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Thread: Potential new Marauder owner? (many questions...)

  1. #1
    TripleTransAm Guest

    Question Potential new Marauder owner? (many questions...)

    Hello all,
    I'm a newly registered member of this board as of about 4 minutes ago. I don't have a Marauder of any generation, but have recently focused on this new model as a potential replacement for my current commuter. I have spent the entire past weekend combing through this entire site and its pictures/articles/links as well as anything else I could find on the 'net.

    First, a quick intro: As one could probably deduce from my user name, I am a Trans Am fanatic and currently own three. Along with this menage à trois I also own a loaded 1998 Civic EX (the Canadian non-VTEC 4-door) . I am a B.Eng with a specialization in Electrical Engineering, married with a 15 month old son who is the light in my life, and have been into cars since the age of 2 (I kid you all not!).

    Right... the reason for me being here: I am very seriously interested in replacing my Civic with the Marauder. OK... when y'all have stopped laughing , I'll tell you why. My Civic is rather boring (although super dependable and very economical and practical) and with thoughts of having more kids, I'm interested in something sturdy and solid (ie. full frame, beefy construction) that isn't an SUV, in order to survive the urban jungle that is our rush hour commutes.
    And to be honest, I love the look and attitude of the Marauder, and I'd rather pay the fuel bills for a classy machine like this than for an SUV.

    My purpose for being here: even though I tried as hard as I could to get as much info through the 'search' function, I still have a few questions that I hope you all can help me with.


    1) I've seen references to a 300A and 300B model. A local dealer has a Marauder 300A with TC, clock, trunk organizer, no heated seats, can't recall if it had the CD changer (I think it did, not sure). This doesn't jive with a description I found in another post. What exactly are 300A and 300B models?

    2) What kind of mileage can one expect from this car when driving in a Grand Marquis sort-of-way? Stupid question, perhaps, but fuel is expensive up here and this car would be intended as a commuter... mostly highway miles, but nonetheless I am curious what real-world numbers one can get (I don't really trust the EPA numbers... I get 33mpg on the highway with my WS6!).

    3) Crash-worthiness... tough one, since I hope none of you have had this misfortune. But with my family to worry about, it's an important point. With most SUVs way over 4500 lbs, my lightweight Civic just isn't going to cut it should one of the psycho soccer moms in my suburb blow a red light when mini-vanning Junior to school a few minutes late. Weight isn't everything, though, and I'm wondering how the Marauder fares in this regard.

    4) I hear complaints of tranny hunting from some Marauder owners. Is this an isolated problem or a characteristic of factory tuning?

    5) build-quality: I know... it's a domestic car. I have lived my entire life around domestic cars, and know what I *should* expect. I'd be leaving behind a dirt-reliable Civic that has cost me $0.00 in the years I've owned it (yes, $0.00) in exchange for a little more 'soul'. I've read a few mishaps on the forums, but is this something that is improving or is it a status-quo with the Canadian plant?

    6) low-end performance: I've read complaints ranging as bad as comparing it to a V6 Sable to being satisfactory for a big car. I've yet to test drive the Marauder but have recently spent a week with a new Town Car and the engine did have the darnedest trouble spinning that one rear wheel. What's the real deal?

    7) Speaking of low-end performance, is this something that can be addressed by a 'chip'? I've seen dyno charts of before/after comparisons, but these are WOT results... do these upgrades actually result in a noticeable improvement at part-throttle and low-throttle driving? Cruising? Any tradeoffs or disadvantages? How about a mileage hit with these 'chips'?

    8) I read a few posts about some unintended acceleration... has this been completely dealt with? Do I still have to worry about this happening?

    9) corrosion-resistance: let's face it, every time I look at my Civic, I get the urge to give it a good lick and break out the Tequila, there's that much salt in use around here during the winter. My family has had brief stints with Ford products over the years and these turned out to be rather unsatisfactory experiences due to premature corrosion (and tranny woes). What's the real deal? I drove past a mid 90's Grand Marquis this evening with perforated front fenders.... isolated mishap?

    10) weight distribution: I've owned several Civics of model years from 1984-1998 and all were well balanced, which is great for winter driving. I've also driven a 1985 Parisienne through many winters and found it too was well balanced. How does the Marauder fare in this area?


    If anyone can provide me with their insights on these questions, I'd really appreciate it. I'm planning on approaching the dealer for a test drive and a serious talk sometime this week, and would appreciate any info that I could use to put him on the spot. All the info I can get from you guys will serve to help me to make a decision on what to do regarding this $$$ purchase.

    Thanks.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    St. Louis, MO
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    39
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    Hmm... I'll give this a shot:

    1) I think your 300A is within "jive." It's probably a transition car. This clock stuff is new to all of us, and heated seats are an OPTION. Look at the fuel door I guess...

    2) GM style, around 21MPG, maybe a little more after break in. MM style, well... I won't tell you, as it may detur you from buying...

    3) Government 5 Star, side air bags. And actually pretty tough. Had a Explorer back into me (for no apparent reason, stupid b****!) when she was 3 days old. I about cried! Came home, and to my avail, after a 45 minute inspection of the fron end, nothing. Guess that liscense plate bracket's good for something! But, in your scenario, I think you'd live.

    4) Not sure what you mean... The reverse issue is a linkage adjustment, which the dealer can do. Not everyone has had this problem though.

    5) I think the quality is pretty good. I look at my buddies 2000 SS (15,000miles), and it's falling apart! My mother has a GM of the same year (18,000miles), and still looks like new, and she never does any kind of dash treatment. I think these cars can stand up pretty good.

    6) For what she is, it's impressive. From what I hear, a chip does wonders. Remember though, wheel spin is not desirable for the professional racer, but she does get second gear scratches and can break loose when hitting passing gear (Trust me, I've done it! ).

    7) From what I hear, the gains are across the board.

    8) Some do it, some don't. I believe the issue is resolved. Fourth had his cable de-rail, which was probably more an error in cable length than it needing to be shielded, because I've heard nothing of another MM doing this. The other guy had a bad fuel regulator I believe? Rare instance, but it happens... That's why there's a warrenty.

    9) If ya take care of it, it'll be fine. Undercoating is pretty much usless for these cars, as there's not anything vital under there that can rust (Although, mine had some sort of run off the dripped on the very back of my tips, like where it welds up, that looks like undercoating. Maybe they do some sort of under coating at the factory now?!?!). Tranny, I kind of doubt there'll be any problems. This is a tried and tested new design. Just ask the Mark VIII guy who have their built up.

    10) I believe it's something around 60/40, maybe closer to 55/45. The all aluminum block helps A LOT!

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Cape Cod, MA
    Posts
    13,676
    Many questions...you weren't foolin'...

    OK, here's what I got (short answers):

    1. No one knows the difference between 300A and 300B...it seems that every one off the line is different, with a different mix of missing parts...
    (he said, only semi-sarcastically)

    2. If you get 33 mpg with a WS6 (!), you're going to be disappointed...you might get 22 with the MM...(maybe a little more if you "GM" it) ...unless we're talking imperial gallons? I don't know the conversion...

    3. The CV/GM is one of the highest-rated for crash-worthiness...actual numbers are available on-line, I'm sure...I don't know them offhand...

    4. Trans is programmed to enter OD w/lockup as quickly as possible (CAFE)...with only light throttle, it unlocks, with a little more, it downshifts...makes it seem like it's hunting... Dennis's chip fixes this completely.

    5. I have no build quality issues with mine, other than the ubiquitous sub-woofer issue...easily solved at dealer...

    6. It's not a stump-puller at the low end...the 4.10 gears will fix this

    7. Dennis's chip will improve part-throttle response, no penalty that I'm aware of...improves shift-points and quality, too

    8. I think only one of us has had unintended acceleration, and his was fixed by the dealer...doesn't seem to be a design flaw or major issue...

    9. Corrosion resistance...can't help you, other than to say we use a fair amount of salt out here, and my '94 T-bird has held up quite well, thank you

    10. 55/45 F/R
    The Blackbird
    Trilogy #61
    Driveway Queen

    The Spruce Goose
    2004 Grand Marquis LS Limited Edition
    Daily Driver

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    St. Louis, MO
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    I don't really trust the EPA numbers... I get 33mpg on the highway with my WS6!
    Damn those GM's and their 6 speed manuals with 2 OD's!

  5. #5
    TripleTransAm Guest
    Thanks, guys...
    I know it was a whopper of an opening post, but you gotta imagine what I'm going through here, sifting through TONS of posts about the different issues and characteristics... it's a tough decision to make.

    The 300A/300B thing had me worried because I want to make sure I get the car I need/want. Similarly, I just came across a post by someone who was glad they did not get TC... it's stuff like this that has me wondering if I will lose out on something if I don't equip the car properly.
    The 'fuel door' comment has me completely baffled... I read a post about this maybe becoming an option, is this what you mean?

    The 33 mpg in my WS6 is US gallons... basically just keeping it at 65-70 mph without cruise-control and just steady-pedalling it. Even the A/C was left on. I understand I won't get near this with the MM, but I'd be happy with 25mpg.
    Honestly. That's what I can squeeze off with my GTA (best of 27 mpg) on totally 100% long-distance highway driving. I have no problem with getting lower than that if I, um, *enjoy* myself a bit.



    Fantastic news about the crash-worthiness... thanks guys! This will make a good selling point for the missus...

    Looks like the chip is the proper way to tackle the tranny shift issues. I am a firm (!) believer in firm shifts, as a way to minimize wear on the clutches and bands. Speaking of which, I'm glad to hear the improvements are across the band. I won't be using this car for drag racing (ahem... in case the wife is reading this) so super-traction is only important to me as far as keeping control of the car. I don't mind losing said control with my permission.


    One more thing... how *tight* is the interior? How long can I expect rattle-free interior components, especially in cold weather? My Civic *finally* produced one interior rattle earlier this week, when temps dropped to -15F (-40F with windchill). Next day, it was warmer and the rattle was gone again.

    Thanks again for all the good info. The only thing worrying me now is the 'content' thing (300A/300B/fuel filler door/clock/etc.).

  6. #6
    TripleTransAm Guest
    Oh, forgot one more thing to ask:

    Looking at pictures and at the MM that was sitting in the snow at the dealership today, I spotted two small white round things on the bottom of the seatbacks in the rear seating area. What are these? They look like small white bulleyes from a distance.

    Consequently, would it be safe to assume the car has 3 child-seat anchors or just 2? I think I spotted 3. (again... another selling point for the missus...)

    Lastly, is there ANYTHING one can do to create some sort of pass-through to the luggage area? My Civic has a fold-down rear seat back (60/40) but I'm sure the type of frame construction of the MM precludes this type of arrangement. However, I've read posts about removing the seatbacks to access the subwoofer, and I'm wondering if something can be done to create a pass-through?

    Thanks again.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    St. Louis, MO
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    One bad thing about newer cars, they're put together with "push-on" everything, so with time, rattles will probably appear. My Dad's 98 F-150 has only managed to show one rattle in the dash after 113,000 miles. Nothing that poping the panel and reinforcing it won't fix.

  8. #8
    WolfeBros Guest
    There are still a ton of 300A's around in most parts.
    I personally would take the remote fuel door and standalone clock and full sized spare over the T/C but that is just me.

    As for tightness.....the car I test drove had a rattle in the dash and one in the rear package shelf. My car seems to be ok so far.....

    I think LML had a rattle in the B pillar. Drive it before you sign for it is my best advice. Jump in the waters fine......you'll love the car.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    St. Louis, MO
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    39
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    Once again...

    1) I think you're talking about the safety seat locator stickers. However, they are not stickers, they're like the iron on thing on the visors. DO NOT try to peal them off!

    2) 3

    3) Not unless you want to cut the body structure out.

  10. #10
    WolfeBros Guest
    Seat pass thru ??? You can put your Civic in this trunk !!

    Actually..... I don't think so, on adding a pass thru that is.

  11. #11
    TripleTransAm Guest
    Originally posted by LincMercLover
    3) Not unless you want to cut the body structure out.

    LOL! That's what I figured, but I figured I'd ask. Right now there isn't any car out there catching my eye that offers me this. Nonetheless, I grew up with large cars not having cargo pass-throughs, and I'll just have to resort to creative cargo loading should I have to transport something long.

    Thanks.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Near Knoxville TN
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    10,720
    More comments:
    1. As far as I can tell, the early ones are 300A and are available only in black, have fullsize spare, remote fuel door release, clock built into dash separate from radio and optional trunk-mounted cd changer and trunk organizer. Heated seats, traction control, or sunroof are not available. The 300B should have standard traction control, optional sunroof and heated seats in addition to the 300A options, and additional colors but a space-saver type spare. The late-breaking news appears to be that the remote fuel door release is gone as well as the clock, which is now integrated with the radio. There may be some 300B's that still have the clock and fuel door release due to overlap during production.

    2. I've gotten as low as 17 on the highway, having fun. I have gotten over 21 on the highway, cruising at 85. I usually average 18-19, combined highway and city.

    3. Very safe.

    4. Most tranny issues are with the "feel" when it shifts. It's apparently one way Ford has improved fuel economy to meet regulations. The chip makes it shift like a normal transmission (Or so I've heard, I haven't bought the chip yet).

    5. Quality issues are generally minor details. Maintenance seems like a bit more expensive than I'm used to. Everybody recommends synthetic or synthetic blend on 3000 mile change schedule. I've always used Castrol dino oil on 5000 mile schedule.

    6. Off the line it's a little disappointing, but once it's moving it'll accelerate like a bat out of he**. I've noticed that it's getting better now that I've got 1500 miles on it. I'll get 4.10's and a chip anyway.

    7. My understanding is it's across-the-board.

    8. Isolated incidents.

    9. Tranny should hold up well, I believe it's the same one used in the CVPI, Lightning, and F250. Rust is an unknown, as this is the first year for some sheetmetal changes at the fenderwells, etc. Hopefully they're sealed up pretty well.

    10. No numbers, but it handles great. Doesn't feel like a 4200 lb car, that's for sure.

    Get one and enjoy it!
    Thanks to Darrin @ BC Automotive:
    $1800 and it was worse than when he started!

    Brian (FordNut) FPG # 1458 of 7838
    03 MM 300A (Lotsa mods, 130k mi) was 303rwhp/318rwtq N/A
    then 476/410 D1SC ProCharged on stock block
    then 660/555 D1SC PC on 5.3 wet sleeved Teksid alum big bore stroker
    then 365/369 N/A on 5.3 wet sleeved Teksid alum big bore stroker
    Now 751/617 3.4L Whipple on 5.3 Boss5.0 iron big bore stroker

    03 MM 300B Silver (Mostly stock, originally wife's car, 370k mi) FPG # 7053 of 7838 or 49 of 417 SB
    03 MM 300B Silver, Stock, wife's next one, 136k mi FPG # 7134 of 7838 or 89 of 417 SB
    04 MM Silver, Stock, on standby 85k mi, FPG # 1212 of 3214 or 432 of 997 SB
    01 F150 longbed
    01 F150 shortbed
    00 F150 4x4 stepside
    01 F150 4x4 7700
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    Mods listed here (some items not current): FordNut's Mods

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
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    TripleTA:

    From what I've heard, the MM is not as common in the Canada as it is here, so you may not have the luxury of many to choose from at the dealers...

    1. Remote fuel door...big fu*#ing deal..you have to go around to the door to put the nozzle in, just flip it open. It's not like you can just pull up to the pump, push the button, and the car fuels itself...although I hear that's a reality in Japan...and if someone really wants to siphon your tank, the remote door won't stop them...

    2. TC...I didn't like it in my T-bird (didn't have a choice) and I'm just as glad I don't have it in the MM...the Traction-Lok does very nicely.

    3. Clock...who cares if it's stand-alone, or in the radio...with the key on, it works either way. (or at least it's supposed to)

    4. Heated seats...that might be nice if it's -15°...

    Please don't take offence at any of the above...my point is that it's a GREAT car, both to look at and to drive...don't sweat the small stuff, if you can find one with any/all of the above goodies, beauty...but don't let that stop you.
    The Blackbird
    Trilogy #61
    Driveway Queen

    The Spruce Goose
    2004 Grand Marquis LS Limited Edition
    Daily Driver

  14. #14
    TripleTransAm Guest
    Originally posted by WolfeBros
    Seat pass thru ??? You can put your Civic in this trunk !!

    ROFLMAO! I have fond memories of the cavernous trunk in the '85 Parisienne (wait a minute... that makes it sound like I've been the target of a mob hit!). The '03 Town Car I spent a week with earlier this month had a fairly big trunk, and I'm wondering if it's the same format/shape as the MM (and GM, and CV, etc.). To the Civic's credit, it does have a fairly big trunk, for the size of vehicle.

  15. #15
    WolfeBros Guest
    BTW.....welcome to the board. IMHO the MM will make you a very nice, safe family car........that you can have a ball with.
    The wife doesnt have to know how fast it is and how much you can still do to improve it even more.

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