.

The PCM is not the same as used on ecoboost trucks?

[chief455]

The PCM is not the same as used on ecoboost trucks?
forgive my ignorance here, but wouldn't the PCM also need a MAP sensor designed to signal boost pressure and vacuum?

[lifespeed]

forgive my ignorance here, but wouldn't the PCM also need a MAP sensor designed to signal boost pressure and vacuum?

Yes, and my understanding is Ford ecoboost trucks have a MAP sensor. I can't imagine how it would be possible to correctly control a modern turbo engine without the PCM reading and controlling the pressure in the manifold.

I was surprised to learn our 4.6L doesn't have a MAP sensor.

[chief455]

Yes, and my understanding is Ford ecoboost trucks have a MAP sensor. I can't imagine how it would be possible to correctly control a modern turbo engine without the PCM reading and controlling the pressure in the manifold.

I was surprised to learn our 4.6L doesn't have a MAP sensor.
how did the 03/04 Cobra regulate fuel etc during boost? Maybe copy that?
I guess, given this is a 5.0 Coyote, we are derailing the thread though.

[lifespeed]

how did the 03/04 Cobra regulate fuel etc during boost? Maybe copy that?
I guess, given this is a 5.0 Coyote, we are derailing the thread though.

My point was the donor vehicle for this build, 2012 F150, was also offered with a 3.5L twin turbo. I guess I don't know if they use the same PCM.

[96gt4.6]

forgive my ignorance here, but wouldn't the PCM also need a MAP sensor designed to signal boost pressure and vacuum?

Not necessarily, there are many ways to get the ECU what it needs. How it's currently being accomplished is via keeping the MAF sensor in play as a blow-through setup. The PCM actually inferrs MAP pressure on the Copperhead ECU. I have a MAP pid, but it's all inferred off of MAF data and the other various inputs.

Getting the ECU to read boost, won't be the issue here. A lot of times, the answers to some of these questions have been tackled by others. My thought process, there are many bolt on turbo/supercharger kits for the Mustang out there, all of which use the stock ECU with no MAP and all are blow-through MAF setups with the stock MAF. After looking at the tunes that come with these kits, you can see how it's being accomplished rather well.

Good discussion though guys, they are valid points!



My point was the donor vehicle for this build, 2012 F150, was also offered with a 3.5L twin turbo. I guess I don't know if they use the same PCM.

You are correct on one aspect, but not the other. Unfortunately the EcoBoost trucks use a TC-1797 (TriCore) PCM, and the Coyote's use a Copperhead ECU, which unfortunately are two totally different worlds both program wise, and pin out wise. It wouldn't even be possible to use that ECU. I see the 2015+ Pickups appear to use the same ECU as their EcoBoost counterpart though, at least by physical comparison, so for anyone using a 2015+ ECU I believe this idea might work. However, last I knew, the EPATS cannot be disabled on a 2015+ as of yet.

[96gt4.6]

how did the 03/04 Cobra regulate fuel etc during boost? Maybe copy that?
I guess, given this is a 5.0 Coyote, we are derailing the thread though.

Not much can be done with that data. The ECU's between those cars, and the Cobra's or any older EEC-V are entirely different programming wise from the Copperhead ECU the Coyote uses.

Appreciate the input though!

[hotford]

how did the 03/04 Cobra regulate fuel etc during boost? Maybe copy that?
I guess, given this is a 5.0 Coyote, we are derailing the thread though.

Every vehicle from from that has been boosted from 2003 and up have both maf and map sensors, most have two IAT as well......

[96gt4.6]

Every vehicle from from that has been boosted from 2003 and up have both maf and map sensors, most have two IAT as well......

This is not entirely true, and not trying to be offensive, just correcting the statement.

Most all EcoBoost 3.5's are entirely speed density with no MAF sensor, there are some exceptions in the early 3.5L EcoBoost F150's however.

A good example would be the Taurus SHO Models with the 3.5L Eco. They have no MAF sensor whatsoever, as well as my 2015 F150 3.5L Eco has no MAF.

They do however, have two (and in some cases 3) MAP sensors and at least 2 IAT sensors, but all Eco 3.5L are Speed Density as far as fuel control goes.

[chief455]

This is not entirely true, and not trying to be offensive, just correcting the statement.

Most all EcoBoost 3.5's are entirely speed density with no MAF sensor, there are some exceptions in the early 3.5L EcoBoost F150's however.

A good example would be the Taurus SHO Models with the 3.5L Eco. They have no MAF sensor whatsoever, as well as my 2015 F150 3.5L Eco has no MAF.

They do however, have two (and in some cases 3) MAP sensors and at least 2 IAT sensors, but all Eco 3.5L are Speed Density as far as fuel control goes.

I can uderstand that, having run speed density on my 93 LT-1 cars. Reading air intake via speed density or mass air flow, PCM can chnge instantly. For boost, how else could the PCM know the engine fuel/spark needs instantly without reading manifold pressure? Opposed to reading boost pressure and reacting at the PCM (too late, I'd think). my feable thoughts - and I'm done.
great read, love this thread!

[lifespeed]

A comparison of engine management schemes:

Speed density with MAP only and narrowband O2 was the first and easiest to implement sensor-wise, think 5.0 Ford V8 from the late 1980's. Pretty decent control, simple and cheap. Downside was imperfect air mass calculation from RPM, MAP and volumetric efficiency especially clean emissions when operating at open-loop power levels. Power was good, but it was imperfect for efficiency and emissions. This was great for turbo engines as a MAF did not need to be included in the plumbing and it provided the necessary wastegate control input as well.

MAF (with optional MAP)and narrowband O2 has better mixture control as at measures exactly how much air is mixing with the fuel rather than a speed-density estimation. This is our 4.6L V8. It didn't take long to figure out that MAP wasn't strictly necessary in this config, but some cars have it. It is desirable to have MAP also in boosted cars using MAF if you have electronic control of the boost as it is a more direct control loop. This setup is more efficient than speed density, and could have a marginal power improvement to the extent the open-loop tune can result in a more accurate mixture. A good speed-density tune can be very close in power.

Wideband O2 (http://www.superchevy.com/how-to/engines-drivetrain/0407sc-bosch/) and MAP like the current Ford Ecoboost or Cadillac LF turbo engines. The MAF-calculated air input to the table is replace with a combustion result measurement on the output side. Efficiency and emissions are optimized, and this continues to work at all mixture levels and throttle settings, resulting in excellent mixture accuracy at loads that were open-loop with the previous two systems. MAP is used for turbo control and open-loop fuel mapping refined with O2 data. This is the best of all worlds.

[Ltngdrvr]

96GT4.6, joined this forum so I could comment on this thread.

Don't own a Panther any more, let my '04 CVPI go a year ago, but was doing research on a Coyote/6R80 swap for my Mustang and found this thread as I searched.

This was the first thread I found dealing with using the 6R80 with the Coyote, and it has given me what I needed, confirmation that the swap is not only possible but practical as well.

Great thread full of very useful info, even for me, even though I'm not working with a Panther platform.

Thanks!

Oh, by the way, just FYI, the exhaust on the 11+ Coyote Mustangs is a bit of a jumble, it is mostly 2.75" diameter, but has a section just behind the cats that necks down to 2.5" then back up to the 2.75 size.

[96gt4.6]

96GT4.6, joined this forum so I could comment on this thread.

Don't own a Panther any more, let my '04 CVPI go a year ago, but was doing research on a Coyote/6R80 swap for my Mustang and found this thread as I searched.

This was the first thread I found dealing with using the 6R80 with the Coyote, and it has given me what I needed, confirmation that the swap is not only possible but practical as well.

Great thread full of very useful info, even for me, even though I'm not working with a Panther platform.

Thanks!

Oh, by the way, just FYI, the exhaust on the 11+ Coyote Mustangs is a bit of a jumble, it is mostly 2.75" diameter, but has a section just behind the cats that necks down to 2.5" then back up to the 2.75 size.

Interesting! I did not look at the entire system on the '12 I had here in the shop for comparison purposes as far as the entire exhaust system, just the front 1/2.

I'm glad that I am able to help, which is the primary purpose of this build thread. It's how I was helped many times on past builds myself, so it's only right I share as much as I can to help others.

I know I had promised pictures this last weekend, but i'm saving up a special surprise for you all, hopefully that will be up by this coming weekend. :cool4:

[hotford]

This is not entirely true, and not trying to be offensive, just correcting the statement.

Most all EcoBoost 3.5's are entirely speed density with no MAF sensor, there are some exceptions in the early 3.5L EcoBoost F150's however.

A good example would be the Taurus SHO Models with the 3.5L Eco. They have no MAF sensor whatsoever, as well as my 2015 F150 3.5L Eco has no MAF.

They do however, have two (and in some cases 3) MAP sensors and at least 2 IAT sensors, but all Eco 3.5L are Speed Density as far as fuel control goes.

indeed your correct didnt think they went away from the maf sensor to map....
2012 3.5 eco boost........

Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor
Catalyst Monitor Sensor (CMS)
Crankshaft Position (CKP) Sensor
Cylinder Head Temperature (CHT) Sensor
Fuel Rail Pressure (FRP) Sensor — 3.5L Gasoline Turbocharged Direct Injection (GTDI)
Heated Oxygen Sensor (HO2S)
Intake Air Temperature (IAT) Sensor — 3.5L GTDI
Knock Sensor (KS)
Manifold Absolute Pressure (MAP) /Intake Air Temperature 2 (IAT2) Sensor — 3.5L GTDI
Mass Air Flow (MAF) Sensor — 3.7L, 5.0L (4V) and 6.2L (2V)
PCM
Turbocharger Boost Pressure (TCBP) /Charge Air Cooler (CAC) Sensor — 3.5L GTDI
Variable Camshaft Timing (VCT) Oil Control Valve — 3.5L GTDI and 3.7L
VCT Variable Force Solenoid — 5.0L (4V) and 6.2L (2V)
__________________

[lifespeed]

indeed your correct didnt think they went away from the maf sensor to map....

The key difference is the upgrade to wideband O2 sensors, they could not have dispensed with the MAF without them.

[96gt4.6]

The Coyote Copperhead ECU takes this a step further as well, it has a MAF, but no MAP. MAP is inferred based off of MAF flow and some complex quadratic equations. The flexibility of the stock PCM is very nice, tuning the Coyote was VERY simple once you grasp the general concept of where and how things work.

The constant closed loop fuel control is great, you simply type in the target AFR you want to achieve, and off you go!

I'm really excited to play with this system on boost!

[lifespeed]

The Coyote Copperhead ECU takes this a step further as well, it has a MAF, but no MAP. MAP is inferred based off of MAF flow and some complex quadratic equations. The flexibility of the stock PCM is very nice, tuning the Coyote was VERY simple once you grasp the general concept of where and how things work.

The constant closed loop fuel control is great, you simply type in the target AFR you want to achieve, and off you go!

I'm really excited to play with this system on boost!

You're saying the Copperhead ECU uses wideband O2 sensors as well?

[96gt4.6]

You're saying the Copperhead ECU uses wideband O2 sensors as well?

Correct.

All Coyote 5.0's are dual wide band equipped.

[hotford]

Correct.

All Coyote 5.0's are dual wide band equipped.

Coorect me if im wrong but didnt all 2011 and up vehciles from Ford went with wide band 02 sensors.

[96gt4.6]

Coorect me if im wrong but didnt all 2011 and up vehciles from Ford went with wide band 02 sensors.

That is correct as well, in fact on some models it was starting to be utilized earlier than that even.

[96gt4.6]

The hot side kit for this car:

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160130_125440_zpsl5gmzx7v.jp g

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160130_161426_zpsawlnxiv1.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160130_161439_zpsdgwergkf.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160130_161511_zpsrxhzfpvk.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160130_161501_zpsmdxxyfju.jp g

And the startup video. I still need to complete the cold side, and am currently finishing exhaust fabrication so this video is open down pipe. This was leak test of the turbo/oiling system and hot side, as well as burn off of the pipe coating and header wrap.

The intake tube was used so I could idle the car as it houses the MAF sensor. Obviously, it's going away shortly as I complete the cold side:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b86OwUCwDNc

Should have some video up next weekend of her new exhaust! She sounds like she'll be a mean girl indeed, you can clearly hear the turbine in the exhaust on revv up.....more to come.

[Seneca]

Looks great man! Very nice! I'm excited to see how it does when it's finished 👍👍👍

[lifespeed]

Looks great! Have you found that pipe wrap helps underhood temps much?

[96gt4.6]

Looks great man! Very nice! I'm excited to see how it does when it's finished ������

Thank you sir! I appreciate that, and i'm also very excited to get it on the road again!


Looks great! Have you found that pipe wrap helps underhood temps much?

Thank You! Yes, with past builds it seems to have worked very well. You can nearly get it right up on top of things with no issues. The radiant heat is cut nearly to nothing. It worked very well on my Vic build, two years of street use and no issues underhood in 100+ degree Kansas heat:

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-cNeN8Zv-NM4/UATgYmlHXzI/AAAAAAAADzY/1lhZ-GrTjuU/s800-Ic42/%25255BUNSET%25255D.jpg

It's interesting to see how similar the turbo placement and down pipe placement is on the two cars!

[mad1stgen]

That manifold is genius. Is it stepped or solid 2.5" throughout the length ?

Looking at the stock piece, you were able to merge the stock primaries into a 45 deg pipe ? Excellent !

[MOTOWN]

Are you going to run an intercooler?

[96gt4.6]

That manifold is genius. Is it stepped or solid 2.5" throughout the length ?

Looking at the stock piece, you were able to merge the stock primaries into a 45 deg pipe ? Excellent !

It is 2.5" all the way through on the hot side, 3" down pipe, then splits to dual 2.5 under the car through two race style turbo tube mufflers, connected to the O.E. Marauder stainless tips. The Turbo manifold is always the hardest part of the build, it's very tedious to get everything to clear, to keep the piping routed to maintain access to the bolts, as well as keep it clear of the steering shaft/ect. I'm willing to venture, there is around 15-20 hours build time in the Turbo manifold, maybe another 15-20 in the rest of the system. Lot of steel cutting and welding!


Are you going to run an intercooler?

Yes. The cold side construction is coming up next. I run a 31"x12"x4 thick intercooler. It's nearly as big as the A/C condenser, and fits nicely in the cavern of a front end on these panthers! I will have pics up when i'm to that point. Right now, i'm working on getting the exhaust finished up, then mounting the ABS module and getting it re connected hydraulically, then on to the cold side. After that, we ready to rumble! Here's the Vic's intercooler during the build phase, A/C condenser removed for fabrication then was re-installed:

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-vL9Odi7GP1w/UDBelbXR10I/AAAAAAAADzY/xJOfaj9TjZM/s800-Ic42/%25255BUNSET%25255D.jpg

[Vortech347]

Wow. Very nice man.

[96gt4.6]

Wow. Very nice man.

Thank you! I'm excited to be over 1/2 done with the install, can't wait to get her on the road again.

Full exhaust all done. All that's original now as far as exhaust goes is the tips. Moving on to the ABS relocate, then onto the cold side!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dzo8SrJpyJ0

[96gt4.6]

All but 2 hard lines left to bend on the ABS relocate, perform the bleed procedure, and i'm finally on to the cold side/intercooler! Won't be long after that she's on the road again.

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160213_211834_zpsu0egm0sg.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160213_211839_zpsdfru2zxl.jp g

[Joe Walsh]

Looks great!
Have you found that pipe wrap helps underhood temps much?


Yes, with past builds it seems to have worked very well.
You can nearly get it right up on top of things with no issues.
The radiant heat is cut nearly to nothing.
It worked very well on my Vic build, two years of street use and no issues underhood in 100+ degree Kansas heat.

Looks like you are using DEI's Titanium heat wrap...

I used that on my wife's Subaru upgraded DOHC Turbo piping.
Wrapped the crossover pipe, up-pipe and 2 feet of the big 3" downpipe with DEI's Titanium heat wrap.
The stuff is really nice and you can almost touch the pipes....even when they are cooking hot.

http://i984.photobucket.com/albums/ae326/JoeJWalsh/2005%20Subaru%20Legacy%20GT%20 wagon/IMG_7019_zpsmoapdhpy.jpg (http://s984.photobucket.com/user/JoeJWalsh/media/2005%20Subaru%20Legacy%20GT%20 wagon/IMG_7019_zpsmoapdhpy.jpg.html)

http://i984.photobucket.com/albums/ae326/JoeJWalsh/2005%20Subaru%20Legacy%20GT%20 wagon/IMG_7016_zpsqukxkadd.jpg (http://s984.photobucket.com/user/JoeJWalsh/media/2005%20Subaru%20Legacy%20GT%20 wagon/IMG_7016_zpsqukxkadd.jpg.html)

[lifespeed]

All but 2 hard lines left to bend on the ABS relocate, perform the bleed procedure, and i'm finally on to the cold side/intercooler! Won't be long after that she's on the road again.


Looks good! That will require the IDS brake bleed for sure :)

[96gt4.6]

Looks like you are using DEI's Titanium heat wrap...

I used that on my wife's Subaru upgraded DOHC Turbo piping.
Wrapped the crossover pipe, up-pipe and 2 feet of the big 3" downpipe with DEI's Titanium heat wrap.
The stuff is really nice and you can almost touch the pipes....even when they are cooking hot.

http://i984.photobucket.com/albums/ae326/JoeJWalsh/2005%20Subaru%20Legacy%20GT%20 wagon/IMG_7019_zpsmoapdhpy.jpg (http://s984.photobucket.com/user/JoeJWalsh/media/2005%20Subaru%20Legacy%20GT%20 wagon/IMG_7019_zpsmoapdhpy.jpg.html)

http://i984.photobucket.com/albums/ae326/JoeJWalsh/2005%20Subaru%20Legacy%20GT%20 wagon/IMG_7016_zpsqukxkadd.jpg (http://s984.photobucket.com/user/JoeJWalsh/media/2005%20Subaru%20Legacy%20GT%20 wagon/IMG_7016_zpsqukxkadd.jpg.html)

Yes sir, that's the stuff! It's worked great in the past and you are indeed correct, it's amazing stuff! Never was a believer in wrap until I tried it.


Looks good! That will require the IDS brake bleed for sure :)

Thank you sir! And yes, I will have to use the OE tool to bleed her out, which should be this weekend by the looks of it.

[96gt4.6]

Allrighty. We have brakes again! Got the system all plumbed up, bled and leak checked. Seems to hold just fine after about 5 minutes of continuous brake pressure with the engine running for full booster assist.

Finally, we are on to the inter cooler side and charge air piping!

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160222_072228_zpsz4xwwdk6.jp g

[Bigslim1]

This is going to be one of baddest MM's on road. The Coyote engine is one of the best to ever come out of Ford. Great way to start a build.

[96gt4.6]

This is going to be one of baddest MM's on road. The Coyote engine is one of the best to ever come out of Ford. Great way to start a build.

Thanks! It should rank as one of the most unique, hopefully!

THIS PIC IS NOT FINAL BUT I WANTED TO SHARE. I have to replace the worm clamps with boost style clamps, and finish connecting the charge air piping , but we're almost there:

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160227_212601_zpsagu0w81c.jp g

We will be on the road, under boost in less than 2 weeks :)

[MOTOWN]

Thanks! It should rank as one of the most unique, hopefully!

THIS PIC IS NOT FINAL BUT I WANTED TO SHARE. I have to replace the worm clamps with boost style clamps, and finish connecting the charge air piping , but we're almost there:

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160227_212601_zpsagu0w81c.jp g

We will be on the road, under boost in less than 2 weeks :)

Looks outstanding! :bows: Very well done.

[Marauderjack]

Can you not "clock" the turbo volute around to connect to the intake pipe??:confused:

[Zack]

The only thing I would do different is relocate the MAF
It's going to be way to close to a 90 degree bend.

Other then that, outstanding!

[96gt4.6]

Can you not "clock" the turbo volute around to connect to the intake pipe??:confused:

I'm running an inter cooler with this system, and the rest of the charge piping is not yet in place, so there might be a little confusion simply looking at the pics.......haha.


The only thing I would do different is relocate the MAF
It's going to be way to close to a 90 degree bend.

Other then that, outstanding!


Thanks Zack! I agree, having a radius right before the MAF usually isn't a good idea.....and if it presents a problem after I get it up and running, I have a nice straight section of charge pipe i'm going to place it in down stream.

for simplicity, i'm hoping my previous experience with MAF placement will carry true on this build. Usually the MAF curve has to be tweaked a little for these configurations, but I have found having an air straightener on the MAF inlet, aids a LOT. As you can see, my MAF tube has one on this build, and the stock GM MAF have them, as pictured here in my Vic's build. On the Vic, the situation was most certainly.....far from ideal!!! haha:

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/UNSET_zpsk4yvig1g.jpg


Surprisingly, the system worked fine like that......and I will agree, I didn't expect it to at first!

[96gt4.6]

Many more pics to post tonight, here's the teaser video!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ohh54xVCGHU

At this time, I believe this to be THE first Coyote Powered, 6R80, Turbocharged, Mercury Marauder. However, that is unconfirmed.

More coming soon!

[Marauderjack]

BEAUTIFUL!!!:bows:

[myrodr]

wow!!! You work crazy fast. Looking for the first time slip :)

[96gt4.6]

Thank you guys! It's been a long road, ready to finally get her on the street again and see what the new setup feels like!

She's tight, but actually it ended out not as tight as I had originally envisioned:

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160228_145244_zpsmwxgy29f.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160228_145250_zpsgdjs2s8e.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160228_145253_zpsaavtr1ph.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160228_145316_zps6l6z5pyb.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160228_145619_zpso2vdypri.jp g

Some of the things in those pics are not final, just some quick pics today to get posted. Should be all finalized by next weekend, followed by a boost gauge/wideband installation, then some basic tuning to kick things off!

[babbage]

very nice neat and clean job - work of art! can't wait to see it driving/dyno!!

[Bigslim1]

Great job. After driving a few turbo cars I think turbos are so cool. Can't wait to hear how it works out.

[Ltngdrvr]

96gt4.6, I sent you a pm, did you get it?

[daddyusmaximus]

Seriously complicated engineering going on here. Nicely done.

[96gt4.6]

96gt4.6, I sent you a pm, did you get it?

Just got ya replied to sir! Sorry, I must have some settings wrong as I didn't get a notification e-mail.

Again, thank you ALL for the kind words on the build! We're almost to the fun part of this build, which is tuning/driving!

Should have the wideband/boost controller here tomorrow, I went with this unit on this build, it seems like a great piece and has a lot of great features:

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/Screenshot_2016-03-01-07-55-31_zpsqi3inkdx.png

Got all the couplers on, boost clamps on. All that's left is to install the turbo blanket, and some minor plumbing for that controller/waste gate and BOV hook up:

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160302_195544_zpsjgbqbll4.jp g

Started up everything this evening, did some data logging and so far so good. The system is functioning off of 1 (RH side) wide band sensor as per the advice from Eric@HP Tuners. VERY grateful for his continued support on this! :bows:

Ordering up a set of Injector Dynamics injectors here shortly to handle the fueling, as well as either change out the in-tank, or go with a voltage booster for the existing pump.

We will have road video within the next 2 weeks! Man, it's almost time to break out the GoPro and have some fun! This guy, is getting excited! :banana:

[MOTOWN]

Who stole the LIKE button?

[Zack]

I'd like to see pics of the turbo drain circuit

[MMBLUE]

Like so many others, I have been following this post. Sir, your attention to detail and auto wizardry is simply amazing.

In the beginning I was extremely outspoken of your original intent to put cheby in it. I am pleased that you kept the build under the blue oval. Kudo's

[96gt4.6]

Who stole the LIKE button?

Haha, indeed! Thank you!


I'd like to see pics of the turbo drain circuit

No problem Zack, here's what I had a chance to grab this morning. The drain is -10 stainless braided, pretty much goes straight down, then arch's towards the front of the oil pan. This Moroso pan had previsions for a drain already in place in the front of the pan so that's where the drain goes to. I tried to get some good shots, but without it on a lift, it was difficult. Please forgive the uncleanliness of the engine bay at present, it's literally a fresh build and I have yet to go back and detail:

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160303_072054_zpsb4i6u33m.jp g

The charge piping is visible in this pic:

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160303_071840_zpsxg4y1j7q.jp g


Like so many others, I have been following this post. Sir, your attention to detail and auto wizardry is simply amazing.

In the beginning I was extremely outspoken of your original intent to put cheby in it. I am pleased that you kept the build under the blue oval. Kudo's

Thank you sir! I'm glad it's all Blue Oval.....ya the cross breeding stuff was fun, and still ran great as well, but in the end not as unique as this turned out to be.

I have yet to go back and Multi-Quote a lot of this thread, and probably never will simply due to it's length, but way back in the beginning I recall some asking about the $$ to swap Chevy V. Ford. I have a VERY detailed build sheet on this car, as I did the Vic, and I can most certainly say the Ford is still more expensive both in terms of cost for components, and time invested for the installation/fabrication.

However, it's my belief that the return in terms of HP will be a little stronger. All motor, this setup was producing around 450 flywheel HP by the weight/trap speed, something even the 6.2L Bowtie would be taxed to do all stock.

It's my understanding from my research so far, the Coyote lb/lb of boost vs. the Chevy, has the upper hand as well. Not to mention, going this route I have a 6 speed auto and stronger transmission than the 4L80 I was going to install (yes, the 80 is tough i'm aware, but not in bone stock form like this Ford 6R80).

Everyone's opinion is always welcome, and in the beginning I wasn't as receptive of yours and some as I should have been. I'm grateful for the bold and direct approach that you, Zack and others have presented. I'll try and uphold the image I've hopefully created by this build, and hopefully can out-run my old Vic's times/trap speed on less boost, and cubes for that matter.

[blkZooM]

I don't care what direction you went, I'm just happy you went. Very nice and informative build thread, wish someone would just build a damn stand alone for that 6r80


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[kennytent]

I don't care what direction you went, I'm just happy you went. Very nice and informative build thread, wish someone would just build a damn stand alone for that 6r80


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
PA is supposed to have one. At PRI, they said beginning of the year.

[lifespeed]

I find I am re-reading this thread with even more interest after spinning a rod bearing in my original engine. It is an appealing alternative to rebuilding (and supercharging) the 4.6L. Unfortunately I don't think I am quite the superhero mechanic. I can remove and re-install an engine easy enough, but the Coyote retrofit looks involved, even though your pioneering work is a huge help.

I also thought about a 3.5L V6 with upgraded turbos. Should be good for 500+ HP, a lighter car and 50/50 weight distributuion.

[Zack]

I find I am re-reading this thread with even more interest after spinning a rod bearing in my original engine. It is an appealing alternative to rebuilding (and supercharging) the 4.6L. Unfortunately I don't think I am quite the superhero mechanic. I can remove and re-install an engine easy enough, but the Coyote retrofit looks involved, even though your pioneering work is a huge help.

I also thought about a 3.5L V6 with upgraded turbos. Should be good for 500+ HP, a lighter car and 50/50 weight distributuion.

Retro-fitting the Coyote is incredibly simple compared to other swaps.

I watched him the entire process and said, "I wish my Lincoln was that easy"

[lifespeed]

Retro-fitting the Coyote is incredibly simple compared to other swaps.

I watched him the entire process and said, "I wish my Lincoln was that easy"

As described by another great Marauder builder. :D

I should give it serious consideration.

[MOTOWN]

If i had it to do all over again it would be a Coyote Aluminator motor hands down.

[lji372]

If i had it to do all over again it would be a Coyote Aluminator motor hands down.

do it!!!!!!!!!!!! :D

[lifespeed]

@96GT4.6;

In retrospect, do you think the motor mount shift 3/4" rearward for oil pan clearance was necessary? It looks like it may have fit anyway, hard to tell from pictures.

[96gt4.6]

PA is supposed to have one. At PRI, they said beginning of the year.

It's my understanding that Ford Racing also revealed a 6R80 control pack at SEMA recently. As far as the availability, I haven't checked in a while but the part # was active, just no availability or pricing (this was a month or so ago). Might be a different story now!


I find I am re-reading this thread with even more interest after spinning a rod bearing in my original engine. It is an appealing alternative to rebuilding (and supercharging) the 4.6L. Unfortunately I don't think I am quite the superhero mechanic. I can remove and re-install an engine easy enough, but the Coyote retrofit looks involved, even though your pioneering work is a huge help.

I also thought about a 3.5L V6 with upgraded turbos. Should be good for 500+ HP, a lighter car and 50/50 weight distributuion.

It's VERY funny you mention that! When I had decided to go Coyote.....I also had started looking at the 3.5 Eco's as well. I mean, seriously. Pricing is nearly identical for both power trains. The 3.5L is a beast.....my '15 with it's current tune, will turn over the front wheels on a boost launch. It's sick. I plan on getting some video up of it, after I get the Marauder up to speed.

There were two reasons that idea got killed. The first, was I just didn't want a Marauder that....sounded like a V6. Idk why that idea bothered me so......but it just didn't sit right with how these cars are.

The second, I knew the Coyote on boost can throw down harder, and has a lot of viable options later on for upgrades (Boss components, huge aftermarket support that is continually growing as far as other motor options/ect).

Those reasons, are the only ones that stopped me. Indeed, it would have been VERY unique, and from driving my '15, I can tell you that it would have been a very fast as well. I'm starting to see Crew Cab setups like mine running 12's with the Eco, with some tuning and fuel! Crazy.


Retro-fitting the Coyote is incredibly simple compared to other swaps.

I watched him the entire process and said, "I wish my Lincoln was that easy"

This is true. From a fitment point of view, getting the motor in was actually the easiest part. The hard part (for most I believe) would have been a lot of the O.E. wiring integration as far as keeping everything functional electrically, in addition to not cobbling up the car doing so.


@96GT4.6;

In retrospect, do you think the motor mount shift 3/4" rearward for oil pan clearance was necessary? It looks like it may have fit anyway, hard to tell from pictures.

It will not. I tried initially. The motor will sit in place, but you literally have like 1/8 to 1/16" maximum clearance between the K and oil pan sump. If you tilt the engine back any, it hits. This presented two problems. First, I couldn't get the drive line angles I needed, and second with the trans in place you had to have the tail so high it hit the tunnel.

The set back, is required with the Moroso oil pan on this swap. Also, if the motor was in the stock location still, the reverse mounted alternator would have hit the O.E. cooling fan shroud/coolant resivoir. Setting it back, made many original components fit perfectly.

The cooling fan/radiator, mounts, everything is still the O.E. Marauder equipment less hoses. I always try to keep the O.E. stuff in play as much as possible, as it presents a more clean, and professional look, I think. But, sometimes this is not always possible.

On a side note, the car is back on the ground! I have the base tune to start with. All I need to do at this point is get the boost gauge/wideband installed, some minor plumbing for it, and begin with the base tune.

In tuning/testing the BOV last night, I was able to achieve nearly 2 psi on a heavy foot brake, and man the throat of finally having some performance exhaust, in addition to hearing the Coyote eat a little boost, was very encouraging! I can't wait to get you guys sound clips of her, the OE mufflers were certainly making her sound tame.

So far, the turbo sizing looks good. Make sense, as my data/sizing theory vs. my previous builds, indicated this setup would work on this combo as well.

Working on getting those videos and some rolling burnout action guys!

[Ltngdrvr]

The ford racing coyote/6r80 control pack will ONLY work with 2015 and later motor/trans according to the guys at ford racing. I went round and round with them just the other day about it. They said the hardware and software is different for the 2015 stuff and isn't backward compatible.

It just doesn't sound reasonable to me, I asked them exactly what was the difference but they either couldn't or wouldn't tell me.

Al, if you have any inside connection that can let you in on the secret, I'd sure like to know what's up with that.

[96gt4.6]

The ford racing coyote/6r80 control pack will ONLY work with 2015 and later motor/trans according to the guys at ford racing. I went round and round with them just the other day about it. They said the hardware and software is different for the 2015 stuff and isn't backward compatible.

It just doesn't sound reasonable to me, I asked them exactly what was the difference but they either couldn't or wouldn't tell me.

Al, if you have any inside connection that can let you in on the secret, I'd sure like to know what's up with that.

Unfortunately i do not.

However, looking at it from my angle I believe I understand where they are coming from on this.

Those products are essentially 'plug and play'. There are some changes such as variable runner control added to the '15 upward Coyote, and a different processor. I have not checked each engine sensor/connector, but if the wiring plugs are the same, the newer control pack harness should plug in properly less the intake runner control.

From that point, it would all be in the tuning. Delete the runner control and set up the tune for the '11-14 Coyote. This however, is complex in itself and would be difficult for even a decent tuning shop. There is a LOT to tuning these, and it gets even worse in '15 upward.

So, rather than open a can of worms, it's easier to market the product to what it's originally intended, as there will be many issues to over come using it on an older Coyote.

I'm sure, someone will tackle and get it eventually, there is just too much demand for this trans to not get something going.......

My method, is very, VERY simple. ESPECIALLY now that Brooks Speed (Eric) has started doing PATS delete on the '11-14 ECU's. It's simply a matter of grabbing the schematic book, and hooking up the necessary pins on the Body plug of the PCM. The Engine and transmission harness, less the power to the VCT system, and O2 sensors, is self contained.

[Ltngdrvr]

Unfortunately i do not.

However, looking at it from my angle I believe I understand where they are coming from on this.

Those products are essentially 'plug and play'. There are some changes such as variable runner control added to the '15 upward Coyote, and a different processor. I have not checked each engine sensor/connector, but if the wiring plugs are the same, the newer control pack harness should plug in properly less the intake runner control.

From that point, it would all be in the tuning. Delete the runner control and set up the tune for the '11-14 Coyote. This however, is complex in itself and would be difficult for even a decent tuning shop. There is a LOT to tuning these, and it gets even worse in '15 upward.

So, rather than open a can of worms, it's easier to market the product to what it's originally intended, as there will be many issues to over come using it on an older Coyote.

I'm sure, someone will tackle and get it eventually, there is just too much demand for this trans to not get something going.......

My method, is very, VERY simple. ESPECIALLY now that Brooks Speed (Eric) has started doing PATS delete on the '11-14 ECU's. It's simply a matter of grabbing the schematic book, and hooking up the necessary pins on the Body plug of the PCM. The Engine and transmission harness, less the power to the VCT system, and O2 sensors, is self contained.

Well, I guess I'm not up on the changes to the coyote in the 15+, so I guess you answered why it won't work for me.

As to adapting the 11-14 pcm and wiring to my car, there won't be any body connection, nothing much like that on a 93 Mustang.

But, you're saying that the engine/trans can easily be setup as stand alone, right? What about getting the OBDII port so a tuner can be connected? That would be part of the body harness on a stock f150 or Mustang wouldn't it?

[96gt4.6]

Well, I guess I'm not up on the changes to the coyote in the 15+, so I guess you answered why it won't work for me.

As to adapting the 11-14 pcm and wiring to my car, there won't be any body connection, nothing much like that on a 93 Mustang.

But, you're saying that the engine/trans can easily be setup as stand alone, right? What about getting the OBDII port so a tuner can be connected? That would be part of the body harness on a stock f150 or Mustang wouldn't it?

Correct. It can be easily set up to stand alone, however you will have to have a relay box. I use this on most of my stand alone harness conversions:

http://www.currentperformance.com/shop/sa-1500-stand-alone-fuserelay-module/

As far as the OBD II port, easy to add in. You have to run two wires from the Coyote computer (CAN + and CAN -), and provide a power and ground to the DLC plug. That's it.

All of the circuits in question are located on the "Body" plug of the Coyote computer. This is the plug that goes to the PDB on the control pack.

[8UWITH6]

Very cool sir. Cannot wait to see the car in person someday.

[96gt4.6]

Very cool sir. Cannot wait to see the car in person someday.

Thank you! And yes, I can't wait to meet up with you guys up that way some time! Seems like a really cool crowd!

Got some driving time today, she spools and everything seems to function....that's a relief to say the least. No exhaust leaks, it was a good feeling after all this work.

Now, on to tuning and then it's relaxation time!

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160306_170338_zpsj1deu282.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160306_170400_zpszpkaqsxh.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160306_170405_zpskrtvunwo.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160306_170809_zpstx3ysgjc.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160306_170813_zpsh1ol1vaf.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160306_170819_zpst3xueacc.jp g


Next up, there will be video! Should be hard into tuning next weekend.

[jflave]

Very nice looks great :beer:

[Gerry24]

Great job, thanks for sharing with us step by step. Bad ass :burn:

[lifespeed]

Looks great, it will be interesting to see the results after it is tuned.

I read that the PATS was a big problem that has since been overcome by disabling it. As far as anti-theft goes it does at least prevent your average dirtbag from stealing your car by ripping out the ignition lock. What are the chances of integrating the OEM Coyote (or Ecoboost) PATS key into the Marauder? Pretty ambitious, but it would be nice.

[Marauderjack]

Retro-fitting the Coyote is incredibly simple compared to other swaps.

I watched him the entire process and said, "I wish my Lincoln was that easy"

Is this a good deal Zack??

http://www.jegs.com/i/Ford+Performance/397/M-6007-M50AK/10002/-1&?utm_source=email&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=20160307email

[justbob]

Looks great, it will be interesting to see the results after it is tuned.

I read that the PATS was a big problem that has since been overcome by disabling it. As far as anti-theft goes it does at least prevent your average dirtbag from stealing your car by ripping out the ignition lock. What are the chances of integrating the OEM Coyote (or Ecoboost) PATS key into the Marauder? Pretty ambitious, but it would be nice.


Mines been off for years. Good insurance is a plus.


Sent from my iThrone using Tapatalk

[96gt4.6]

Looks great, it will be interesting to see the results after it is tuned.

I read that the PATS was a big problem that has since been overcome by disabling it. As far as anti-theft goes it does at least prevent your average dirtbag from stealing your car by ripping out the ignition lock. What are the chances of integrating the OEM Coyote (or Ecoboost) PATS key into the Marauder? Pretty ambitious, but it would be nice.

Yes, the O.E. Marauder PATS is integrated.

If the OE Pats system does not issue the all clear, the car will not start, just like factory. This was easily accomplished via keeping the OE Marauder PCM powered up, and simply using it's starter relay enabler circuit integrated into the Coyote setup.

Will it prevent the car from being stolen? Not by a professional. In fact, the only reason I integrated it, was to follow through with my seamless integration practices when doing swaps.

[96gt4.6]

Timestamp 0:30 illustrates this in my video here, you can see the O.E. PATS light on the Marauder still functional:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QMbXYFjyS2o

[Zack]

Is this a good deal Zack??

http://www.jegs.com/i/Ford+Performance/397/M-6007-M50AK/10002/-1&?utm_source=email&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=20160307email

I dont know.

I wish Coyote's were sold at LSx prices.

[lifespeed]

Mines been off for years. Good insurance is a plus.

"Good" insurance is not available to those who drive their cars more than a couple times a week, unfortunately.


Yes, the O.E. Marauder PATS is integrated.

If the OE Pats system does not issue the all clear, the car will not start, just like factory. This was easily accomplished via keeping the OE Marauder PCM powered up, and simply using it's starter relay enabler circuit integrated into the Coyote setup.

Will it prevent the car from being stolen? Not by a professional. In fact, the only reason I integrated it, was to follow through with my seamless integration practices when doing swaps.

Cool! Yes, I know that nothing stops a thief if they are determined enough. But it can certainly slow them down and stop many of the ordinary criminals.

[Ltngdrvr]

Correct. It can be easily set up to stand alone, however you will have to have a relay box. I use this on most of my stand alone harness conversions:

http://www.currentperformance.com/shop/sa-1500-stand-alone-fuserelay-module/

As far as the OBD II port, easy to add in. You have to run two wires from the Coyote computer (CAN + and CAN -), and provide a power and ground to the DLC plug. That's it.

All of the circuits in question are located on the "Body" plug of the Coyote computer. This is the plug that goes to the PDB on the control pack.

Excellent!

Wish I'd had that fuse/relay module way back when I did my last swap like this, I ended up with a gang of relays on the fenderwell.

Touched base with Eric Brooks on the epats removal, thanks for the referral.

So, it looks like the major roadblocks have been dealt with!

[Ltngdrvr]

Also, I think this fuse/relay module may do better for me as I want my a/c and fans to be integrated into the conversion, http://www.currentperformance.com/shop/stand-alone-fuserelay-module/

[Bigslim1]

Looks great. Nice work. Hope she runs as well as she looks.

[Ltngdrvr]

Al, do you, or will you, have the cruise hooked up and working on the coyote?

I'd like to figure out how to get it working with the steering wheel buttons on my Mustang when the time comes.

[Talal DTR MM]

Very nice looking. Can't wait to see dyno no.s. Your project really helped me a lot in preparing to do swap to my MM. I have question regarding 4R70W tranny, will it fit with coyote engine or not ?

[Ltngdrvr]

I have question regarding 4R70W tranny, will it fit with coyote engine or not ?

Yes, any mod motor trans will bolt up to the Coyote.

[Talal DTR MM]

Yes, any mod motor trans will bolt up to the Coyote.

Without need for aftermarket bell housing?

[Ltngdrvr]

Without need for aftermarket bell housing?

Yes, the back of the 5.0 coyote block is the same pattern as the back of any mod motor V8.

If you have a 4R70w, or 4R75w from a 4.6 motor, it will bolt directly onto the 5.0 coyote as will any manual trans from a 4.6.

And, any 8-bolt mod motor flywheel or flexplate will bolt directly on as well.

[96gt4.6]

Al, do you, or will you, have the cruise hooked up and working on the coyote?

I'd like to figure out how to get it working with the steering wheel buttons on my Mustang when the time comes.

Yes. I'm currently working out the details on getting mine wired up, more info on that to come this summer. The Mustang Coyote simply uses the wheel switches/resistors like the Marauder, the key will be the values which i'm currently working on.


Very nice looking. Can't wait to see dyno no.s. Your project really helped me a lot in preparing to do swap to my MM. I have question regarding 4R70W tranny, will it fit with coyote engine or not ?


Without need for aftermarket bell housing?

He is correct. Bolts right up. In my build video way back when I test fitted the coyote with the 4R70 that was in my car originally. If one wanted to use the stock transmission in these cars with an aftermarket controller, you can literally modify the stock 4.6L mounts like I did, set the power train back the amount I did, and everything will bolt up. The stock transmission cross member bolt holes are slotted, there is no need to modify anything. The trans slip yoke should be fine with the additional set back as well, so literally you would only have to wire the engine up, aftermarket trans controller and you could do only the Coyote engine.

I highly recommend measuring the drive shaft plunge depth to be sure after the install, but i'm confident it will work with no modification. See my video here for a pic of the coyote set with the stock 70W. It's about mid way through the video. The only reason I didn't use the 70W was I wanted the 6speed and factory PCM controlled transmission, and the 6R80 can handle upwards of 800 flywheel HP with no modifications:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hoOJlVbvoT4

[Ltngdrvr]

Al, do you, or will you, have the cruise hooked up and working on the coyote?

I'd like to figure out how to get it working with the steering wheel buttons on my Mustang when the time comes.


Yes. I'm currently working out the details on getting mine wired up, more info on that to come this summer. The Mustang Coyote simply uses the wheel switches/resistors like the Marauder, the key will be the values which i'm currently working on.

So, the cruise is self contained in the pcm, just part of the programming, right? Nothing extra outside, no module or anything like that? Can you go into a little more detail?

[96gt4.6]

Correct.

The Cruise switches are hard wired to the PCM on the Mustang's, on the F150's it's hard wired to the steering wheel control module, which then translates the data and transmits over the MS CAN to the BCM, which then codes it and transmits it over the HS CAN network to the PCM.

So, moral of the story, run a Mustang base OS, and wire your switches directly to the PCM, with the appropriate resistors for each button function. I'm still working on those values.

There are no additional modules. The PCM controls the electronic throttle, and has the VSS inputs and such it needs.

More to come on this as I get it hooked up.

[Ltngdrvr]

So, if using the f150 pcm, I need to run a Mustang base program to make it work directly off the steering wheel switches? And the inputs are at something less than 12v, like maybe 5v, thus requiring the resistors?

[Talal DTR MM]

Thanks for your valuable advise. Actually, I'm planning for aftermarket 4r70w tranny / controller since my car stock transmission 4r75w is not supported by any aftermarket controller.

[Zack]

Thanks for your valuable advise. Actually, I'm planning for aftermarket 4r70w tranny / controller since my car stock transmission 4r75w is not supported by any aftermarket controller.

The controllers are the exact same

[lifespeed]

Very nice looking. Can't wait to see dyno no.s. Your project really helped me a lot in preparing to do swap to my MM. I have question regarding 4R70W tranny, will it fit with coyote engine or not ?

The 6R80 is an impressive transmission with greater strength and of course two more gears compared to the 4R75W. Given that it also integrates with the Coyote PCM the benefits of installing them as a matched set are clear.

[96gt4.6]

Moving along very nicely thus far. Been rather easy for the most part, the MAF curve was slightly off vs. stock Coyote MAF curve, but that was to be expected being as it went from draw through to blow through. So far it's equated to about a 25% change across the board.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MMACaugOMAI

Fuel trims are within 3-5% now. Starts and idles like a stock car again. Boost......feels and sounds very mean on the 'Yote to say the least. More coming on that along with some GoPro video's.

Got it to the scales, didn't gain as much as I had thought!

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160312_205906_zpscsvcfccw.jp g

Looks like around 80lbs total.

Moving along!

[lji372]

Thank you! And yes, I can't wait to meet up with you guys up that way some time! Seems like a really cool crowd!

Got some driving time today, she spools and everything seems to function....that's a relief to say the least. No exhaust leaks, it was a good feeling after all this work.

Now, on to tuning and then it's relaxation time!

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160306_170338_zpsj1deu282.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160306_170400_zpszpkaqsxh.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160306_170405_zpskrtvunwo.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160306_170809_zpstx3ysgjc.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160306_170813_zpsh1ol1vaf.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160306_170819_zpst3xueacc.jp g


Next up, there will be video! Should be hard into tuning next weekend.

:beatnik: very very cool :bows:

[Hachibill]

Very impressed with this build and you sir. Just a couple questions, read most of your thread and didnt see it covered. But how many gears can you select on the 6r with the 4r shifter? Being as i have an 08 p71 with column shifter. I would still like to be able to select and hold gears. And as far as wiring, being as my car is newer with can bus already wouldnt the integration be a little easier?

And being as my car has a boat anchor 2v in it i think it would loose weight with this swap.. I had planned on doing a roots on the 2v, but this seams like money better spent. Plus wrecked 11-13 auto gt's are cheap on copart.

[96gt4.6]

Very impressed with this build and you sir. Just a couple questions, read most of your thread and didnt see it covered. But how many gears can you select on the 6r with the 4r shifter? Being as i have an 08 p71 with column shifter. I would still like to be able to select and hold gears. And as far as wiring, being as my car is newer with can bus already wouldnt the integration be a little easier?

And being as my car has a boat anchor 2v in it i think it would loose weight with this swap.. I had planned on doing a roots on the 2v, but this seams like money better spent. Plus wrecked 11-13 auto gt's are cheap on copart.

I will get a run down on the specifics of the shifter selection pattern next time i'm at the shop. There is a range that is not selectable with the stock shifter. I believe it's manual 1st.

My solution for this is that I change the up/down shift tables in the ECU so I can use the tap up/down shifter function incorporated in the stock ECU to manually select gears and hold them, while keeping the full auto up shift function as well without moving the selector manually. More on this as I progress into that part of the build.

On your car, you are correct. As I have demonstrated over on Crown Vic.net, you can simply tie the CAN BUS +/- wires into the Vic's CAN BUS wires and have a fully functional stock cluster using the Coyote ECU.

Also, I have recently fully Mirror'd my F150 ECU as a Mustang now. There are no side effects. I'm running the Roush base calibration as it's easier to tune boost with. But, as suspected, you can use an F150 ECU with a full on Mustang program, with no hassles. Still progressing with tuning, but progress has been slow due to my hectic schedule lately. HOPEFULLY i'm all up and running very soon! Injectors are in, she idiles and boost great, but had to stop there as I ran out of work time till this coming weekend, if all goes to plan through the week. Hopefully so, i'm getting antsy to get her going! The Coyote sounds amazing under boost, that exhaust note, certainly screams boosted Ford!!

[MarauderMatt200]

will ya hurry up already geez lol

[96gt4.6]

Well, what an interesting weekend, but here we are......finally.....on the cusp of what I set out to achieve from day one. We are eating boost, and everything seems to be functioning great!

The turbo spools fine, i'm able to control boost down to a minute level, and all the hardware appears to work flawlessly. Thing drives like stock again as well, and man i'm glad to finally get her back on the road!

MUCH more coming guys, we're just beginning! On the measly 2.6 psi in this video, with only 13 degrees lead time.....it's faster than it was all motor. Baby steps, but now that I know the how/why and where in the tune to do things, I feel much safer turning up the wick.

Stay tuned!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6a2kYvo7hY

[Turbov6Bryan]

Watched it over and over last night, congrats man

It sounds great when that speedo needle is sweeping quickly!

Somebody is going to need widened wheels and drag radials :)

[8UWITH6]

Congratulations. +1 on widened wheels and drag radials.

[JoeBoomz]

Very impressive what has been accomplished here, and in such short time. Well planned out, well executed, with beautiful results.

Thank you for taking the time to document it so thoroughly.

[Bigslim1]

Sounds great.

[Joe Walsh]

How much boost do you ultimately expect to run on this bad boy...?

Also, any plans for a SNOW Methanol kit for even more (safe) boost/fun!?

[96gt4.6]

Watched it over and over last night, congrats man

It sounds great when that speedo needle is sweeping quickly!

Somebody is going to need widened wheels and drag radials :)

Thank you sir! And yes, it's pretty much at the point of over coming the stock radials at the moment. More on my upcoming tire selection here in the coming weeks.


Congratulations. +1 on widened wheels and drag radials.

Agree, it's becoming very much like the Vic was at this point. Street tires, are pretty much worthless!


Very impressive what has been accomplished here, and in such short time. Well planned out, well executed, with beautiful results.

Thank you for taking the time to document it so thoroughly.

Thank you very much. It's the least I could do to repay the automotive community for all the help I have received, and continue to receive on this project. I wouldn't be where I am now, without the kindness of others helping me in turn.


Sounds great.

Thanks!


How much boost do you ultimately expect to run on this bad boy...?

Also, any plans for a SNOW Methanol kit for even more (safe) boost/fun!?

I plan a maximum of 9-10 psi, which from what I have gathered is about the *safe* limit of the '11-14 Coyote. Granted, on a Coyote that jives out to 650 or so RWHP. Sure, it could probably go higher, but i'm all about safe.....we'll worry about setting records and such at a later date. This car is a street car, and I would really love to enjoy it this summer. With 600 rear wheel, that is more than enough for me for the time being. No plans for Meth. Pump 93 is the most she will ever see unfortunately.

Some small tidbits of video today. Got the GoPro ready, but didn't quite get that far. Just got into playing with the electronic boost controller at the end of the day. Got the initial tuning going on 6psi, and man that is a big difference from what she's at now!

Here's a quick hit. That exhaust note though.....the Coyote certainly commands some respect for it's throat on boost:

https://youtu.be/iDRDIiLagVE

[96gt4.6]

Also got a chance to make sure my ABS relocation held up. This was a panic stop from highway speeds.

Some people like it, some don't. I'm one of the few who do. The computer's ability to regulate and control wheel spin is far better than having no ABS in my opinion.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFO2V57hiVI

no leaks and the system functions like it did pre-relocation.

Did a quick check up after multiple hits and general trial-by-fire this weekend on the old girl:

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160327_144751_zpsmfsxukue.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160327_144226_zpsfgbdt9ir.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160327_144222_zps2ym9odul.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160327_144210_zpssqm26o65.jp g
http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160327_144205_zpsl38ny0tm.jp g

[MOTOWN]

Do you have any plans for a big brake upgrade?

[96gt4.6]

Do you have any plans for a big brake upgrade?

At this time, I do not. The stock braking system, offers more than enough braking capabilities for my needs.

[96gt4.6]

And, just so it's known, my projects are always for sale for the right price. If anyone happens to be interested, shoot me a PM. You might just be surprised at what could happen.

No plans on stopping with the build, or anything of the sort, i'm just never THAT attached to a project.

This next weekend, will yield those videos I have been promising for so long now. Will be moved up to 6 psi, which from the feel of the initial tuning on that boost level, will produce quite the smoke show from a roll on street rubber!

[MOTOWN]

Me likey! me wants!

[MarauderMatt200]

why cant i be beautiful and rich? lol

[Zack]

SOB sold it

[MOTOWN]

SOB sold it

Say it aint so!

[MarauderMatt200]

yup i seen the FB post....the new owner better show us some quarter mile videos lol

[MarauderMatt200]

Say it aint so!

its a goner :( wonder what it went for?

[Black Terror]

Who bought it?

[MOTOWN]

:hide::hide:
its a goner :( wonder what it went for?

[RubberCtyRauder]

More than $8.00 fo sho

[Bad_S55]

SOB sold it

I'd be surprised if it wasn't Jerry...

[lji372]

well that went quick................ grrrrr.........

[MOTOWN]

well that went quick................ grrrrr.........

Gotta be quick around these parts son! Lol

[lifespeed]

No time to enjoy the finished build? Too bad, congrats on a well-engineered swap.

[RubberCtyRauder]

Motown? You? Purchase the coyote turbo?

[MOTOWN]

Motown? You? Purchase the coyote turbo?

Who lil ole me?:P

[96gt4.6]

That FB post literally broke the internet this morning!

It was either a troll post, or for realz ;)

There is more info coming shortly.

[lji372]

i'll buy your next build if it's a 69 mach1 turbo coyote :D

[RubberCtyRauder]

i'll buy your next build if it's a 69 mach1 turbo coyote :D

You'll need to make room in your kids rooms for another. I can adopt Whipple :D

[Zack]

It's either Motown LJ or Chris based on clues

[MOTOWN]

It's either Motown LJ or Chris based on clues

No Español!:banana2:

[CWright]

:popcorn::popcorn::popcorn: :whistle::dunno::D

[RubberCtyRauder]

:popcorn::popcorn::popcorn: :whistle::dunno::D

You'll need to make room for the turbo coyote. :D and then a whippled Road runner

[CWright]

You'll need to make room for the turbo coyote. :D and then a whippled Road runner



:hide::run:

[sailsmen]

I bought it to go with my Jet Powered Marauder.

[1stMerc]

Sho is nice to have large amounts of moola at the ready for such opportunities...

[lifespeed]

It's either Motown LJ or Chris based on clues

Colonel Mustard in the Study with the Candlestick.

[Gryphonzus]

So Chris you making good use of that SB money? If so I claim shotgun.

[CWright]

So Chris you making good use of that SB money? If so I claim shotgun.


I'm shocked he turned it loose.:D

[Turbov6Bryan]

Take it to Louisville!

[MOTOWN]

I need time to mount the 2nd turbo!

[Zack]

I need time to mount the 2nd turbo!

You mean Marty?

[Gryphonzus]

I am not too shocked he did say it could be bought. I will probably be shocked at the sale price though. But it is probably well worth it. Next question is will he mod another one for somebody???

[MOTOWN]

You mean Marty?

Your amusing to say the least! I do my own work as everyone knows , when i initially moved to Atlanta i didn't have the time to get settled, and find time to finish up my project , but whatever.

[Fastbob]

I was really looking forward to driving the short distance to Great Bend to meet Alan and to get a look at the Coyote Marauder, guess that is out of the question now.:(

[8UWITH6]

If one of you southerner's bought it make sure you swing through Kansas City on your way home. ;)

[Vortech347]

SERIOUSLY?!?!?! This has been like watching Scarlett Johannson slowly unzipping shiny black leather only to stop right at the good part.

Wanted to see some in car or track video. Damn it!

[Joe Walsh]

Sold it already??....Darn!

So what's his next build gonna be....a Coyote Focus???

[Fastbob]

SERIOUSLY?!?!?! This has been like watching Scarlett Johannson slowly unzipping shiny black leather only to stop right at the good part.

Wanted to see some in car or track video. Damn it!That is a no s h i t t e r!:mad:

[96gt4.6]

Relax gentleman, this is far from over.

More information to come as things progress.

You haven't seen the end of this, only the beginning.

[sailsmen]

With all the good information you have provided looking forward to you becoming a Vendor.:)

[Zack]

With all the good information you have provided looking forward to you becoming a Vendor.:)

Of What??? :confused::rolleyes:

[lifespeed]

Of What??? :confused::rolleyes:

Pre-fabbed wiring harness?

[sailsmen]

Same services as Mo's or Alternative. I thought he sold it?

[jwibbity]

Same services as Mo's or Alternative. I thought he sold it?

He's not selling a service to anybody. Unless I missed the part where he said he's offering 5.0 swaps :confused::confused:

[Zack]

Pre-fabbed wiring harness?

LMAO you cant pre-fab a harness.

[RubberCtyRauder]

It's just like anyone of us building a marauder and selling it here. Not a vendor

[ChiTownMaraud3r]

Take my money for a coyote and 6r swap. K thanks.

[sailsmen]

"Hi! As many of you know, I'm new to the Forum and Marauder scene. However, I'm not new to hotrodding or modifications. I'm a technician at the Blue Oval dealer by trade and absolutely love my hobby building and racing cars.

A few of you might know me from my last project, a Turbocharged '97 Crown Vic with a 6.0L Chevy motor/trans:.."

"I could never believe why you sold that other car. It was AWESOME."

"The Vic, I got a cash offer on, and well...money talks!"

I think it would be awesome to have him as a vendor building cars that we can buy!

[guspech750]

Too many people on here ***** and moan about the price of a car part being sold or the asking price of a marauder for sale let along a top notch build such as this swap. A lot of cheap skates and only a few who would poney up the money for such cars.

Sent from the White House on tax payers dimes.

[96gt4.6]

To all who have helped, supported and criticized on this swap from beginning to current, I wish to offer my deepest "Thank You". Without the recommendations from you, the advice on some items, and the overall support, this project would never have come to exist, or, perhaps it would have ended with a Turbo Chevy LS swap as originally intended.

As most of you are aware, projects of this magnitude are very time consuming. The scale and scope at which I built this project, while holding a job that pins down 120+ hours, keeping a home life, and still taking time to breathe, amazes me looking back.

It is with a VERY sad heart, that I let this one go. Knowing full well in the fact that I never got to realize it to it's full potential, let alone a few dragstrip passes. However, after doing so many builds I can't even count anymore, time is simply something I've come to cherish more than anything. Although I love my hobby, and everything and all the people I have come to meet through it, I have decided to turn my attention to another prospect for the time being.

That being said, letting this car sit in storage while I do so, was not meant to be, nor something I would let happen, not after coming this far with it.

I was approached, and things transpired in such a manner that ended in this. I rest knowing that the buyer has good plans for the car, and hope that my craftsmanship is to his standards, and holds up to his expectations. I have done my best to illustrate such here on this build thread, and hope the car continues to hold attention as it moves into the final stages of what it's capable of.

I will continue to frequent this forum, and offer help and advice to those whom might request it from time to time. My gift to the community here is this build thread, and all helpful information contained therein. It's up to the new owner to decide if this thread will continue to live, or end here.

Godspeed my friend, and may you continue to live a great life, knowing that in the beginning you were destined to end up at the crusher the day I picked you up from the dealer.

http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q651/Alan_Ledesma/The%20Marauder/20160405_190221_zps8c4hu9wb.jp g

[96gt4.6]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6p5JnRRjG0

[MOTOWN]

:banana2::banana::banana2:

[CWright]

:banana2::banana::banana2:

You tease! :D

[MOTOWN]

You tease! :D

What:confused: , who me?:coolman:

[CWright]

What:confused: , who me?:coolman:

Sleepless nights till it arrives!

[MOTOWN]

Sleepless nights till it arrives!

:snoopy::snoopy::burnout:

[RubberCtyRauder]

Alright spill da beans. Which of youse bought it?

[MOTOWN]

Alright spill da beans. Which of youse bought it?

...................Crickets playa!

[CWright]

...................Crickets playa!

:dunno:


What ever do you mean? :D

[CWright]

Mine's at Mo's, Motown's is getting Paint, and LJ's is still in shop. We had to have something for Louisville!

[LJ on 24's]

:congrats::congrats::congrats: :welcome1:

[Invader]

At least yours made it off the car trailer...[emoji22]http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160406/28c821763b7397ed1432840e350cfa cc.jpg


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[martyo]

At least yours made it off the car trailer...[emoji22]http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160406/28c821763b7397ed1432840e350cfa cc.jpg


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


That happened on a transport?????

[96gt4.6]

That happened on a transport?????

And if it did, doesn't the carrier ask you for the declared amount and/or offer insurance for the shipment in case of this?

[RubberCtyRauder]

And if it did, doesn't the carrier ask you for the declared amount and/or offer insurance for the shipment in case of this?


I don't know what auto carrriers insurance requirements are or provide, some do millions of value.

For example only, common carrier (roadway, etc) standard insurance is $2.50 per pound, additional insurance can be purchased if the declared value is written on the shipping orders

and it sounded like the Dump Truck company is at fault and not the auto carrier

[Invader]

That happened on a transport?????



Yep... [emoji53]

[Invader]

And if it did, doesn't the carrier ask you for the declared amount and/or offer insurance for the shipment in case of this?



Yeah, I'm gathering up receipts as we speak. FHP is still investigating the incident...

[Invader]

I don't know what auto carrriers insurance requirements are or provide, some do millions of value.

For example only, common carrier (roadway, etc) standard insurance is $2.50 per pound, additional insurance can be purchased if the declared value is written on the shipping orders

and it sounded like the Dump Truck company is at fault and not the auto carrier



The dump truck drove off...

[MOTOWN]

The dump truck drove off...

Wow! Even dump trucks riding dirty nowadays:shake:

[RubberCtyRauder]

The dump truck drove off...

And I meant add , sorry for the loss of your project Marauder

[Invader]

And I meant add , sorry for the loss of your project Marauder



Thanks, what doesn't kill us only makes us stronger...

[silversnake]

Yep... [emoji53]



Sucks. I saw first hand how much work/time you put into your project car

[96gt4.6]

That is truly depressing.....I got to thinking about after I had posted about the insurance deal, no amount of money can replace lost time and work. It helps soften the blow, but in the end, man it's still a helluva loss.

I'm sorry that happened to you, and for my insensitivity on the original post.

[96gt4.6]

Looks like her life continues onward, here:

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=101115

[MOTOWN]

Looks like her life continues onward, here:

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=101115

In all honesty you really outdid your self on this build , hats off to you sir this is an awesome example of excellence , the best turbo marauder to date!:bows:

[chief455]

Looks like her life continues onward, here:

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=101115

WOW.
I just put the two threads together. Congrats to Roger, and sorry that after such effort, Alan won't realize the end goal.
Thanks for sharing a great build, and it's in good hands.

[MarauderMatt200]

congrats on this badass Marauder Motown!!

[MarauderMason]

Man oh man, I hope the new owner post some passes. I really would like to do this swap.

[96gt4.6]

In all honesty you really outdid your self on this build , hats off to you sir this is an awesome example of excellence , the best turbo marauder to date!:bows:

Thank You!

I put a lot of time and work into that build, I really did love how it turned out!